Islamist ideology and enhanced interrogation techniques

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Galacticos, Mar 15, 2017.

  1. Galacticos, Mar 15, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2017

    Galacticos macrumors 6502a

    Galacticos

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    #1
    I think anybody afforded the protection given by brave servants like James Mitchell should see this and understand the psychology of Islamists and Islamic terrorists. He offers a unique insight.



    I guarantee if you start this you will not stop it
     
  2. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #2
    Can we correct the thread title to use torture instead of the rebranded "enhanced interrogation"?
     
  3. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #3
    Who is a terrorist? Whomever the govt sees fit. Careful with what you support. Govt might decide you are a terrorist and torture your ass
     
  4. Galacticos thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Galacticos

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    #4
    i think if you look at what the west calls enhanced interrogation (or torture) and compare it to ANY other culture, no matter what you call it, it's mild in comparison..

    I think the broader question is do you believe that there is no allowable method of coercing somebody who has either murdered (and therefore waived others rights) or has information that would put lives at risk?
     
  5. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #5
    apply it to whites/Christians............still feel the same? funny you seemingly think people who have murdered have waived their rights :rolleyes: I support vigilantism as long as the vigilante gets his due process :p
     
  6. Galacticos thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Galacticos

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    #6
    Are you suggesting the US government intentionally or even negligently goes around accusing people of being terrorists without a shred of credible evidence or rational cause for suspicion?
     
  7. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #7
    Being accused of murder does not waive your rights, not under the constitution.

    We've hanged people for waterboarding, so lets stop pretending we're not torturing people.


    We crushed a detainees 10 year old son's testicles in front of him in order to try to force him to talk. Stop believing in the fairy tales that we're doing nothing wrong, it's *********. Documented *********.
     
  8. oneMadRssn macrumors 68040

    oneMadRssn

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    #8
    So our human rights violations are better than their human rights violations? Can you really measure atrocities like that? Mild, medium, spicy? How about, just not torturing people? That seems like a good policy.

    Yes, there is no allowable method of coercing somebody to give information. Primarily because coerced information is totally unreliable. Second, because torturing is bad.

    I'd rather have a story full of holes but where what I do know is reliable; than a complete story which is unreliable.

    Also, in terms of getting information, countless studies and real-world experiences have shown that befriending or bribery are way more effective than violence or drugs. So the question I ask is this: do you want good information from these people?

    Also, I disagree that the act of murder automatically results in a waiver of rights. That's total BS.
     
  9. vrDrew macrumors 65816

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    #9
    Uh, no.

    Nobody in their right mind is going to sit through an hour-long conservative talk show to find out what your xxxing point is.

    If you have something to say: Say it.
     
  10. Galacticos thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Galacticos

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    #10
    I think you should watch the interview. You let me know if there are any Christians who have a similar ideology, and if they posed that kind of threat, of course I would.

    I don't like how we afford the nth degree of human rights to people who murder innocents. There's an obvious irony to that
     
  11. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #11
    I don't give a flying ****, one thing that should land morons at the top in jail is violating the constitution , Bush/Obama/Trump should be prisoners are GITMO. U.S citizens have RIGHTS, if we can't respect that then we are no better than POS countries ruled by dictators.
     
  12. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #12
    Yes. For instance, the FBI now allows defining climate change activists as "eco-terrorists."

    Many "Ag-gag" bills throughout the country are being used by companies to charge people who expose the awful and unsanitary conditions our food supply is based on as terrorism. http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/07/us/taping-of-farm-cruelty-is-becoming-the-crime.html

    So maybe, just maybe, we can stop pretending that this country isn't using "terrorism" as a guise to crack down people trying to point out wrongdoing.
     
  13. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #13
    I think you missed the point of the constitution. hate sounding like Steve here but plenty of "Christians" kill in the U.S.
     
  14. Galacticos thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Galacticos

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    #14
    No the whole purpose of the eit is to get information that prevents further loss of life. The book talks about numerous instances where eit led to prevention of attacks.

    I didn't say murder automatically results in waiver of rights.. I said the suspect/murderer has afforded their victims NO rights
     
  15. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #15
    beat someone long enough they will tell you whatever you want to hear.
    http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/culturebox/2009/05/there_are_four_lights.html
     
  16. Galacticos thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Galacticos

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    #16
    Why not? Just start it and if ou don't want to keep going after 5-10 mins, don't. I think you will
     
  17. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #17
    no thanks.............got a feeling your "views" would change once the GOVT started expanding who they would "interrogate"
    [​IMG]
     
  18. Galacticos thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Galacticos

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    #18
    I think it's best to use the plain meaning of words. It sounds like the term terrorism is doing work it shouldn't be doing in those instances
     
  19. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #19
    @ the underlined, yes he violated the murder victims rights by killing them. In what backwards ass prehistoric country do you wish to live in that means that act causes the accused to lose their rights? Wtf is a right to you?

    @ the italicized, great, nowhere has that lie ever been used in the recent past to "legitimize" atrocious violations of people's rights.

    OP, do you want to live in an authoritarian state? It seems like you do.
    --- Post Merged, Mar 15, 2017 ---
    Is crushing a child's testicles in front of his father to get his father to talk torture or not to you? I ask because that's what America did. Period. On the ****ing record.

    How's that for plain meaning?
     
  20. Galacticos thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Galacticos

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    #20
    Give James Mitchell's book or the interview a go. I'm not advocating endless beatings. The techniques used were primarily based on social influence.
    --- Post Merged, Mar 15, 2017 ---
    The government could by your reckoning be interrogating those people right now and they aren't. There seems to be a really low expectation of the people working for the CIA etc..

    You really equate Isis to people waving a confederate flag?
     
  21. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #21
    Asking again looking for a response:

    Is crushing a child's testicles in front of his father to get his father to talk torture or not to you? I ask because that's what America did. Period. On the ****ing record.


    You realize you're posting an entire thread based on an interview with the guy that actually set up the torture program right (made tens of millions of dollars in doing so)? You're citing a torturer who is giving his support for torture as the evidence as to why torture should be allowed. He's trying to revive his image. This ******* should be sitting trial in the Hague, not spreading propaganda you're awfully willing to listen to for some reason.

    Should we ask Bernie Madoff why ponzi schemes are no big deal?
     
  22. tshrimp, Mar 15, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2017

    tshrimp macrumors 6502

    tshrimp

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    #22
    We know that there is many people of all religions, races, etc that kill in the US. Is there really an issue more with Christians than others?

    FYI...You don't sound like Steve at all. Your comment did not start out with.... Those F$%^& Christians. They cause all of the worlds @#$% issues. They should be censored, so we don't ever have to hear their rhetoric again.

    Edit: I could not watch the video as I am at work, so if I make any statements that are strange (or at least stranger than usual) I apologize ahead of time, as I will be making assumptions based on only the posts themselves.
     
  23. Galacticos thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Galacticos

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    #23
    I didn't say he should lose his rights.. I'm saying. There should be something that we can do in order to obtain information that might prevent further attacks.

    I want to live in a state that has a means of obtaining information about planned attacks. Doesn't seem like a lot to want.

    Ok what James Mitchell talks about Is very different to crushing a child's testicle. That is terrible. James Mitchell is talking predominantly about social influence with minimal water boarding.

    Watch the video or read his book and if after that you think he's evil fine. But don't make your mind up without at least hearing what happened
     
  24. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #24
    James Mitchell claimed he personally waterboarded KSM. Why in the **** am I going to read his book? He took $81 million to set up the US torture program.

    James Mitchell was the architect of the US torture program. Why you would cite him for anything is beyond me. He's trying to revive his image, clearly, and therefore will never be honest about what he's done and what his program did. That child I mentioned? That's on him, it's on GWB, and it's on America. Period.
     
  25. Galacticos thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Galacticos

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    #25
    Ok for some reason you believe he did this for money and to torture people..

    My take on it is he saw what happened on 9/11 and thought that he wanted to do something to prevent an incident like that happening again. Frankly people that do things to prevent these attacks are the reason why people like you are able to criticise them. There's a shocking lack of understanding and as usual the criticism comes with perfect 20/20 hindsight.
     

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