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Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by citizenzen, May 22, 2013.
Seems like a really odd form of terrorism ... killing just one person.
Isn't this just murder?
1 dead 2 injured.
His last 11 tweets about it, he was there at the incident.
There's a clip of one of the asailants too (warning, hes got blood on his knives and hands, some may find that a bit distressing?) hence its a link rather than embed.
Going by the insane babbling, it could very well be politically motivated.
That makes it terrorism, I guess. I dunno.
Depends on the motive, no?
Yeah that was my thought, this seems to be a politically/racially/religiously aggravated murder. Let's not give these guys the (perceived) kudos of being terrorists - even the PM is coming back from a visit to Belgium and France early! I say just charge them with murder and then lock them up for life.
When he says 'our lands', giving a diatribe with blood on his hands and holding a murder weapon, he seems mentally ill or maybe whacked out on some mind-bending gear. He's not a recent immigrant, nor is he a member of any large ethnic community that has strong ties to the British Muslim community, like Pakistanis or Somalis for instance.
Judging by the accent, seems like he's an Afro-Carribean Londoner. Bit weird. I could be wrong, but judging from their actions in not escaping and having conversations with bystanders, don't discount mania, schizophrenia or something similar.
The apparent murderer in the video is not blessed with an overabundance of neurons. If tried and found guilty, I hope he enjoys jail.
If indeed it does turn out to be a terrorist attack, I think that you will find that the men will be very recent converts to Islam, and have been radicalized in the last few months.
It could easily be a terrorist act committed by a mentally unstable person. If so, quite possibly prodded into action by others.
Terrorism is just a crime with a political motive.
People's opinions on this will differ, but I tend to understand terrorism to mean organised groups with long-standing political grievances and motives, like Al Qaeda, the IRA or ETA. Not some nutter appropriating whatever comes into their head or what they've picked up from the web, committing murder, then standing around discussing it with passerbys until the police turn up.
True. Unless we agree on the definition of terrorism, views will vary widely. I tend to think if you are committing violent crimes with a motive to advance a political idea or objective, you're a terrorist.
Of course, I also don't believe just because you consider it terrorism that you suddenly get to throw out the rule book when it comes to interrogation and detention.
Someone may be claiming they are politically motivated, but just be a nutter too. We just need to wait and see at this point.
I do not want to side line the thread but it is already well on it's way to being a terrorist attack. The worlds media has put the head lines out there.
In all these articles David Cameron is reported to have stated that he feels it is a terrorist act.
That alone kind of makes it a terrorist action.
No, it doesn't. It's a knee jerk reaction. Cameron's knees are notoriously jerky.
David Cameron is a twat. What's more, given his political problems, he's bound to leap on anything that makes him look like a strong leader. Blair would have done the same.
If anyone here wants to dance around semantics and get their knickers in a twist by calling it a terrorist act, as if it bears any resemblance to any number of atrocities and incidents we've seen since the 70s, then be my guest. All the aircraft highjackings, Baader-Meinhof, ETA, the IRA, Tamil Tigers, the bombing of PanAm 103... even you as a Dutch guy should remember the Moluccan train highjackers. Those are genuine terrorists.
There have been machete killings in public here in London before, some in the past few years. Seems to me that the people getting anxious about this and have a desire to connect dots are blowing this somewhat out of proportion.
Looks like Cameron may have a touch of Benghazi fever.
That's what comes of over-Eton.
I have no idea if David Cameron is a twat or not, I leave that up to your expert opinion.
I am also not talking about the reality of whether this is a terrorist attack or not, but in the world of instant media perception is far more important than it used to be. Given that the world's media have already labelled it as a terrorist attack the chances are they will only report facts that support this.
This attack reminds me more of Mohammed Bouyeri murder of Theo van Gogh . One mans actions like this are the nightmare scenario of every security force.
It was an act designed to induce terror and make a political statement; in this case the statement included the defence of Islam (Islamic lands). Islam is a political and religious ideology, the two are inseparable.
They probably are mentally unstable; after all, many cultures where Islam is prevalent have a habit of consanguinity.
This is my impression as well.
It seems like a very hasty conclusion to me.
I don't get all the naysayers here...
It was a beheading in the name of Islam...sounds like terrorism to me.
Didn't you get the memo? Islam is a religion of peace so there are a thousand other reasons why this was done in the name of Islam.
These are obviously recent converts who misunderstood their irenic religion, second in peace only to buddhism itself.
Even though it could pass as a terrorist attack, i'm more interested in how it actually unfolded. They go after someone on the street, brutally cut him to bits, then speak with journalists and spectators, trying to get people to film/pictures without harming them until the cops arrive.
I guess they felt this approach would have more impact than just killing everyone in their sight until the cops sorted them out.
Sounds like their motivation was retaliation.
A meat cleaver is a machete?