Katy Perry kisses a man who didn't want to....so sexual assault?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by dukebound85, Mar 15, 2018.

  1. dukebound85 macrumors P6

    dukebound85

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2005
    Location:
    5045 feet above sea level
  2. Foggydog macrumors 6502

    Foggydog

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2014
    Location:
    Left Coast
    #2
    I hate to say this, but what’s good for the goose is good for the gander. With that said, that guy is such a prude to think that it was anything but just a simple kiss. And at 20 having never been kissed, I’m seriously worried for his future. Just saying. On the other hand, I’ll never remember him in 5 minutes.
     
  3. tkermit macrumors 68040

    tkermit

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2004
    #3
  4. Mac'nCheese Suspended

    Mac'nCheese

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2010
    #4
    Look at the way this kid was dressed. He was totally asking for it.
     
  5. LizKat macrumors 601

    LizKat

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2004
    Location:
    Catskill Mountains
    #5
    It's not a construct I'd agree with for a lot of reasons, but there are conservative families whose kids pledge to refrain from any sexual contact including romantic kissing until marriage. Let's leave aside probabilities for a moment, and how unfortunate the results can be if "something happens" and neither of the couple has thought to assure safe sex and birth control. That leaves just the teenager's personal choice, no matter if inspired by cultural or religious influences. I think that kid was just completely flummoxed by Perry's behavior and didn't know what the hell to do. I'm sure he always thought he'd kiss the girl he wants to marry when the time comes. That it would be his choice.. not that of a TV show host.

    Perry was out of line. She can't be unaware of where the kid might have been coming from. It may have been a long time ago but she was raised in church and crossed over to secular music from gospel singing. It's one thing if you change your mind about stuff as an adult. It's only your own mind you get to change on a whim though. Trying to change someone else's mind can be costly. This gig should cost her at least some moments of reflection. As someone known to be supportive of LGBT rights and children's needs, she should stay more mindful in her public roles of when she might be violating other people's rights to form and hold their own beliefs.
     
  6. bopajuice Suspended

    bopajuice

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2016
    Location:
    Dark side of the moon
    #6
    Dude wants to get into the music business and was shocked by a kiss? Please....
     
  7. ThisBougieLife macrumors 68000

    ThisBougieLife

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2016
    Location:
    SF Bay Area, California
    #7
    A statement from him:

    “Hi everyone, I would like to clear a few things up for anyone who is confused, concerned, or angry. I am not complaining about the kiss from Katy Perry at all, doing a few news reports and being interviewed by many different reporters has caused some major questions. The way certain articles are worded is not done by me, and my true intentions are not accurately represented in every article you read about the situation. I am not complaining about the kiss, I am very honored and thankful to have been apart of American Idol. The main purpose for the show is to find stars and new music artist. I do wish I would have performed better in the moment. I should have picked another song to sing and calmed myself down regardless of the kiss. I should have been able to perform under pressure. I do not think I was sexually harassed by Katy Perry and I am thankful for the judges comments and critiques. I was uncomfortable in a sense of how I have never been kissed before and was not expecting it. My main goal is to reach people through the universal love of music and not cause strife or anger against anyone or about any situation! Please take into consideration that I don’t believe my views have been appropriately communicated through the media! Thank you to everyone who has followed me in this journey and I hope I answered a few questions”

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainme...-on-surprise-katy-perry-kiss-i-wasnt-harassed

    This is a situation where the kiss was unexpected and not solicited and the person who received it does not see it as harassment (per his public statements). I generally refrain from telling people how to feel. If he doesn't feel he was harassed or assaulted, I'm not going to insist that he was. But in terms of evaluating Katy Perry's actions, it should be clear that if the genders had been swapped, yet that attitudes were the same, there should be no difference. Katy Perry is a famous person who feels that people should be honored to be kissed by her, unwanted or not, and that she can get away with it because of who she is (remind you of someone?). And that's an unacceptable attitude.

    I was given a "surprise" kiss by someone at a party once. I did not ask for it or know that it was coming. I also do not consider myself to have been assaulted or harassed and I don't feel any ill toward the person who did it. So of course if you force-kiss someone there's a chance they won't feel violated by it, but that doesn't mean the action itself is permissible. It's something people shouldn't be doing, man or woman, famous or not. And if we are going to punish men who do this to women (regardless of the woman's attitude toward what was done), the women who do the same thing should be punished in the same way. A standard is worthless if it's double.
     
  8. dukebound85 thread starter macrumors P6

    dukebound85

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2005
    Location:
    5045 feet above sea level
    #8
    And here I am amazed at the irony displayed here. If it was a 33 year old man kissing a 20 year old girl by surprise and against her wishes, the reaction would be different....metoo only applies one way?
     
  9. fitshaced macrumors 68000

    fitshaced

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2011
    #9
    I agree that it is treated differently. But why is it treated differently? I don’t actually know why. I see nothing wrong with her kissing him, albeit unprofessional. But I guess it’s different for a woman because of the usual physical power a man has over a woman. It’s less threatening for a woman to do it. Plus, guys generally are ‘up for it’. Woman are generally more selective.
     
  10. Snoopy4 macrumors 6502a

    Snoopy4

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2014
    #10
    I’d be offended. She looks butch now. LOL
     
  11. Tomorrow macrumors 604

    Tomorrow

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2008
    Location:
    Always a day away
    #11
    Well, yeah. It does only apply one way.

    We can like it or hate it, but the reality is that there is a double standard when it comes to stuff like this, no doubt about it. A woman can jump onto a baseball field and grab the butt of every player on the field and she gets a slap on the wrist; if a guy did it to a bunch of female athletes he'd be on the sex offender's registry. A 27-year-old teacher has sex with a 16-year-old student - like it or not, we're going to see it differently depending on whether it was a male teacher and a female student, or vice versa.

    And for the most part, I'm okay with that.

    Katy Perry probably shouldn't get a pass, but in my mind she probably should come closer to getting a pass than someone would if the gender roles were reversed here. Just my opinion.
     
  12. LizKat macrumors 601

    LizKat

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2004
    Location:
    Catskill Mountains
    #12
    Benjamin Glaze had already said to one of the judges that he hadn't yet been in a relationship and "can't kiss a girl without being in a relationship." He was auditioning in a contest. Katy Perry was a judge. Their situations were not equal. She stood up after he said that and told him "Come here. Come here right now."

    Right there she was setting up to cross the line, never mind when she high fived it with her fellow judges after she managed to kiss him on the lips despite his attempt to get past the moment by kissing her on the cheek. Meanwhile he was about to compete in something she would judge him for? She had just assailed one of his personal lifestyle choices, on videotape.

    Imagine being asked to come kiss the judge before you take that dive off the high board at a competition. Imagine if you're a girl. How is it different if you're a boy? How is it different if it's the music industry?

    It doesn't matter to me that he has apparently managed to "work it through" with friends afterwards, now saying well it wasn't a romantic involvement so it doesn't count. Good on him for being able to put it in perspective but that does not excuse Katy Perry's behavior. She owes him more of an apology than half-acknowledging she may have disrupted his heart rate before his performance, no matter how he himself chooses to rationalize her behavior after the fact of his (terrible) audition.
     
  13. alex2792 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2009
  14. tkukoc macrumors 65816

    tkukoc

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2014
    Location:
    Wish I Was In Space!
    #14
    Boy if people took music and American Idol as serious as this situation they'd actually put out quality musicians. People always getting bent out of shape for things that were clearly setup for.. wait for it.. A TV SHOW! If you even think this stuff is real then you need to reevaluate your own life. TV isn't real life kiddos.. slap REALITY on it and people believe everything and anything that happens. You think this situation wasn't scripted.. guess you guys never watched Idol in the past.
     
  15. tkermit macrumors 68040

    tkermit

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2004
    #15
    For some reason I think he'll get over it...
     
  16. LizKat macrumors 601

    LizKat

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2004
    Location:
    Catskill Mountains
    #16
    Most likely. He already says he got over it, whether completely the case or not. The point is that there was something to recover from which he should not have had to endure.


    It doesn't matter. The show is not presented as a fictional drama and the arguments hare are not in the same context as say our lengthy PRSI thread about the merits (or, not) of the song lyrics of Baby It's Cold Outside.

    The show is presented as a contest, so by definition there are unequals involved between contestants and those who will judge their performances. The situation under discussion is wholly contemporary in its context (since after all we do have people of assorted beliefs and cultures in our society today who do defer or attempt to defer sexual contact until marriage or at least serious courtship). And we do have situations in our society where unwanted sexual contact is considered harassment, most often when the participants' personal situations vis a vis each other are deemed unequal, i.e. one person has more power or perceived power than the other.

    The suggestion that Perry presented to viewers of a American entertainment contest was that it's OK for a judge to command a contestant to come over and get a kiss before his performance. This after some banter with another judge during which the contestant indicated he had never been kissed and could not kiss someone without being in a relationship. Perry persisted, and prevailed. The kid blew his audition. Whether he might have done better absent that incident, who knows. He'd just had a personal lifestyle choice tampered with by someone about to judge his performance of music. Clearly Glaze was not comfortable with what happened at that time, and clearly Perry had overstepped appropriate boundaries.

    If #metoo is to have credibility we can't go around excusing pop stars who abuse power because "it's only entertainment"... or worse, "it's only entertainment and anyway she's just a woman so how could she be abusing a guy?" The whole #metoo movement erupted over abuse by powerful people in the entertainment world, whether classical music, news and politics, dance, or... yeah, some music contest on a TV show in which a power abuser happened to be a woman.

    If the show was a standup schtick or a skit from SNL that would be different. Satire is satire. That is not what went down on that show, jokey ambience notwithstanding. That was Katy Perry deciding to show a kid from the sticks that he's just a hick and it was way past time for him to get kissed (regardless of his wishes). She knew where he was coming from. She emerged from a cultural background where his stated belief was and still is quite prevalent. If by word or deed she wants to make politically tinged statements about how archaic that lifestyle is, fine, let her do it in an appropriate venue. That was not it by any stretch of imagination.
     
  17. obeygiant macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Location:
    totally cool
    #17
    I guess if it was one of the male judges and they did the same thing to a young girl there would be a very different reaction. I think the double standard is kind of build into society. Females can get away with a little bit more than a male can.
     
  18. tkukoc macrumors 65816

    tkukoc

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2014
    Location:
    Wish I Was In Space!
    #18
    Again, thanks for proving my point. You're taking things way way out of context and way to seriously. But to each his own, enjoy your life I hope you find some peace in it.
     
  19. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2007
    Location:
    Colorado
    #19
    Very well said. It is unfortunate that so many people are willing to shrug off what Perry did, but would be throwing a hissy fit if the genders were reversed.
     
  20. Huntn macrumors P6

    Huntn

    Joined:
    May 5, 2008
    Location:
    The Misty Mountains
    #20
    “I wanted to save it for my first relationship. I wanted it to be special,” Glaze, now 20, told the Times.

    Hmm. It was not right what Katy Perry did, while my male libido screams loser, which is not really fair. I’m working on it. :oops:
     
  21. alex2792 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2009
    #21
    Katy Perry is clearly a sexual predator who took advantage of her position of power to prey on a defenseless young boy!
     
  22. obeygiant macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Location:
    totally cool
    #22

    Good, suppress that dominant inner male voice, let your beta male come forward. Gooood. :D
     
  23. LizKat macrumors 601

    LizKat

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2004
    Location:
    Catskill Mountains
    #23
    I would not go that far. She did abuse power. I believe her motivation was mostly political in the sense of a personal backlash against a culture from which she has chosen to depart. It may have been spontaneous, not premeditated. But she was wrong in not acknowledging error immediately.

    As for us, left to wonder how much it matters: dismissing incidents of abuse by women in power can be seen as just another instance of subscribing to the notion that women's place in society is inferior and therefore their behavior is always somewhat trivial.

    If women are second class citizens then whatever power they have was granted to them by the patriarchy and whatever wrong they may have done, hey, how much can it matter, just consider the inferior source and then let it go, right? (and maybe next time stick to male judges? is that the punchline down the road?)

    Uh, no. We have a long way to go yet on actualizing equality, but we're way, way past anything like that. If we are to continue working towards equality then we have to be equally cognizant of duty to avoid hypocrisy in considering any abuses of power.
     
  24. BeeGood macrumors 68000

    BeeGood

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2013
    Location:
    Lot 23E. Somewhere in Georgia.
    #24
    Bingo.

    I honestly don’t understand why some segments of society insist on refusing to acknowledge that men and women are different.
     
  25. alex2792 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2009
    #25

    *liberal hat on*

    I agree, this is clearly an issue of intersectionality of the patriarchy, matriarchy, white supremacy and islamaphobia.

    *liberal hat off*
     

Share This Page

148 March 15, 2018