Is Catalina as bad as it looks on this board?

ssn637

macrumors 6502
Feb 12, 2009
414
36
Switzerland
Sadly, this is the first time I've tried the newest macOS release and gone back to Mojave.

After a clean installation, I usually copy my base applications from an external drive to the Downloads folder, including any associated files (containers, application support, preferences, etc.) and then paste them all from there to get started. But whenever I tried to copy a program to the Application folder I received an error message in Finder that the operation couldn't be completed! If I copied them from the external drive directly, lo and behold Finder didn't complain.

Then the trouble really started, although I'd say these were minor annoyances that added up to the point where I simply didn't have any more time to deal with them, especially since I couldn't see what Catalina had to offer. I don't have an iPad, so Sidecar isn't a feature I need, and couldn't find any Catalyst applications that interested me. The most annoying of these issues was that I'd lost all my Book purchases, and even though I'd backed them all up they weren't loaded into my Library, so I had to search for each one in the Book Store and download them individually. Later, after I'd customised all the icons to my liking and re-enabled SIP, I couldn't open half of my programs, even with Gate Keeper disabled, with some kind of error message claiming they were "damaged" and needed to be trashed!

I also rely on CrossOver for my 32-bit Windows applications and games, and they won't be releasing an alpha version compatible with Catalina for another month!

Let's wait and see what 10.15.1 brings, shall we?

Edit : On my test machine I was able to solve the problem with applications not opening by disabling SIP in recovery mode, running each program once and then re-enabling SIP again.
 
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Ifti

macrumors 68020
Dec 14, 2010
2,184
392
UK
So it seems those who upgrade are having fewer issues, if any, compared to those who perform a 'clean' install...?
 

ledzep1

macrumors regular
Jan 24, 2016
126
29
How quickly does the next update normally release after the initial release of an OS, in this case 10.15.1

I'm thinking of holding fire, until that iCloud password prompt is fixed, hopefully in the next update.
 
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Sir Ruben

macrumors 68000
Jul 3, 2010
1,612
596
UK
I had a poor experience with the installation which hung on a black spinning wheel screen about halfway through and never moved on. A scary manual reboot resolved the problem and the installation continued. I work in IT and I still dread things like that, so that is a very poor experience for the average customer.

My mouse arrow stuttered around the screen for the first couple of minutes after installation but eventually settled down.

My aerial screensaver (like the one on the Apple TV) would kick in and Catalina would leave me locked in the screensaver with no way back to the desktop - this has somehow resolved itself but still does it occasionally. To be fair this may be because its a 3rd party screensaver.

The Apple Music app (which I was looking forward to) feels...bad? The album art etc seems to load in each time I switch between things (and sometimes doesn't load in at all) leaving me feeling like I am viewing a web page within the app. As an example, it feels like the web based browser version of Apple Music that is currently in beta. In fact that browser version to me felt nicer to use than the app.

I was also looking forward to the photos app (after liking it on iOS13) but again, it just feels off in some way.

My Hue Play Bars which are controlled by the Hue app also seem to be wonky since the update and will often freeze on certain colours and not reflect the content on the screen.

I am withholding judgement for now until I have used it a bit more, I don't want to complain too much as I have lived through the misery of Windows 95, ME, and Vista haha.
 

LeeW

macrumors 6502a
Feb 5, 2017
830
1,133
Glasgow, Scotland
I am withholding judgement for now until I have used it a bit more, I don't want to complain too much as I have lived through the misery of Windows 95, ME, and Vista haha.
Indeed, I would be more worried if this was more of an iterative update however the changes are quite significant, they may not appear that way on the surface.

Currently, I have everything I need back up and running and it seems very smooth. And I do like some of the updates, the quick access to podcasts is great, sidecar is working perfectly and that is the main reason for updating in my case. Time will tell but I am sure the updates will appear soon enough to start fixing and tweaking.

Just odd that the two USB-C to HDMI cables I was using has stopped functioning completely.
 

kemo

macrumors 6502a
Oct 29, 2008
687
72
ProtonVPN
To your question - yea you may or may not experience bugs on daily or even minute/hourly basis - truly depends on your setup (software) you use and your workflow. To be safe - backup everything twice and be prepared to revert back if you need a confident working machine to get you through work days without any hiccups.



Always makes me sad how people are trying to defend such crappy release with comments like "only those who have issues will comment, many others who are without an issue don't".

Way back when I started with Apple as a company - more particularly with Macs, their pride was to be the development machine you dream of (compared to Windows) - no issues, stable OS, months without restart and wake/sleep fast as snap of a finger. That's how I remember my days back running Snow Leopard. I'm pretty confident Steve would give you hell seeing such crappy releases, shame on you!

Lovely times back then. Fast forward to 2019 - to at least get close to such experience you better wait at least half a year before installing newly released OS - and that's what plenty of people will more or less do anyway (after wasting days on installing new OS, experience all the shiny new and BUGGY OS and then reverting back to the previous version).

I myself am from the field of software development (although on the Web) that does not matter - quality software takes time, a lot of time so I understand when the release window is getting closer and it's a mess. There are two ways of solving it - either postpone the release or remove buggy features and release it anyway. They had to release it (as every year) as it goes hand to hand with newly released hardware - and that's what is truly hurting the Apple as a company IMHO.

That is the reason why I'm waiting every single year with upgrades at least on my main development machine because it's for work - not to show my friends how fancy new OS has been released and solving stupid issues and getting distracted on daily basis while working. For example Sidecar sounds great, I would love to use it on daily basis for extra screen space, but experiencing the rest of issues - no thanks.

With that, good luck Apple Dev team. I will check Catalina again in a few months.
 
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Futurix

macrumors 6502
Nov 22, 2011
429
393
London
The only issue I had is that Calculator vanished from Launchpad (it is still in Applications folder and works when launched from there) - and that my custom Launchpad layout was messed up after the upgrade.
 

russell_314

macrumors 6502a
Feb 10, 2019
652
811
USA
There is just a page of people posting issues with new replies every few minutes. Is catalina as bad as it looks form this forum?

I was going to install it but now i am not so sure at all.

Thanks!
You can't go by forums... I have Catalina running and it's perfectly fine. I can't say it's better but perhaps it has security updates. If possible I would recommend some type of backup first. Maybe Time Machine? I didn't do this but don't do as I do LOL

Edit: If it's a work machine that's essential hold off. This is just common practice with any machine that has a critical use.
 

CC88

macrumors regular
Sep 29, 2010
134
17
To be safe - backup everything twice and be prepared to revert back if you need a confident working machine to get you through work days without any hiccups.
More than safe: I didn't touch my production High Sierra disk and TM backup.

I have installed Catalina on my previous Apple ssd disk and I use a dismissed raid for TM.

After few weeks of testing if all will be ok I sure go with Catalina because HS no more support my iOS13 device, the new reminder etc.

Also, sometimes I need to record my screen and yes, although I use iShowU the new screen recording starting from mojave is much more useful.
 

ajaan

macrumors member
Dec 15, 2013
57
14
Perfect on the three Macs in our house 2018 Mac mini, 2017 iMac, 2015 rMBP.

No issues, fast, smooth, stable and all our computers nice, silent, and not taxed by anything -- just the way we like them.

Not seeing any of security prompts that have been all over twitter. Had one for a new install of google drive, and one notification prompt.

Not sure we qualify as power users, but use our Macs for reasonably serious work.

I like this release. 'Feels' rock solid stable.
 
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joelovesapple

macrumors 6502a
Sep 25, 2006
725
32
UK
I have had nothing but problems on my 2015 iMac listed in my signature. I’ve had my first kernel panic in YEARS, it was very very slow to wake from sleep and that’s when I had the panic on that occasion.
Also I had to restart as the fetching album art was chewing up all 32gb of my RAM and when I did, Bluetooth was completely greyed out so I couldn’t do anything.

I waited overnight and all yesterday for the album art to load but not a lot had happened.
I’m not even a power user ffs. I’m reverting back to Mojave as we speak.
 

IowaLynn

macrumors 65816
Feb 22, 2015
1,301
287
Had first k/p on 2015 MacBook (8/256) which did literally scare me to wonder what I got into!

Knock on wood and crossing my fingers has been okay. Was after the forced restart - I think.
Suppose there's a log somewhere that Apple could look at.
 

stillcrazyman

macrumors 68020
Oct 10, 2014
2,428
16,791
In Exile
No issues as of yet on my 2018 MacBook Air or 2018 Mini.

iCloud signed out and back in resolved the nagging prompts. I'm not a 'power user', just a tech enthusiast. Music looks like it might need some tweaking to get better. I have no 32 bit apps, so no issues there.

I have only been running this for a day, so, there might be things that pop up that I haven't experienced.
Overall though, it seems a solid OS and works as I need it to.
 
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Fishrrman

macrumors P6
Feb 20, 2009
17,160
5,520
If one would like to try Catalina, but doesn't want to leave one's self in a bad position if the install doesn't work out, there's a better way (call it "Fishrrman's way"):

Buy a cheap external SATA SSD -- I've seen 120gb SSDs for less than $20.
Buy either a USB3 external 2.5" enclosure, or a USB3/SATA dongle/adapter.
Use disk utility to erase the SSD to APFS.
Install Catalina onto that.
Boot and run that way.

I did exactly what I describe above.

I now have a way to experiment with Catalina without "touching" my internal drive.

I will continue to run this way into the future, because I have a significant collection of 32 bit software (some unreplaceable) that I use on a regular basis.

Actually, this is what I've ALWAYS done with new OS releases -- try them on an external drive before committing myself to installing them on "my main drive".
 

JuicelessMango

macrumors newbie
Nov 11, 2018
26
16
There is just a page of people posting issues with new replies every few minutes. Is catalina as bad as it looks form this forum?

I was going to install it but now i am not so sure at all.

Thanks!

I upgraded last night and had absolutely zero issues. I didn't experience a single bug or issue people had been posting about for the past day or two
 

jerwin

macrumors 68020
Jun 13, 2015
2,454
4,448
That said, for every disatisfied (l)user going on a rant, there are thousands who are just fine and don't have the need to tell the world about it.
Yeah, but 10.14 is also just fine. Why risk upgrading when you could just avoid the potential risks? Catalina needs to bring something to the table to outweigh it's known faults. And... it just doesn't.
 
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petvas

macrumors 601
Jul 20, 2006
4,416
507
Mannheim, Germany
Yeah, but 10.14 is also just fine. Why risk upgrading when you could just avoid the potential risks? Catalina needs to bring something to the table to outweigh it's known faults. And... it just doesn't.
Well, it does bring a lot of new stuff, especially the programming frameworks and the work done for enabling iOS apps to be ported to macOS. Add to that the new Music, Podcasts and TV apps and the new security features. I think that the upgrade does make sense, but of course each individual has to judge for himself.
 
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borgeindergaard

macrumors regular
Sep 13, 2017
201
294
I upgraded my work laptop (2019 MBP 13", i5, 16GB, 256GB) last night.
I have had zero problems. If anything, the login screen and other interface elements seems far more responsive and faster in Catalina than with 10.14.6.

I've had no issues with iCloud. Didn't have to sign out and in again at all, and haven't been prompted for anything really. It just worked. I had one 32-bit app that stopped working, but I was prepared for that.

Actually it seems like I'm getting noticeably better battery life with Catalina than I did with Mojave. I've observed that the wattage usage for doing basic tasks (surfing, writing and editing documents, playing music, copying files, etc) is noticeably less than with Mojave, which improves battery life.
My laptop also feels a lot cooler to the touch, which makes sense if it uses less power to do basic tasks.
 
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xxray

macrumors 6502a
Jul 27, 2013
917
940
I was hesitant to upgrade, but I did so without any issues. I will say that it stutters while scrolling quickly through my list of music in the Music app, which I hope gets resolved over time, but I use Spotify anyways so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I also had an um... outdated version of Final Cut Pro X that I found out I can't keep, which sucks.
 

joelovesapple

macrumors 6502a
Sep 25, 2006
725
32
UK
Yeah, but 10.14 is also just fine. Why risk upgrading when you could just avoid the potential risks? Catalina needs to bring something to the table to outweigh it's known faults. And... it just doesn't.

Yes, it is a total steaming pile of CRAP! I have had nothing but issues.. I'm now using Mojave again and refuse to budge until I absolutely must.