It wouldn't happen in the private sector: Prayers at meetings

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by niuniu, Feb 18, 2012.

  1. niuniu, Feb 18, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2012

    niuniu macrumors 68020

    niuniu

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    #1
    Councillors in a legal battle to get back their right to pray at council meetings. Eric Pickles fast tracking a bit if legislation he thinks can overturn a High Court ruling.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17082136

    What exactly is the purpose of praying at a meeting except consuming time? I'm hoping that the court finds this Localism Act isn't interpreted to give them the right to bring their sun worshipping or sacrificial offerings or prayers or any other nonsense anywhere near a council meeting. They're supposed to be working, on our taxes.

    The whole thing started when an ex-councillor complained as praying was part of the formal agenda at council meetings in Devon.
     
  2. iJohnHenry macrumors P6

    iJohnHenry

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    #2
    I think I would like to see them do a Korean exorcism, as in the old M*A*S*H episode.

    I found that quite colourful, and entertaining, and who knows, maybe it actually works? ;)
     
  3. likemyorbs macrumors 68000

    likemyorbs

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    #3
    Yay this means there are religious nuts in the UK too!!! My fellow Americans, we're not alone!
     
  4. firestarter, Feb 18, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2012

    firestarter macrumors 603

    firestarter

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    #4
    This is an idiotic move.

    Theists represent almost exactly 50% of the population, and that proportion is decreasing generation on generation.

    Cameron, Warsi and Pickles are dead wrong on this issue. Cameron gave a great speech last year on 'muscular liberalism'... the biggest threat to which is fundie theists.

    Hopefully the National Secular Society will be able to overturn this too.
     
  5. iStudentUK macrumors 65816

    iStudentUK

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    #5
    The UK is a kind of quasi-theocracy. Our head of state is also 'defender of the faith' and head of the Church of England. But our laws aren't based on a holy text and religious freedom is guaranteed. It's mostly legacy from centuries ago, and most of it is fortunately ceremonial. However, there are Anglican Bishops in the House of Lords, but they have little influence.
     
  6. niuniu thread starter macrumors 68020

    niuniu

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    #6
    Cameron's not a big believer in the separation of church and state..


    Was about a month ago when he said that. Threw up in my mouth a little.
     
  7. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #7
    Just worth a repeat mention: I'm (unfortunately) used to seeing meetings begin with a short prayer, but I was astonished to see Ohio Gov. Kasich's recent "State of the State" speech -- before a joint session of the Ohio House and Senate -- begin with someone singing "How Great Thou Art". I mean, WTF? Did they take communion later too?


    Cotton or polyester? ;)
     
  8. iStudentUK macrumors 65816

    iStudentUK

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    #8
    It's crazy because all the High Court said was they can't put prayers on the agenda, but if some councillors want to do so themselves before the meeting starts they can. That makes total sense to me.
     
  9. firestarter macrumors 603

    firestarter

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    #9
    Corrected! :rolleyes:

    (Damn you, Lion!)
     
  10. Happybunny macrumors 68000

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    #10
    These are the kind of things that have to be nipped in bud, very quickly other wise they can spread.
     
  11. sk1wbw Suspended

    sk1wbw

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    #11
    Many people say the same thing about Athiests and their warpath against Christians. They need to be nipped in the bud.

    Sorry, but there is no such thing as separation of church and state. The First Amendment says nothing of the sort. The freedom of religion part of that amendment prevents the government from establishing a national religion and forcing, by law or otherwise, that people follow that religion. It's the antithesis of that Sharia Law, which is practiced by the Muslims and their prophet.

    Just because someone wants to say a prayer, it doesn't give people the right to sue to make them not have the right to prayer.
     
  12. niuniu thread starter macrumors 68020

    niuniu

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    #12
    Pray to GI Joe all you want. Just don't make it part of the work meeting agenda. Do it in the toilet or outside the back at lunchtime.

    It's ridiculous people think they can start talking to invisible men during work, and have it legally enforced as a right.

    Shows you how we're still very much in the dark ages in that respect. Freeze me and wake me up in 1000 years.
     
  13. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #13
    Yes, there is. And the supreme court has ruled that there is many, many times.
     
  14. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #14
    In the US yes. Not so in the UK.

    Btw your thread title is very very wrong. It does happen in the private sector quite often. I work at a public company that had pray at its meetings as part of the agenda and no the company was not part of any religious organizations. I know of several others like that as well.

    Problem you run into with laws banning pray at public meetings is in many ways it infringes on the rights of religious beliefs of the people in the meeting. Public meeting does not mean the public is involved in the meeting. It just means they can be their and listen to what is going on. So it should be up the council members to decide and if they have no issue with it and want it then it should be with in their right to do so.
     
  15. niuniu thread starter macrumors 68020

    niuniu

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    #15
    I'd love to see examples of private companies where prayer makes it onto the meeting agenda. It happens often like you say so I'm sure you can give plenty of examples considering the 100's of 1000's of private company meetings that take place daily.
     
  16. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #16
    sorry that I do not have a copy of the meeting minutes as I was laid off from it a few years ago. As I said I know of a few that do it off hand. Mind you the higher ups at said companies are rather religious

    Most public meetings would not have it either. It would be the minority.
     
  17. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #17
    I actually have no problem with this as long as its kept short and reasonable. Obviously, it becomes an issue if council is using its paid time to conduct prayer or other religious activities outside of its remit. I can see issues arising if one of the council is say a Satanist and another a Christian or if the council is multi-faith and each insists on taking their turn. This would simply be a waste of council time and therefore of taxpayers money. BTW, the UK does not follow the US constitution or any of its amendments.
     
  18. firestarter macrumors 603

    firestarter

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    #18
    It's completely unnecessary. What on earth are you praying for?

    It's also exclusionary to anyone that doesn't share your faith. That's absolutely unacceptable for a government office.

    If I were a satanist, would I be allowed to ritually sacrifice a chicken before each meeting?
     
  19. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #19
    As I said, there could be issues arising with some objecting. I have often stood silently by while members of my family did their funny little incantations, it only takes a second and we can move on. Its when it begins to intrude on the work getting done that it becomes an issue for me but if its only a few seconds and makes someone happy, then fine.
     
  20. niuniu thread starter macrumors 68020

    niuniu

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    #20
    Why does it need to be done at a meeting? Can I get a moment to play with my Lego? That brings me happiness...
     
  21. iJohnHenry macrumors P6

    iJohnHenry

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    #21
    Quaaludes also bring peace of mind.

    Everyone should be forced to take one at the start of every meeting.
     
  22. firestarter macrumors 603

    firestarter

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    #22
    Maybe atheists need to find some ritual that they can do, that's more annoying than prayers.

     
  23. iJohnHenry macrumors P6

    iJohnHenry

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    #23
    What an excellent idea you have there Doctor. :D

    YouTube: video
     
  24. firestarter macrumors 603

    firestarter

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    Oh yes - I'm up for that!

    (Only problem is that it's too cool to be annoying).
     
  25. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #25
    And this again points back to the people on the counsel (the only ones who matter) have an issue with it.

    Public meetings just means the public can be their and listen. It does not mean they are allowed to partake in it directly so why should push their belief on the counsel members?
     

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