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lornhorn to ship without winfs in 2006
- Thread starter howard
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Makes sense. Apple has shown that you can do good search without changing the whole filesystem anyway.
That'll definitely hurt the speed of their new search technologies... (And i heard they also dropped meta-data search altogether, right? :\)
Anyway.. the filesystem (NTFS) is the main thing keeping Windows file searches slow. I mean.. that's one of the ways to show the efficiency of a Macintosh.. it's search is almost always at least twice as fast.. and not even taking into account the quick-search search as you type features in Panther, just the HFS+ filesystem alone is enough. A search on a 500Mhz iMac running OS 8.5 still finishes sooner than a recent Windows machine in many cases.
THEN you take into account how long it takes too click the search button in Windows Explorer, then click Files and Folders on the doggy-helper's speech bubble, then you can type in your search (and make sure it's going to the right place) and hit return.
Then in the Mac OS X Finder.. you click on the quick-search field (which already is labeled with where you are searching) and just starting typing your search.. and then finishes faster than on Windows with NTFS.
I'm not saying that it's somehow the totally right, quintessential way to search. But I doubt many would disagree that it would in the majority of cases result in your total search taking noticeably less actual time than in Windows.
Anyway.. the filesystem (NTFS) is the main thing keeping Windows file searches slow. I mean.. that's one of the ways to show the efficiency of a Macintosh.. it's search is almost always at least twice as fast.. and not even taking into account the quick-search search as you type features in Panther, just the HFS+ filesystem alone is enough. A search on a 500Mhz iMac running OS 8.5 still finishes sooner than a recent Windows machine in many cases.
THEN you take into account how long it takes too click the search button in Windows Explorer, then click Files and Folders on the doggy-helper's speech bubble, then you can type in your search (and make sure it's going to the right place) and hit return.
Then in the Mac OS X Finder.. you click on the quick-search field (which already is labeled with where you are searching) and just starting typing your search.. and then finishes faster than on Windows with NTFS.
I'm not saying that it's somehow the totally right, quintessential way to search. But I doubt many would disagree that it would in the majority of cases result in your total search taking noticeably less actual time than in Windows.
I'd post something witty or funny, or more likely completely useless, but I'm too busy laughing my ass off! 
Without WinFS AND Avalon (Enhanced Graphics) AND Indigo (the webservices framework), they'll all be add-ons at a later date. Even XP will get Indigo and Avalon. Look like they bit off more than they could chew.
WinFS has been delayed since late 1995 BTW... Cairo...
WinFS has been delayed since late 1995 BTW... Cairo...
ohh a new thread...
This is the 2nd with ...
MS will deliver Longhorn without this and that ... :rooleyes:
But MS will declare that they are improving the system to avoid any security whole ...
This is the 2nd with ...
MS will deliver Longhorn without this and that ... :rooleyes:
But MS will declare that they are improving the system to avoid any security whole ...
ok ok, I know its funny to laugh at Micro$oft. But how can they not succeed in something so crucial? I think I read once that Micro$oft have an Research and Development fund of something like 5 billion dollars or something. Thats a massive amount of money!? I am seriously surprised that they have stumbled so much over these issues, but then they insist on trying to take giant leaps with years of nothing inbetween. Whereas Apple continue to update the OS constantly until the next version is ready to be released.
I'd be really pissed off if I were waiting for Longhorn! Soon people will be asking "why should I bother to upgrade?"
I'd be really pissed off if I were waiting for Longhorn! Soon people will be asking "why should I bother to upgrade?"
hmm so they are srtipping features to meet release dates...
i hope this is to the benefit of consumer (aka. less bugs)..but it's still a drawback... i thought that microsoft actually learned from it's failures which they made ...but now the same game... but at least it will help opensource+linux the more microsoft screws it up...(if it helps apple is a different thing... )
i hope this is to the benefit of consumer (aka. less bugs)..but it's still a drawback... i thought that microsoft actually learned from it's failures which they made ...but now the same game... but at least it will help opensource+linux the more microsoft screws it up...(if it helps apple is a different thing... )
Boy you maccy are slow at finding this stuff out. I knew about it a few weeks ago.
In short yeah it was kind of a important thing. It got move to project coded name Blacksomething or other which is the OS that is in delvoplopment that will replace longhorn in like 2009 or so. Part of the reason for the deley is MS felt security was a more imporant issue. Heck part of long horn deley was the fact that MS had to pull a lot of resorces from lornhorn for SP2. WinFS was there to impove searching and stuff but at least they are making the searching better.
Either way secuirty was a imporant issue so it a good thing that choose to invested the limited resourses in there.
In short yeah it was kind of a important thing. It got move to project coded name Blacksomething or other which is the OS that is in delvoplopment that will replace longhorn in like 2009 or so. Part of the reason for the deley is MS felt security was a more imporant issue. Heck part of long horn deley was the fact that MS had to pull a lot of resorces from lornhorn for SP2. WinFS was there to impove searching and stuff but at least they are making the searching better.
Either way secuirty was a imporant issue so it a good thing that choose to invested the limited resourses in there.
in defence of microsoft,
its easy to look at what apple has done, and compare them to how microsoft keeps screwing up. But with apples closed system theres so much less room for failure. They don't have basically an infinite amount of hardware configurations to have to deal with. That alone i'm sure takes up much of microsofts resources and limits them.
its easy to look at what apple has done, and compare them to how microsoft keeps screwing up. But with apples closed system theres so much less room for failure. They don't have basically an infinite amount of hardware configurations to have to deal with. That alone i'm sure takes up much of microsofts resources and limits them.
Dang straight; even if I never use a MS product (which I don't if I can help it), I'd rather have MS improving their security than adding yet another feature that won't work correctly for the first two versions, by which time they'll have probably gotten bored with it because they own that marketspace or have replaced it with something new anyway. Their security improvements benefit us all (the volume of spam I get on web-displayed addresses is now a tiny fraction of the volume of virus-infected e-mail... every single piece of it from Windows).Timelessblur said:
Ok, I lost you there. Microsoft has limited resources? According to themselves, net income for fiscal year 2004 was $8.17 billion. During which period they at least claim to have spent around $4B on R&D... so by my calculations they're a long way from "limited" resources (how about spending some of that ill-gotten $8B on the customers!), and a $4B R&D budget (most of which probably went to the Xbox or a giant laser to blow up competitors anyway) doesn't exactly sound too limiting.Timelessblur said:
There's obviously a limited number of programmers who can efficiently work on a single project (there's an equation somewhere), but you'd think with that kind of cash sitting around they could maybe develop more than one feature at a time if they were organized about it.
I used to think that too, but, then how do you explain linux?howard said:
If your OS is layered correctly, then conflicts with certain components shouldn't affect other layers, but with windows, the GUI being in the kernel, among other things, adds a layer of comlexity that doesn't need to be there.
There is a reason why windows is called "The Hairball"
I hope Longhorn implodes.
Today's Top Tech Headlines
Microsoft will officially scrap its long-awaited Longhorn operating system. Microsoft is expected to keep its familiar Windows XP operating system until 2020. Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer could not be reached for comment. Ballmer was last seen going on a "psychotic rampage" through the offices of Microsoft. Ballmer was reportedly "going insane like a gorilla jacked up on methamphetamines" at the news of the scrapping of Microsoft's future OS.
Apple has officially announced "Windows crushing" G6 128-bit "supercomputer" with the new OS XII operating system. "Say goodbye to Microsoft and say hello to the new iCrusher G6," chuckled Apple CEO Steve Jobs.
I can dream, can't I?
Today's Top Tech Headlines
Microsoft will officially scrap its long-awaited Longhorn operating system. Microsoft is expected to keep its familiar Windows XP operating system until 2020. Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer could not be reached for comment. Ballmer was last seen going on a "psychotic rampage" through the offices of Microsoft. Ballmer was reportedly "going insane like a gorilla jacked up on methamphetamines" at the news of the scrapping of Microsoft's future OS.
Apple has officially announced "Windows crushing" G6 128-bit "supercomputer" with the new OS XII operating system. "Say goodbye to Microsoft and say hello to the new iCrusher G6," chuckled Apple CEO Steve Jobs.
I can dream, can't I?
You would think that a company like Microsoft would do something better than this, but it is Microsoft.
I don't see why they can't re-design the whole company. I mean, why don't they organize themselves so that they don't have to drop features? They have billions of dollars, surely they can do something about it!
Or, why don't they re-invent Windows? Oh, wait, that's Longhorn... Seriously, they need to get off their ass and start innovating! They could do so much to the computer world, seeing that they almost own it. Oh well, it's Microsoft, I really have no hope for them anyways, and I hope they die. Wait, am I allowed to say that? Oh well, he he, Long live Apple and the Mac BU! (Ha ha ha ha ha...)
Chase
I don't see why they can't re-design the whole company. I mean, why don't they organize themselves so that they don't have to drop features? They have billions of dollars, surely they can do something about it!
Or, why don't they re-invent Windows? Oh, wait, that's Longhorn... Seriously, they need to get off their ass and start innovating! They could do so much to the computer world, seeing that they almost own it. Oh well, it's Microsoft, I really have no hope for them anyways, and I hope they die. Wait, am I allowed to say that? Oh well, he he, Long live Apple and the Mac BU! (Ha ha ha ha ha...)
Chase
Yeah, they saw it comming. It will be implamented in the next revision of longhorn if there is one. WINfs was a major thing for windows, And with all the money microsoft has and the mass amount of resources, I cant see the hold up.. GET IT OUT THE DOOR BILLY BOY!!! I need something new to laugh at.
Thats good news, because I really hope that they are shipping the new Windows and not delaying it further and further.
Why ? Because I hope it will boost sales in the IT industry.
Why ? Because I hope it will boost sales in the IT industry.
teeps2k4 said:
No, not at all. In fact, they are shipping the latest version of Virtual PC (7) with XP SP2 (I believe).
Chase
Great!
I think this is great news. The more Microsoft cuts from Longhorn the more advanced Tiger or whatever Apple has on offer in 2006 will look.
I think this is great news. The more Microsoft cuts from Longhorn the more advanced Tiger or whatever Apple has on offer in 2006 will look.
Even if MS has to cut few things off Longhorn, it won't hurt them finacially. There are still millions of people out there who will buy a PC regardless of how advanced Tiger or what ever Apple has to offer when Longhorn finally ships will be.
I was worried until I leanred that WinFS would be cut back and released as an add-on maybe?
This is the technology that the most people need the least.
I was worried Avalon, Indigo, and WinFX would be cut. And they still may be. But scaling back WinFS is probably good for MS. It's too much, too soon. I don't see great need for it for 2-5 years. It's not just meta-search, it's turning every PC into an SQL server. As a matter of fact, I'm not sure the desktop client needs it at all. Maybe a limited implementation. Keep the desktop simple.
This is the technology that the most people need the least.
I was worried Avalon, Indigo, and WinFX would be cut. And they still may be. But scaling back WinFS is probably good for MS. It's too much, too soon. I don't see great need for it for 2-5 years. It's not just meta-search, it's turning every PC into an SQL server. As a matter of fact, I'm not sure the desktop client needs it at all. Maybe a limited implementation. Keep the desktop simple.