Longhorn FAQs...And I am not impresssed

Mechcozmo

macrumors 603
Original poster
Jul 17, 2004
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Longhorn info, but some really good stuff from the VP of MicroSoft.

Longhorn FAQs


I love this quote:

Microsoft's VP said:
"I should not care about location when I save," says Microsoft VP Chris Jones. "Why can't I just click on my computer and it shows me my documents? It is a computer. It should know what a document is, what I have edited and annotated, what I have searched for before, and what other places I have looked for documents. It is not just documents on my computer I am looking for. It is documents I care about."
Honestly, havn't Macs had this since 10.0? Documents folder for the documents, Pictures folder for the pictures.............And new in Tiger: Spotlight!
 

grapes911

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Jul 28, 2003
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Mechcozmo said:
Honestly, havn't Macs had this since 10.0? Documents folder for the documents, Pictures folder for the pictures.............And new in Tiger: Spotlight!
Not exactly. It says something about not caring when it saves. I'm not sure what that means, but osx does care about where you save. Plus windows has had a "My Documents Folder" for a while now.
 

Timelessblur

macrumors 65816
Jun 26, 2004
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Mechcozmo said:
Longhorn info, but some really good stuff from the VP of MicroSoft.

Longhorn FAQs


I love this quote:



Honestly, havn't Macs had this since 10.0? Documents folder for the documents, Pictures folder for the pictures.............And new in Tiger: Spotlight!

windows has had those folders since windows 2000. Always been in XP it just you can over ride the defuat locatoin and save it where you want to save it.
 

FredAkbar

macrumors 6502a
Jan 18, 2003
660
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Santa Barbara, CA
Microsoft's VP said:
"I should not care about location when I save," says Microsoft VP Chris Jones. "Why can't I just click on my computer and it shows me my documents? ..."
Sounds like the classic Windows-user mindset: don't bother knowing anything about your computer, just let it do all the thinking for you. And people wonder why there can be spyware and hidden files all over the place :rolleyes:
 

Fukui

macrumors 68000
Jul 19, 2002
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I love how they obsolete Windows.Forms after only two years with Avalon... wonderful!! :rolleyes:
 

crenz

macrumors 6502a
Jul 3, 2003
615
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Shanghai, China
I care very much about where I save my documents. Right now, I have about 130'000 "documents" on my laptop. How should an OS be able to display all of these at one time? (I'm not talking about files in general, by the way -- I have about 640'000 files.)
 

SilentPanda

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Oct 8, 2002
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The Bamboo Forest
Savage Henry said:
I like the notion that they are oviously expecting errors in their OS by having to include a more advanced Error Reporting Tool; and Palladium that stops viruses, worms and all non-MS apps from running on your system ...
Isn't Tiger including a more advanced error reporting tools?

More advanced error reporting tools are a good thing even if you aren't expecting them. The more information you have regarding an error the easier it is to fix it... any programmer on the board will tell you that.
 

Savage Henry

macrumors 65816
SilentPanda said:
Isn't Tiger including a more advanced error reporting tools?

More advanced error reporting tools are a good thing even if you aren't expecting them. The more information you have regarding an error the easier it is to fix it... any programmer on the board will tell you that.
Yeah, I could have written it better, I totally agree with what you say. What I meant was along the lines that ERTs are hardly a selling point for potential purchasers.

:eek:
 

JLS

macrumors 6502
Aug 8, 2004
281
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Kent, England
The Longhorn Tier 1 User Experience will not visually resemble Windows XP; instead, it will be a scaled back version of the full Longhorn user experience, which is available in Tier 2, which means it won't use the full DCE (basically, it just supplies just scaling effects). In any event, Tier 1 uses hardware accelerated graphics, supports high DPI scaling (more on this in a bit) and offers transparency graphics effects. However, with Longhorn, Microsoft is trying to convince consumers and even business users to adopt more powerful hardware, and those that do so will see an improvement in Longhorn's user experience. The so-called Tier 2 User Experience is the full meal deal, a superset of Tier 1 with a "graphically stunning user interface," advanced composition services which will be available to Longhorn-specific applications through a new set of APIs; this version requires the DCE and advanced 3D hardware support. "Tier 2 will very clearly be the experience you will want," Hammil said. "It includes desktop quality features and productivity features not found in Tier 1."
More powerful hardware so you get animated windows???! Have they realised that unless they restrict features on 'older' computers, then they would have been sufficient for the job anyway and people would stop buying stupidly fast computers.. what a crock. This smells so bad... they want the pallidium chip in every computer obviously - and this is how they will do it. *******s.
 

grapes911

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JLS said:
More powerful hardware so you get animated windows???! Have they realised that unless they restrict features on 'older' computers, then they would have been sufficient for the job anyway and people would stop buying stupidly fast computers.. what a crock. This smells so bad... they want the pallidium chip in every computer obviously - and this is how they will do it. *******s.
I think you are missing the point. They are going to make expirence of using windows better (I don't know if they will succeed). MS is going to allow you to turn some things off for slower computers though. They don't care what processor you have. They are a business trying to make money. They will make the min requirements as low as possible so more people can will buy it.
 

JLS

macrumors 6502
Aug 8, 2004
281
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Kent, England
grapes911 said:
I think you are missing the point. They are going to make expirence of using windows better (I don't know if they will succeed). MS is going to allow you to turn some things off for slower computers though. They don't care what processor you have. They are a business trying to make money. They will make the min requirements as low as possible so more people can will buy it.

I don't think you read the FAQ in full... it talks about how unsigned drivers will mean that longhorn is automatically put back to 'state 1' or whatever its called - obviously my ATI9700 could run windows fading effects, but as its a TX card that came with dell it means I can't use it with the best 'state' meaning a pointless upgrade if I want to get the full features I paid for.

MS is not allowing you to turn things off for slower computers - it is FORCING you.

Obviously they care about your hardware.. if you see your computer won't work all the features in the longhorn (regardless of if it IS actually possible) your more likely to go buy a new machine... this equals another sale of windows on it, plus the new pallidum chip for global digital rights domination..
 

grapes911

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JLS said:
I don't think you read the FAQ in full... it talks about how unsigned drivers will mean that longhorn is automatically put back to 'state 1' or whatever its called - obviously my ATI9700 could run windows fading effects, but as its a TX card that came with dell it means I can't use it with the best 'state' meaning a pointless upgrade if I want to get the full features I paid for.

MS is not allowing you to turn things off for slower computers - it is FORCING you.

Obviously they care about your hardware.. if you see your computer won't work all the features in the longhorn (regardless of if it IS actually possible) your more likely to go buy a new machine... this equals another sale of windows on it, plus the new pallidum chip for global digital rights domination..
I've read it three times and I finally get what you are saying. I still don't know if I agree or not. I need more info on this Pallidum stuff.
 

JOD8FY

macrumors 6502a
Mar 22, 2004
633
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United States
Did ayone see this pic? Is it just me or does it say that this computer has an 80GHz Xeon processor? :confused: Maybe it's 8.0, but still... And I love how it has a 20GB HD! :p

JOD8FY
 

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zv470

macrumors 6502
Jul 4, 2004
385
13
Japan
Way the go Microsoft, you've hit on a real winner!

If you're not caring where you save stuff, then no wonder you're going to need that 2 TB hard disk.

Hmm, and what happens when windows crashes (note the use of 'when' not 'if' it crashes)... and the file index gets corrupted, how will you ever find your files again?
 

Fukui

macrumors 68000
Jul 19, 2002
1,615
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zv470 said:
If you're not caring where you save stuff, then no wonder you're going to need that 2 TB hard disk.

Hmm, and what happens when windows crashes (note the use of 'when' not 'if' it crashes)... and the file index gets corrupted, how will you ever find your files again?
Well, that and the scary thing about the idea of not caring where your data is stored is the fact that if you never really know *where* it is, you have no control over it whatsoever. Do people in an office just throw thier papers on the floor and everywhere and just expect thier secretary to pick them up and file them nicely for you? (Don't answer that! I know there are some...) I really wouldn't want my files scattered across different disks, networks, computers etc, and then have it magically appear as if they were on my computer unless I know *where* they are. I wouldn't dare have my stuff managed in that fashon.

I think the subtle difference is, I should care where my files are, but I shouldn't have to look for them.
 

rueyeet

macrumors 65816
Jun 10, 2003
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MD
I'm of two minds about this whole "it shouldn't matter where I save" thing. On the one hand, not letting the computer get in the way of the user, and not forcing the user to adapt to the computer, are part of why Apple's products are easier to use, and that's a logical extension of that concept. Apple's Spotlight is their take on a solution to that problem, and given that it's pretty much the same approach Google's using with Gmail, it's probably a valid one.

But on the other hand....how hard is it to understand basic directory/folder structure?!? For the love of little flowered iMacs, are people REALLY that stupid? Why is it that it's generally accepted for every other kind of tool that a bit of time invested in learning to use it properly will greatly help results, but when it comes to computers you shouldn't have to learn ANYTHING to use it properly? Because, y'know, consumers shouldn't actually have to use their brains or anything. :rolleyes:

Here's my two favorite quotes from the FAQ:

Microsoft has even pledged to retain DOS compatibility with Longhorn, though it's currently unclear whether DOS support will be improved over what's available today in Windows XP.
Words utterly fail me.
Palladium can be used to securely distribute music, movies, and other intellectual property securely over the Internet.
But is it...wait for it....secure?

Oy. :rolleyes:
 

XnavxeMiyyep

macrumors 65816
Mar 27, 2003
1,132
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Washington
Ugh. I will never understand people's urge to organize purely by filetype. When I work on a project, I want to make a folder for it, and view all the images, text files, videos, or whatever in that folder. Nothing wrong with being able to just view all your documents, but it's rather foolish to say that you shouldn't care where you save your files.
 
A

AhmedFaisal

Guest
Looks like Longhorn will be an even bigger bitch than XP

I have a couple of WinBlows boxes and all run on Windows 2000 the last decent OS that MS ever made. Until they physically prevent me from installing W2k on a new PC I will keep using it, and it even supports Hyperthreading, just assumes a physical 2nd CPU is present. And by the time W2k won't install anymore Linux or any other Unix should have gotten their hardware support for stuff like soundcards (M-Audio Audiophile sucks ass big time so far) up to par so I can finally tell MS to sod off.
Cheers,

Ahmed
 

Edot

macrumors 6502
Jan 29, 2002
432
0
NJ
I like this one.

After all, as one Microsoft executive asked me recently, "Why can we find anything we want on the Internet in seconds, but it takes so long to find our own data on our own PCs?"

Wait since when does Steve work for MS? :rolleyes:
 

Mechcozmo

macrumors 603
Original poster
Jul 17, 2004
5,215
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Longhorn...I have to say, when it still is based on DOS (MS dons't know any other language except qbasic ;) ) You have a problem. It is ancient. Why use DOS? Oh, and another thing...how will Longhorn use a 4TB harddrive if NTFS dosn't format anything bigger than 2TB? Will people need to partition their drives?

And I like that comment about the "when it crashes...what happens to the file index?" I'll say that it is backed up to the hard drive, so that way when that crashes too you can be safe.
(I once did some minor IT help at a buisenss, and on eguy told me "Our backups go so much faster now--watch this!" And he chooses the save to hard drive option...completely defies the point...)