Jeb Bush talking w/ Trump rivals (because...?)

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by LizKat, Mar 9, 2016.

  1. LizKat macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #1

    Jeb Bush, weighing an endorsement in the Republican primary, will meet with each of Donald Trump's rivals in the final days leading up to the Florida primary.

    The former Florida governor, who left the race last month, is planning to meet with Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio, and John Kasich in the immediate days ahead.

    So is he really just talking about endorsing one of them, or is he trying to persuade them to throw in behind one of them to derail Trump ?

    Why should they listen to him?

    Does he hope by endorsing one of his former rivals, his own former supporters will come out and vote and not stay home? Why would they vote for Cruz or Rubio if they didn't want a farther right guy to begin with? Only voting for Kasich would probably appeal to Jeb fans at this point. I'm not sure Jeb is that fond of Kasich. I don't think they see eye to eye on Common Core, for instance.
     
  2. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #2
    Jeb's endorsement is as useless as Ms. Fiorina's, who endorsed Cruz. They ****ing deserve each other.
     
  3. thewap macrumors demi-god

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  4. LizKat thread starter macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #4
    He must be trying to justify the expenditure of all that money his donors coughed up... trying to see if he can at least get them something besides Drumpf!
     
  5. chown33 macrumors 604

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    #5
    Maybe he's jockeying for position. Consider: "I'll throw my support and funding your way, if you agree to support me for the VP slot on your ticket".
     
  6. LizKat thread starter macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #6
    Whole thing is starting to remind me of T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men.

    Remember the 2nd epigraph, "a penny for the Old Guy" -- supposedly a reference to the collection by British kids of money for the fireworks on the night of Guy Fawkes Day every year.

    Of these GOP candidates, I just wouldn't be able to pick which effigy to burn, they all strike me as having less than constructive ideas.

    Anyway also remember the end of that poem

    This is the way the world ends
    This is the way the world ends
    This is the way the world ends
    Not with a bang but a whimper
    .
    A lot of whimpering going on as that huge GOP field narrows down in 2016.
     
  7. Jess13 Suspended

    Jess13

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    #7
    Because the Bush Crime Family is running scared: Trump could really win and become POTUS. Trump has recently stated numerous times that he will declassify the 28 pages (and expose the Bushes):




    Rep. Walter Jones (R-NC)
    3:05 “The Bush people do not want it released.”

    4:51 “This report came out when President Bush was President of the United States, his administration reviewed the report, he’s the one that recommended that the 28 pages be classified. It was President Bush, remember that, because that’s very important. And I can’t say a whole lot more than what I’ve said, Stephen’s said or Thomas has said (because it’s still classified), but, quite frankly, remember who was the President of the United States when this report came out, and remember, that THAT president decided to classify the 28 pages.
     
  8. Meister Suspended

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    #8
    Wow.
    That sounds like an awesome offer :p:D:D
     
  9. LizKat thread starter macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #9
    Heh, well... personally I think Jeb Bush is just trying to figure out whom to endorse. He should look like he's not wasted the establishment money that was donated to him. So he's meeting with these candidates to see which to get behind. It might not be his endorsement that means something to them but the money from those donors could mean a lot.

    ===

    About that whole 28 pages thing... the country has given up so much of its civil liberties and freedoms since 9/11 that we might as well have read the damn 28 pages by now.

    Write out your worst 28 pages scenario. Do another one, worse than that. Can't top it with anything worse? OK take that one. Then what should be the citizens' reaction and the ful Congressional reaction to your 28 page revelations?

    I mean it's possible to wallow in being angry and scared, and even more angry and scared, you know? You can binge-watch dystopian movies all weekend until nothing even fazes you any more, even while part of you is afraid to go to the kitchen for some snacks.

    However, it's not possible to subtract more freedoms than we even have as a further reaction to our supposedly being more and more angry and scared.

    Once all our freedoms are gone and we live in militarized zones and all our money is invested in walls and locks and missiles and drones and boats and helicopters and assassination rounds, that's it. Cupboard's bare. We're not even scared any more, what's the point. They can't get blood out of a stone.

    Let them keep their 28 pages. There's certainly more allure to them now than if we know what's in them. And anyway we still have a FEW freedoms. Probably once we all read the 28 pages, Congress would go ballistic in rage and fear over our newfound knowledge, and we the people would have nothing left by time they simmered down again.

    Sorry to be simultaneously such a cynic and such a sunny optimist. See I think we've already bottomed out on anger and fear and there's no place to go but up.
     
  10. Jess13 Suspended

    Jess13

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    #10

    The 28 pages are limited in scope, from limited Congressional investigation that was routinely blocked by the Bush administration (read Intelligence Matters). If the 28 pages had been made immediately public in late 2002, there would never have been the Iraq war: would have hit Saudi Arabia instead and one major front in the supposed “War on Terror” would have been won over a decade ago. Instead it is less freedoms and an endless “War on Terror,” trillions wasted, thousands of dead service members and millions of foreigners killed, and the persons (some, but not all) who helped make 9/11 happen still free and participating in Obama’s current war crimes and terrorism in Syria (read new NYT piece on Obama and CIA with Saudis arming terrorists in Syria). Those who have read the 28 pages and demand it be immediately declassified and made public, say YOU deserve to know what it says, including saying that the 28 pages contain some of the best intelligence we have to prevent another 9/11 and to significantly win the “War on Terror.”

    Trump hates the Bush Crime Family; Jeb is on Bush Crime Family mission, running scared.
     
  11. FieldingMellish Suspended

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    #11
    Something to revere about true centrist Trump. 28 pages with which Democrats could achieve orgasm.
     
  12. LizKat thread starter macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #12
    As long as we insist on cuddling up with fossil fuels for energy we are not going to divorce our best friend and ally the ever lovin' Saudis and their zillion princelings. There's too much money for all those oligarchies in oil & gas and their supportive industries plus the military machine and its supportive industries, all those jobs that if lost we don't yet know how to replace them because it's easier to order another couple trillion bucks' worth of airplanes or ships or whatever.

    So the price of that is the wars we got into and will keep getting into. The 28 pages, the swell intelligence, if you think whatever it is has not been made use of already, think again. That it's classified from general availability does not mean it has not been put to use somewhere, for whatever it was worth.

    To me it's just one more useless thing that people use as some sort of ideological hammer when they get bored or annoyed. I could not care less about it. I cannot see how its existence or nonexistence, knowledge released or withheld solves any of the long list of domestic tasks we have and yet keep so far back on the stove in the USA.

    Looking forward to all-solar USA and seeing what the unintended consequences really are, so we can fix the ones that aren't great and celebrate the rest.
     
  13. Jess13, Mar 10, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2016

    Jess13 Suspended

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    #13
    Tell me, did you watch that ‘Trump Will Declassify The 28 Pages’? You should.
     
  14. LizKat thread starter macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #14
    The wrangle over releasing or not releasing the info is old news, although the matter has become a cottage industry by now and resurfaces periodically. It’s too bad that people sometimes focus on it anew and for other than any putative value of the information. I dislike anyone’s hammering on it. Trump’s not the first, will not be the last.

    My inclination: let it go, get on with life. To remain suspended in willingness to be outraged all over again cannot be healthy for the families who lost loved ones in the 9/11 attacks, or for us as a country.

    We have a symbiotic relationship with the Saudis, and it’s part and parcel of our military industrial complex. Jobs, trade, protection, corruption. It’s no secret to them or to us that their monarchy is propped up by a combination of dependence on us for protection and on their doling out money to the radical Wahabi clerics to overlook the ongoing US “infidel” presence in the kingdom.

    It doesn’t seem a great improvement so far for them to be doing more of their own military adventures under the new King, does it.

    Disentanglement will be slow and certainly depends on our unilateral will to leave fossil fuels behind in the future.

    When we become willing to convert to renewable energy then we can work on what to do with our workforce that now depends so heavily on our involvement in the geopolitics of fossil fuels.

    That’s the thing the country needs to get focused on with respect to Saudia Arabia: while we still love oil and gas, we cannot tell them sayonara even if we loathe the mutual dependencies we’ve fostered.

    Since the Saudis depend on our protection of their repressive regime, they cannot tell us sayonara either, much as they too may loathe everything about the arrangement except for the fact their heads are still attached to their vertebrae.

    In the meantime we remain two countries entangled despite some deep and perhaps irreconcilable differences. Diplomatic relationships to elide these to mutual benefit are necessary evils. Releasing info that was pegged as wildly speculative and unverifiable wouldn’t seem to aid continuance of our symbiotic arrangements.
     
  15. Jess13, Mar 10, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2016

    Jess13 Suspended

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    #15
    First, you didn’t answer the question. So I’ll presume that to be a no. If that is correct, you have no right to dismissively talk about the 28 pages because you have no idea what it is that you’re replying to and dismissing. Second, if you watch that (and other 28 pages press conferences), it is THE FAMILIES demanding that this be immediately declassified so they can hold accountable persons who helped murder their loved ones. Watch 9/11 family members crying while pleading for Obama to keep his promises and declassify, instead of protecting Bushes and al-Qaeda like the traitor he is.

    Watch it.

     
  16. aaronvan Suspended

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  17. FieldingMellish Suspended

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    #17
    Meanwhile Julien Assange was knighted by the left for releasing a whole lot more than 28 pages.
     
  18. Jess13, Mar 10, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2016

    Jess13 Suspended

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    #18

    His name is Julian and he has been exposing the Obama administration repeatedly, he was instrumental in helping spirit Edward Snowden out of Hong Kong and to relative safety (Snowden who has shown that Obama is illegally spying on 100,000,000+ Americans daily). Julian has been targeted by Obama with threat of life in prison if captured. You should be lionizing him instead of attempting to denigrate. Julian has been routinely exposing this anti-Most Transparent fraud:

    8 Whistleblowers Charged With Violating the Espionage Act Under Obama

    http://mic.com/articles/50459/8-whistleblowers-charged-with-violating-the-espionage-act-under-obama

    Obama has targeted and prosecuted more whistleblowers than all previous presidents in U.S. history combined x 2. Obama is the first president to prosecute a black whistleblower (Jeffrey Sterling).

    Obama claimed to want transparency. His actions suggest the opposite

    http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...a-transparency-foia-bipartisan-reform-stopped

     
  19. LizKat thread starter macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #19
    To the extent some other considerations (my own valuable time, my own obligations, for instance) don't severely hamper me from doing so, I will not usually condemn something without looking into it, if not AT IT.

    On the other hand I sometimes make exceptions when I believe someone's just trying to make political hay off someone else's experiences, including someone else's sorrows.

    In this case I had bothered to watch it. So my posts were additionally informed by my utter disgust at Trump and/or his supporters who produced the thing.
     
  20. Jess13, Mar 10, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2016

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    #20
    FYI: I made it.

    And it stars primarily Congressmen who have read the 28 pages, and 9/11 families and survivors. Those Congressmen say ALL Americans deserve to know what is in the 28 pages. Obama promised leading 9/11 family members to their faces he would declassify it, that was promises to Kristen Breitweiser in early 2009 and Bill Doyle in September 2011. Those leading family members BOTH demand that it be immediately declassified. It is March 2016 and the 28 pages remain hidden.

    Trump stated numerous times the past month: he will declassify the 28 pages and give Americans, 9/11 families and survivors the truth (because Obama is too much of a lying coward to do so).
     
  21. yg17 macrumors G5

    yg17

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    #21
    He's going to endorse the highest bidder - whoever can offer the highest cabinet position or VP will get it.
     
  22. LizKat thread starter macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #22
    For my money those 28 pages can rot in redaction and classification. I've already laid out my arguments on why the information's value is from zero to harmful. You disagree, and by the way I think you could make that point without calling the President a lying coward.

    I don't know his reasons for having decided to delay release of the information and neither do you. If I had to guess, I would say he has come to a conclusion that the downside is still currently greater than the upside, for the country and for the 9/11 families. It's his call. If Trump wins and feels like releasing the info, so be it. That would be on him.

    When I vote for a President I vote for someone to represent my country's interests in this world. I voted twice for Obama. I am not sorry, even though I have often enough been disappointed at some of the compromises the Democrats have had to make during his tenure in a really polarized time. On balance I'd vote for him again given the same circumstances that he, we and the country have faced in these times. He's made a lot of tough calls. I may not have agreed with all of them but I'd never think to call him a coward.
     
  23. Jess13 Suspended

    Jess13

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    #23
    Obama is protecting the Bushes and al-Qaeda co-conspirators re: 9/11, this after promising leading 9/11 family members to their faces he would declassify the 28 pages. Obama’s a lying coward.
     
  24. LizKat thread starter macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #24
    I think the thread viewers saw that go by their eyes the first time. Repeating it doesn't make it different or new.
    --- Post Merged, Mar 10, 2016 ---
    Jeb Bush would probably enjoy being Secretary of Education (Common Core, the sequel?) but his party keeps promising to delete that and a bunch of other agencies...
     
  25. thewap macrumors demi-god

    thewap

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    #25
    The most transparent presidency that is Obama.. the kool-aid flows freely in the US these days.

    Might help people understand why the attacks on Trump by both parties and all media has been unprecedented in American history, and why good old Jeb quit right after Trump challenged him with the 9/11 question.
     

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