Is it morally questionable (in my cse) to simply download Snow Leopard?

eshroom

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 18, 2006
283
1
I purchased the DVD, I backed it up.

My girlfriend dropped my external on the floor.

Bye bye back-up, hello DVD to make another back-up.

But wait, I cannot find my DVD.

Now I need it again.

I still have the receipt, is it therefore wrong to download another backup from a file-sharing site? And if it's not morally wrong, am I likely to get caught by Apple and accused of piracy anyway?
 

Rhalliwell1

macrumors 6502a
May 22, 2008
588
1
You payed the money you therefore have the right to install it on 1 or up to 5 machines(family pack or not.) It doesn't matter weather its coming off the original DVD, an external hard drive or the internet.
 

plinden

macrumors 68040
Apr 8, 2004
3,968
3
I purchased the DVD, I backed it up.

My girlfriend dropped my external on the floor.

Bye bye back-up, hello DVD to make another back-up.

But wait, I cannot find my DVD.

Now I need it again.

I still have the receipt, is it therefore wrong to download another backup from a file-sharing site? And if it's not morally wrong, am I likely to get caught by Apple and accused of piracy anyway?
I'd just borrow a DVD from another Mac user. I wouldn't trust an OS downloaded from a file sharing site.

Apple's highly unlikely to go after you. However, even if it is a legit download (and in your case getting the OS is probably ethically ok), you're sharing it if it's a torrent. Unless you want be known as a leacher.
 

GGJstudios

macrumors Westmere
May 16, 2008
44,419
767
You payed the money you therefore have the right to install it on 1 or up to 5 machines(family pack or not.) It doesn't matter weather its coming off the original DVD, an external hard drive or the internet.
Actually, it does matter. The appropriate method is to contact Apple for replacement discs. Downloading a pirated copy is not only inappropriate, it's dangerous, as that is how many trojans get installed.
 

Hellhammer

Moderator emeritus
Dec 10, 2008
22,164
581
Finland
It's up to you, do you care about it? Your receipt doesn't make it legal. Apple won't catch you, nor will anyone else. I would just download it as I can't be an angel now, I download almost every day and couldn't care less about "morals", it's so popular nowadays
 

maflynn

Moderator
Staff member
May 3, 2009
66,377
32,977
Boston
What you purchased is the license to use Snow Leopard. Does it matter what medium that license sits on, dvd or downloaded copy?

The act of downloading software isn't piracy. Using software that you do not have a license for is. Since you already paid for it, I see no issues.

With that said, given the price of SL, I'd just drop the 25 bucks and buy a new copy, but that's just me.
 

Rhalliwell1

macrumors 6502a
May 22, 2008
588
1
Actually, it does matter. The appropriate method is to contact Apple for replacement discs. Downloading a pirated copy is not only inappropriate, it's dangerous, as that is how many trojans get installed.
Why is it inappropriate? The issue of trojans is not a moral issue.
 

GGJstudios

macrumors Westmere
May 16, 2008
44,419
767
Why is it inappropriate? The issue of trojans is not a moral issue.
It's inappropriate because you're using pirated software. It's dangerous because you could install a trojan. No one said the issue of trojans is a moral issue. Downloading pirated software, however, is.
The act of downloading software isn't piracy. Using software that you do not have a license for is.
Yes, downloading pirated software IS piracy. You don't even have to use it for it to be considered piracy. Those who have been prosecuted (and I'm not saying the OP would, in this case) were prosecuted for having pirated copies in their possession, whether they used them or not.
With that said, given the price of SL, I'd just drop the 25 bucks and buy a new copy, but that's just me.
I agree this is the best course of action, especially since the OP is concerned about the moral issue.
 

Rhalliwell1

macrumors 6502a
May 22, 2008
588
1
It's inappropriate because you're using pirated software. It's dangerous because you could install a trojan. No one said the issue of trojans is a moral issue. Downloading pirated software, however, is.

Yes, downloading pirated software IS piracy. You don't even have to use it for it to be considered piracy. Those who have been prosecuted (and I'm not saying the OP would, in this case) were prosecuted for having pirated copies in their possession, whether they used them or not.
My view exactly:

What you purchased is the license to use Snow Leopard. Does it matter what medium that license sits on, dvd or downloaded copy?

The act of downloading software isn't piracy. Using software that you do not have a license for is. Since you already paid for it, I see no issues.

With that said, given the price of SL, I'd just drop the 25 bucks and buy a new copy, but that's just me.
I'm not disagreeing the trojan possibility is a risk. However, the OP is asking weather or not it is moral and in my opinion i think it is perfectly moral.

Link to someone being prosecuted when they had a license?
 

Hellhammer

Moderator emeritus
Dec 10, 2008
22,164
581
Finland
It's inappropriate because you're using pirated software. It's dangerous because you could install a trojan. No one said the issue of trojans is a moral issue. Downloading pirated software, however, is.
If you have a license for it, it isn't. Most software developers like Adobe has all their apps available for download in their site, you just need a legit serial. It's a whole new issue if you're cracking it or using without a license. I think Windows 7 is available in MS's site for free download. Sure we can start debating on how immoral it is to support and use torrent sites due your own incautiousness but is here someone who is so sinless that has never downloaded a torrent or used other illegal methods of getting software or other data..
 

r0k

macrumors 68040
Mar 3, 2008
3,610
73
Detroit
I would ask Apple about this. If you have a receipt, especially an email receipt, I would think they would give you another copy or perhaps charge you a fee for a "replacement" cd.

I walked into an Apple store with my iPad dock and a pdf receipt in goodreader on my iPad. They refunded me the $30 for the iPad dock on the spot.

I downloaded a torrent OS X to use for hackintoshing it onto my Acer Aspire One but later deleted it when I ran low on disk space. Now that I have an iPad, I no longer have a desire for an OS X netbook so my tinkering phase is behind me. I wouldn't use a downloaded OS for anything but tinkering. Never for my real machine.
 

bigjnyc

macrumors 603
Apr 10, 2008
6,453
3,589
Call up customer service and explain the situation, if you get a nice rep on the line they might send you a replacement DVD seeing as how you have your receipt.
 

r0k

macrumors 68040
Mar 3, 2008
3,610
73
Detroit
He bought the license, so yes, he is eligible to download the software.
Eligible? Where exactly on apple.com should he get his downloaded copy of OS X? I would say a license entitles you to a remedy that is sanctioned and supported by Apple. This isn't customer-ignoring Microsoft we are talking about here. Apple actually answers their phone and has been known to provide a remedy when an end user has a problem. Why encourage him do deal with software of questionable origins when there is probably a legit solution available?
 

maflynn

Moderator
Staff member
May 3, 2009
66,377
32,977
Boston
Yes, downloading pirated software IS piracy. You don't even have to use it for it to be considered piracy.
Please provide some source material to back up this supposition. since I don't follow the whole piracy/stealing software issue too closely (I don't steal software). This is the first I've heard of this type of response and to be honest it doesn't make sense


I'm not disagreeing the trojan possibility is a risk. However, the OP is asking weather or not it is moral and in my opinion i think it is perfectly moral.

Link to someone being prosecuted when they had a license?
Agreed. He has the license and he has the right to use the software, it shouldn't matter where he got it. (trojan issue aside).
 

Rhalliwell1

macrumors 6502a
May 22, 2008
588
1
Eligible? Where exactly on apple.com should he get his downloaded copy of OS X? I would say a license entitles you to a remedy that is sanctioned and supported by Apple. This isn't customer-ignoring Microsoft we are talking about here. Apple actually answers their phone and has been known to provide a remedy when an end user has a problem. Why encourage him do deal with software of questionable origins when there is probably a legit solution available?
The question: Is it morally sound?
Answer: Based on the fact he has purchased a license, yes it is.

Weather or not file sharing sites are the best solution is a different question.
 

GGJstudios

macrumors Westmere
May 16, 2008
44,419
767
Please provide some source material to back up this supposition. since I don't follow the whole piracy/stealing software issue too closely (I don't steal software).
http://law.jrank.org/pages/5664/Consumer-Software-Piracy.html
The unauthorized use, possession, downloading, duplication, distribution, or sale of copyrighted computer software.
I'm not going to go on and on about this. There are plenty of threads and resources on the web to support this.

The bottom line is, if you ask Apple if it's OK to download a copy from a torrent site, even if you bought the license, they'll tell you no. The fact that a copy is on the torrent site is a violation of the EULA. Downloading it from that source is participating in piracy. Many don't have a problem with that; many do. It is morally questionable. What the OP (or anyone else) chooses to do is up to them.
 

VoR

macrumors 6502a
Sep 8, 2008
917
15
UK
The question: Is it morally sound?
Answer: Based on the fact he has purchased a license, yes it is.

Weather or not file sharing sites are the best solution is a different question.
If it's 'morally sound' as you say, I'd say that downloading osx off 'file sharing sites' is the best solution :)

Compare the hash of an original osx copy with the one you're downloading and you'll know exactly what you're getting - And as with most file sharing, it's super fast and convenient, more so than (imo) than phoning up/visiting a store, selling your soul/proving purchase and possibly paying for a replacement disc.
 

Gregg2

macrumors 603
May 22, 2008
6,009
470
Milwaukee, WI
... is it therefore wrong to download another backup from a file-sharing site?
Doesn't matter if it's right or wrong. It's not a good idea. The people putting those up are running a scam. Don't trust them. Get the real thing, either pay for a new one, or ask for a replacement from Apple.
 

eshroom

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 18, 2006
283
1
Call up customer service and explain the situation, if you get a nice rep on the line they might send you a replacement DVD seeing as how you have your receipt.
I hadn't thought it would be so easy! I just called Apple and the rep was very nice and said I have a new family pack in the post, free! Lovely chap.
 

maflynn

Moderator
Staff member
May 3, 2009
66,377
32,977
Boston
The unauthorized use, possession, downloading, duplication, distribution, or sale of copyrighted computer software.
Except the OP is authorized.

Sorry but I'm still not seeing how him getting a copy of an application that he is authorized to use is piracy. Of course many of the folks who are trying to set these laws also consider people who backup their CDs/DVDs pirates and don't think fair use should ever be considered.
 

lannister80

macrumors 6502
Apr 7, 2009
490
17
Chicagoland
Actually, it does matter. The appropriate method is to contact Apple for replacement discs. Downloading a pirated copy is not only inappropriate, it's dangerous, as that is how many trojans get installed.
That's what checksums are for.

md5 hash for the standard install disk (10.6.0 user edition) = 1d1fb7eca55470143c153f7f902b4ada

If it matches, you're good to go.

You're completely in the moral clear, IMHO. You bought it. Mail Apple the $0.03 it takes to make a new disc if you still feel guilty.
 

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