Is it time for apple to drop intel?

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denizg7

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May 7, 2014
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Is it me or do they have the absolute worst timing in the world?

Whenever they release a processor update to their laptop line , it's the one from last year.

I beleive this is due to the fact that intel released processors and platforms on their own timescale instead of apple's which is completely understandable for intel.

Now after a long long wait, the mac pro is finally out and guess what?

Uses x79 architecture and DDR3 ram..

DDR4 is coming out in 4 months and will be more efficient and in faster speeds..yet the new mac pro which we all waited for will use old tech
 

Nov 28, 2010
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What are you talking about?

All Macs except the Mac mini (which still uses Ivy Bridge chips) and the Mac Pro (which uses Ivy Bridge Xeon chips) use current Haswell chips.

The Mac Pro is a workstation and already a big test bed for Apple, why add potentially new problems with DDR4 RAM?

And what exactly would be alternatives to Intel? AMD? Really?

I know, you just registered here for this thread and probably have an agenda, but please beware.
 

denizg7

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 7, 2014
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What are you talking about?

All Macs except the Mac mini (which still uses Ivy Bridge chips) and the Mac Pro (which uses Ivy Bridge Xeon chips) use current Haswell chips.

The Mac Pro is a workstation and already a big test bed for Apple, why add potentially new problems with DDR4 RAM?

And what exactly would be alternatives to Intel? AMD? Really?

I know, you just registered here for this thread and probably have an agenda, but please beware.
Hmm seems like you don't know much about hardware , that is all right.

Saying why would they bring new problems is kinda like saying why did Apple used new gen sandy bridge instead of the previous year i7s..

DDR4: Runs faster , uses less power , runs more stable at much higher speeds.

Let me know if you can connect these dots. Apple takes a long time to update their mac pros, when it is finally released it's only months away from the new generation of ram.

When apple switched to ddr3 from ddr2 , it was said why would they wanna switch to ddr3 and bring new problems... SAID no one ever.
 

CH12671

macrumors 6502
Dec 29, 2013
350
0
Southern US
DDR4: Runs faster , uses less power , runs more stable at much higher speeds.

Let me know if you can connect these dots.
You know this because you have a machine with DDR4 RAM in it? Or you just google random stuff, sign up for a username, and try to start stuff?
 

grue

macrumors 65816
Nov 14, 2003
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Somewhere.
Is it me or do they have the absolute worst timing in the world?

Whenever they release a processor update to their laptop line , it's the one from last year.

I beleive this is due to the fact that intel released processors and platforms on their own timescale instead of apple's which is completely understandable for intel.

Now after a long long wait, the mac pro is finally out and guess what?

Uses x79 architecture and DDR3 ram..

DDR4 is coming out in 4 months and will be more efficient and in faster speeds..yet the new mac pro which we all waited for will use old tech
Wait, you're surprised that a long-running development project used technology that isn't from the future?
 

denizg7

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 7, 2014
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You know this because you have a machine with DDR4 RAM in it? Or you just google random stuff, sign up for a username, and try to start stuff?
Geez I did not think there were so many hardware illiterate people on these forums. Well below are some information , which by the way you could find out on your own too but haven't.

Pretty interesting to find people try to find an excuse to why ddr4 would be bad. I wonder where you all where when ddr3 was adopted by apple , oh wait it got adopted at the right time so you couldn't whine about it bringing new problems.

Truth is every new generation of intel processors and platforms during the last decade have brought more stability , lower voltage uses at more power then the previous gen


"Its primary benefits compared to DDR3, are that it includes faster clock frequencies and data transfer rates. It supports 2133–4266 MT/s (million transfers per second) compared to DDR3's 800 to 2133 MT/s[6][7][8] and lower voltage (1.05–1.2 V for DDR4,[7] compared to 1.2–1.65 V for DDR3)"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDR4_SDRAM


Here is some more info http://www.crucial.com/promo/ddr4.aspx

http://www.maximumpc.com/crucial_starts_sampling_ddr4_memory_server_applications_2014
 
Nov 28, 2010
22,668
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Saying why would they bring new problems is kinda like saying why did Apple used new gen sandy bridge instead of the previous year i7s..
Can you explain that bit a little bit more please? I just want to get a good laugh out of you, before you get bumped by everyone else.

Or is that too much for this message board?

PS: In other words, Apple should have waited almost another six months to release the new Mac Pro to the public just to include new DDR4 RAM instead of getting a working model out now and having the upgraded Mac Pros in 2014 or 2015 get that new RAM thing? Sorry, I do not know that much about fluid storage.
 

denizg7

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 7, 2014
2
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Wait, you're surprised that a long-running development project used technology that isn't from the future?
Nope , sorry something coming out 3 months later is not really future , it's something coming out real soon and it's real.

If you actually calculate the number of years apple has waited to redesign it's mac pro and bring out a new one , and the same time compare the 3-4 month period of a new ram , you will see how silly your question is.
 
Nov 28, 2010
22,668
27
located
Nope , sorry something coming out 3 months later is not really future , it's something coming out real soon and it's real.

If you actually calculate the number of years apple has waited to redesign it's mac pro and bring out a new one , and the same time compare the 3-4 month period of a new ram , you will see how silly your question is.
And you just registered to tell us that? Do you even own an Apple product or are interested in getting one? Or do you just want to get some laurels for that gnome society appreciation board committee meeting?
 

denizg7

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 7, 2014
2
0
Can you explain that bit a little bit more please? I just want to get a good laugh out of you, before you get bumped by everyone else.

Or is that too much for this message board?

PS: In other words, Apple should have waited almost another six months to release the new Mac Pro to the public just to include new DDR4 RAM instead of getting a working model out now and having the upgraded Mac Pros in 2014 or 2015 get that new RAM thing? Sorry, I do not know that much about fluid storage.
the original replier said ddr4 would bring new problems. That's kinda like saying apple's switch to ddr3 or new gen i7s would have brought new problems. If you actually read the entire thread , and see not what i am just replying , but to what i am replying , it will make a lot of sense. Unless if you have short term memory. Also "ram thing" really? That hardware illiterate? Proves my previous point. DDR4 is not compatible with previous gen intel platforms. and DDR4 x99 platform will be out in 2014 not 2015 (STM)

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And you just registered to tell us that? Do you even own an Apple product or are interested in getting one? Or do you just want to get some laurels for that gnome society appreciation board committee meeting?
Nope read original post. Talking mainly about apple's bad timing on not adopting DDR4 when it will be more stable when it is months away from release , (run lower voltages , higher speeds . read previous reply on links also)
 

grue

macrumors 65816
Nov 14, 2003
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Nope , sorry something coming out 3 months later is not really future , it's something coming out real soon and it's real.

If you actually calculate the number of years apple has waited to redesign it's mac pro and bring out a new one , and the same time compare the 3-4 month period of a new ram , you will see how silly your question is.
Maybe this is just the craziest suggestion of all time, but apple could just… oh my god I can't believe I'm typing this… update the computer :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

Or, yeah, they could have just delayed the release for another year to use DDR4.

Tell me, which would piss off more people: Not having a Mac Pro to sell, or not having it use cutting-edge memory tech that all of six people who are ACTUALLY IN THE TARGET MARKET give a damn about?
 

denizg7

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 7, 2014
2
0
Maybe this is just the craziest suggestion of all time, but apple could just… oh my god I can't believe I'm typing this… update the computer :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

Or, yeah, they could have just delayed the release for another year to use DDR4.

Tell me, which would piss off more people: Not having a Mac Pro to sell, or not having it use cutting-edge memory tech that all of six people who are ACTUALLY IN THE TARGET MARKET give a damn about?
check out my reply to simsaladimbamba. I talk about how DDR4 is being released 3-4 months from now in the year 2014 not 2015 , and since mac pros were already delayed for years , a couple of month wait (max 4) is not a crucial difference if it adopts the newest ,fasterand most efficient platform.
 
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grue

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Nov 14, 2003
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check out my reply to simsaladimbamba. I talk about how DDR4 is being released 3-4 months from now in the year 2014 not 2015 , and since mac pros were already delayed for years , a couple of month wait (max 4) is not a crucial difference if it adopts the newest ,fasterand most efficient platform.
The long line of customers trying to buy the current model disagree with you.

It's clear you are thinking from the point of view of an edge case tech nerd, not the point of view of a person running a business that either uses this sort of hardware, or a business that produces this sort of hardware.
 

CptSky

macrumors regular
Feb 1, 2013
140
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Nope , sorry something coming out 3 months later is not really future , it's something coming out real soon and it's real.

If you actually calculate the number of years apple has waited to redesign it's mac pro and bring out a new one , and the same time compare the 3-4 month period of a new ram , you will see how silly your question is.
Well Xeon E5 v2 processors don't support DDR4 if I'm not wrong, so maybe DDR4 is coming in few months (would still be stupid to delay a lot more the Mac Pro as it wasn't available in several countries for months and was already outdated), but which processors would you use to support it ? From what I'm aware of, Xeon E5 v2 processors are the latest ones and Xeon E5 v3 will not be released soon...

So, you would have postponed by at least another year the release of the Mac Pro (which is up-to-date based on the current technology), only to get DDR4 ? Meh, why not waiting for PCIe 4.0 with Skylake ? You can always wait for future technology...
 

denizg7

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 7, 2014
2
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The long line of customers trying to buy the current model disagree with you.

It's clear you are thinking from the point of view of an edge case tech nerd, not the point of view of a person running a business that either uses this sort of hardware, or a business that produces this sort of hardware.
that's the point. Apple used to not be a business first like IBM. USed to make me dream of the future

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Well Xeon E5 v2 processors don't support DDR4 if I'm not wrong, so maybe DDR4 is coming in few months (would still be stupid to delay a lot more the Mac Pro as it wasn't available in several countries for months and was already outdated), but which processors would you use to support it ? From what I'm aware of, Xeon E5 v2 processors are the latest ones and Xeon E5 v3 will not be released soon...

So, you would have postponed by at least another year the release of the Mac Pro (which is up-to-date based on the current technology), only to get DDR4 ? Meh, why not waiting for PCIe 4.0 with Skylake ? You can always wait for future technology...
My original reply" check out my reply to simsaladimbamba. I talk about how DDR4 is being released 3-4 months from now in the year 2014 not 2015 , and since mac pros were already delayed for years , a couple of month wait (max 4) is not a crucial difference if it adopts the newest ,fasterand most efficient platform."

Mac Pro was already delayed for years. 4 months would have been worth it compared to the YEARS wait , if it adopted the next gen
 
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grue

macrumors 65816
Nov 14, 2003
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Listen, I know where you're coming from, but the fact of the matter is that the COST of doing things the way you suggest outweighs the BENEFIT of doing so. Apple is a business that exists for the purpose of making money, and their decisions need to reflect that. The customers who truly care about hardware on this specific of a level are generally the sperglords on forums like this, making threads like yours. They're not the ones making purchasing decisions on hardware for companies. The people making those decisions are people like me, who don't make go/no-go decisions based on emotion, but on cold logic.

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Mac Pro was already delayed for years. 4 months would have been worth it compared to the YEARS wait , if it adopted the next gen
I'm guessing you don't have much experience in hardware development. It simply doesn't work that way.
 
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denizg7

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 7, 2014
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Listen, I know where you're coming from, but the fact of the matter is that the COST of doing things the way you suggest outweighs the BENEFIT of doing so. Apple is a business that exists for the purpose of making money, and their decisions need to reflect that. The customers who truly care about hardware on this specific of a level are generally the sperglords on forums like this, making threads like yours. They're not the ones making purchasing decisions on hardware for companies. The people making those decisions are people like me, who don't make go/no-go decisions based on emotion, but on cold logic.
You are right. It just sucks Apple turned into another IBM. USed to be marketed at the "think different "crowd and stuff like the first iPod really made me dream of the future when we still used fat cd players that held 12 songs.
 
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grue

macrumors 65816
Nov 14, 2003
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You are right. It just sucks Apple turned into another IBM. USed to be marketed at the "think different "crowd and stuff like the first iPod really made me dream of the future when we still used fat cd players that held 12 songs.

There's always the opportunity for the next Apple to begin.
 

denizg7

macrumors newbie
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May 7, 2014
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I'm guessing you don't have much experience in hardware development. It simply doesn't work that way.
yes it does. Do you really think when intel announces new chipsets or processors , and then the manufacturer's get to build it? Nope manufacturer's work hand in hand with intel to meet it's requirement a 9 -12 months ahead of schedule to announcing to public.
 
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thekev

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Aug 5, 2010
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My original reply" check out my reply to simsaladimbamba. I talk about how DDR4 is being released 3-4 months from now in the year 2014 not 2015 , and since mac pros were already delayed for years , a couple of month wait (max 4) is not a crucial difference if it adopts the newest ,fasterand most efficient platform."

Mac Pro was already delayed for years. 4 months would have been worth it compared to the YEARS wait , if it adopted the next gen
Congratulations on your trolling account, and don't try to deny the obvious. For what it's worth the first Xeon EP chips to support DDR4 will be Haswell EP chips. It will still be some time before those are shipping in volume. If they decide to update it around the one year mark, you'll see Haswell Xeons and DDR4. There's no reason to skip that generation, as the chipset won't see any real changes with the Broadwell version. Beyond that nothing offered by ARM's designs as of today offers a suitable replacement. If you saw such a thing it would really come from the notebooks and filter up from there. They make up the bulk of Apple's sales and run on the most stringent power requirements.
 

denizg7

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 7, 2014
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There's always the opportunity for the next Apple to begin.
Considering how Apple kept mac pros a long consistent line , and even when they announced they would switch to intel they gave a 2 period time , I doubt that. Mac Pros won't see ddr4 for 2 1/2 years I am afraid. DDR4 doesn't work with x79 architecture.

Hopefully by the time new mac pros come out ddr won't die, which is 4-5 years from now.

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Congratulations on your trolling account, and don't try to deny the obvious. For what it's worth the first Xeon EP chips to support DDR4 will be Haswell EP chips. It will still be some time before those are shipping in volume. If they decide to update it around the one year mark, you'll see Haswell Xeons and DDR4. There's no reason to skip that generation, as the chipset won't see any real changes with the Broadwell version. Beyond that nothing offered by ARM's designs as of today offers a suitable replacement. If you saw such a thing it would really come from the notebooks and filter up from there. They make up the bulk of Apple's sales and run on the most stringent power requirements.
not trolling x99 is compatible with ddr4 not the current haswell chips packed with macs. But the mac book pros will adopt ddr4 earlier than mac pros , hence it sucks for the mac pros , and my original point about timing.
 

Thunderbird

macrumors 6502a
Dec 25, 2005
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Upon launch DDR4 will be no faster than DDR3. It will take a year or two for the clockspeeds on DDR4 to go up, and the price to come down.
 

Designer Dale

macrumors 68040
Mar 25, 2009
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The really ridiculous thing is that a new guy is baiting a hook with an idiot worm like "Apple needs new RAM" and posters with up to 11 years in this forum are actually biting...

Just sayin'

OP: Insulting users is a violation of general forum rules. Please read the FAQ if you can find it.

Dale
 

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