Mac Studio being obsoleted by new Mac Pro?!

[Riot Nrrrd]

Anyone seen this? Thoughts?

Mac Studio Was A Temporary Product, Apple Rumored To Replace It With The Mac Pro

The Mac Studio may have been just a placeholder product, and the Mac Pro may end up taking its place when it officially launches

wccftech.com

 

[CoMoMacUser]

If it is, it is. I don't regret buying a Studio. It meets my needs and will continue to do so for years to come. Apple will continue to support the M1 Max chip simply because it's in other products, such as the MBP. My Studio isn't going to suddenly turn into a doorstop if it's the first and last of its type.

 

[Sharky II]

Mmm, I can’t imagine they’d purposely put all that work into launching a product for a single product life cycle

 

[jz0309]

Current Mac Studio entry point: $1999
Current (Intel) MacPro entry point: $5999

so, the answer is: No

 

[wdhpgx]

Hey, if they want to make the Pro line starting at a $2k price range -- then I'm happy to have my Studio "replaced" by a Pro.

 

[Realityck]

Anyone seen this? Thoughts?

Mac Studio Was A Temporary Product, Apple Rumored To Replace It With The Mac Pro

The Mac Studio may have been just a placeholder product, and the Mac Pro may end up taking its place when it officially launches

wccftech.com

There's others that have thought the Mac Studio was a placeholder to buy Apple time to bring out the next Mac Pro.

 

[tstafford]

I would love it if the dumped the Studio. I'd feel great knowing I got one when I could. It's the best machine I've bought from Apple followed closely by the MBP14 and our old 2015 iMac.

I am very confident the Studio is a 5-7 year machine for me and there is nothing else that Apple sells right now that I could say that about.

It's not like if they were to dump it (which they won't) that it would stop getting OS updates. I honestly don't care if they make an M2 or M3 version. I have zero interest in upgrading as it works perfectly for me.

Side note: it's a testament to how awesome the Studio is that people would think it's a place holder for the Pro.

 

[eicca]

I don't imagine the dev cost was all that expensive since it's basically a taller Mini for the purpose of fitting a bigger heatsink. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that there were only one or two prototypes before the final design was settled on.

 

[theluggage]

Anyone seen this? Thoughts?

Mac Studio Was A Temporary Product, Apple Rumored To Replace It With The Mac Pro

The Mac Studio may have been just a placeholder product, and the Mac Pro may end up taking its place when it officially launches

wccftech.com

In time, every product is temporary...

Seriously, though, it's hard to even speculate on that without knowing what form the new Mac Pro is going to take. Also, the Studio range is - currently & primarily - Apple's replacement for the high-end iMacs and iMac Pro - which probably won't be served by a new Mac Pro.

A direct replacement for the 2019 MP at a similar (if not higher) price point wouldn't bother the Studio range - but (as discussed in endless other threads) there's a whole host of questions about how you achieve that sort of massive RAM capability, PCIe bandwidth and discrete GPU support using the Apple Silicon "building blocks" seen throughout the rest of the Mac range without throwing away the other benefits of Apple Silicon. Plus, a lot of the target customers for that sort of machine have complex workflows with obscure specialist software and might not be falling over themselves to embark on their ARM adventure just yet.

Or, maybe it's the 2019 Mac Pro that is the stop-gap and trying to replicate it is simply not the best use of Apple Silicon. The Mac Studio is a very credible successor to the trashcan, which at one point Apple were happy to hail as the future. If Apple decide that the 2019 Pro & price point is expendable (or if if what the 2019MP customer base really needs is a few more years of support for the current model) then the "New Mac Pro" could be something very like the Mac Studio upgraded to the next generation of Max/Ultra silicon. Or some more radical option like MPX-like Apple Silicon compute modules plugging into a larger enclosure.

If I had to speculate, I'd guess that the "New Mac Pro" will be a Mac Studio-style machine (possibly re-worked into a 1U rackmount format with rackmount storage and PCIe expansion options from Apple or the usual Apple-endorsed 3rd parties) that gets a year-or-so's exclusive on the 3nm Mx Max/Ultra processors and sells alongside the current M1 Max/Ultra Studios - longer term, see the first line of my post!

The other variable is whether the (large) iMac/iMac Pro is coming back (which probably would spell the end of the Studio) - but I don't buy that when Apple already has a choice of standalone displays, with more rumoured to be in the pipeline - and while some people are pining for the iMac many others are delighted that they can now get a powerful Mac desktop that isn't glued into to a display. Also, Apple Silicon greatly erodes the performance gap between laptops and desktops - so the preferred solution for many who previously had both a MBP and an iMac will now be a MacBook Pro + a 5k display/dock like the Studio Display.

 

[pshufd]

I did not like the looks of the Studio but I love having one and using one. It's behind a monitor so I don't see it that often but I don't even think of the Studio much anymore which means that it is doing its job. The mini wasn't enough for me. I would expect the Mac Pro to be quite a bit bigger but smaller than a tower. I have never been a Mac Pro customer though I have a PowerMac G5. At any rate, I'm happy with the Studio. If they come out with a Mac Pro, I don't see getting one as it would likely be overkill for my needs.

I was more of an iMac fan but I do appreciate the relative portability of the Studio. My wife is away for five months and I am thinking of using her desktop setup in the living room. She has a 2018 mini and I could just replace it with my M1 mini or my Studio.

 

[Fishrrman]

I would expect the price of the base model Mac Pro to be 2x-2.5x-3x that of the Mac Studio.

Different product for different target markets...

 

[tstafford]

I did not like the looks of the Studio but I love having one and using one. It's behind a monitor so I don't see it that often but I don't even think of the Studio much anymore which means that it is doing its job. The mini wasn't enough for me. I would expect the Mac Pro to be quite a bit bigger but smaller than a tower.

I like the look of the Studio - it's all business. My wife saw it in my office one day and immediate said "that's cool". Of course I also liked the Trash Can. So apparently I have no taste.

Zero chance I change out my Studio for anything. I too like the iMac but I can't imagine it being better in a sufficiently meaningful way for me to ditch my Studio/ASDs set-up.

 

[maflynn]

I don't know about replaced but, I would think that a Mac Pro and Studio would have significant overlap.

but then so wouldn't a rumored 15" MBP and a 16" MBP. Apple doesn't seem to care too much about one product cannibalizing another

 

[designerdave72]

I did not like the looks of the Studio but I love having one and using one. It's behind a monitor so I don't see it that often but I don't even think of the Studio much anymore which means that it is doing its job. The mini wasn't enough for me. I would expect the Mac Pro to be quite a bit bigger but smaller than a tower. I have never been a Mac Pro customer though I have a PowerMac G5. At any rate, I'm happy with the Studio. If they come out with a Mac Pro, I don't see getting one as it would likely be overkill for my needs.

I was more of an iMac fan but I do appreciate the relative portability of the Studio. My wife is away for five months and I am thinking of using her desktop setup in the living room. She has a 2018 mini and I could just replace it with my M1 mini or my Studio.

I don’t like it either but needs must and to hide behind the ASD is even better. Those that stick it under the display need help!

 

[Realityck]

I don't know about replaced but, I would think that a Mac Pro and Studio would have significant overlap.

but then so wouldn't a rumored 15" MBP and a 16" MBP. Apple doesn't seem to care too much about one product cannibalizing another

Ahh you meant the rumored 15” MBA and a 16” MBP. Now we could possibly see MBA’s stick to more energy efficient M2/M3, and the heavier 16” MBP utilize M2/M3 Pro/Max. But it’s the 14” MBP vs possible 15” MBA that seems like odd competition. Do people really need one over the other? The slightly larger 14” MBP regularly is suggested for people wanting to spend more the current M2 MBA if you want to add storage or RAM. Will this all hinge on SoC performance or will it hinge on feature sets which I think MBA is at a disadvantage especially what display type is offered.

Back to the topic IMHO the performance of the various Macs is all centered on the Mac Studio so how long will that last before the other models catch up or surpass it. Seems like they made the Mac Studio too big a target not to get impacted by other announcements.

 

[Jorbanead]

Mmm, I can’t imagine they’d purposely put all that work into launching a product for a single product life cycle

The 2017 iMac Pro is looking at you.

And for all we know, the 2019 Mac Pro design will also not be used ever again. It seems very large for Apple Silicon. There’s likely no need for all those PCIe slots (maybe only a few).

 

[Jorbanead]

Anyone seen this? Thoughts?

Mac Studio Was A Temporary Product, Apple Rumored To Replace It With The Mac Pro

The Mac Studio may have been just a placeholder product, and the Mac Pro may end up taking its place when it officially launches

wccftech.com

I think the lineup will look like this:

Mac Studio: Max & Ultra
Mac Pro: Ultra & Extreme

I think there’s going to be overlap in the Ultra chips. The Mac Pro selling point could be more ports, slotted SSD so you can upgrade, and potentially PCIe slots as well. So if you want more modularity and upgradability, you’d get the Mac Pro.

EDIT: PCIe slots are not just for graphics cards. Many professionals use them for other reasons. I’d guess a new Mac Pro would only have a few slots. Much less than 2019.

 

[maflynn]

Ahh you meant the rumored 15” MBA and a 16” MBP.

Yes my fingers were faster then my brain

 

[handheldgames]

Anyone seen this? Thoughts?

Mac Studio Was A Temporary Product, Apple Rumored To Replace It With The Mac Pro

The Mac Studio may have been just a placeholder product, and the Mac Pro may end up taking its place when it officially launches

wccftech.com

Considering the M2 is still PCIe 4.0 and does not support Thunderbolt 5 ~ USB4 80Gb/s. No big jumps forward here, only Mhz/core/cpu bump for the next ultra. What can the MacPro offer? Slots: If we get an M2 Ultra in the Mac Pro, that means 4 x4 PCIE lanes would be available for PCIe slots from one of the CPUs That could go through a plex to offer: 2 x8 slots.

BUT... Without support for AMD GPUs, are the slots necessary.

 

[theluggage]

but then so wouldn't a rumored 15" MBP and a 16" MBP. Apple doesn't seem to care too much about one product cannibalizing another

I think the rumors that make sense are of a 15" M2 MacBook Air alongside the 16" MBP - for people who just want more screen area for undemanding work without needing the extra CPU/GPU power and I/O capability of a Mx Pro/Max chip (for which Apple charge quite a premium).

In any case, consumer MacBooks sell in multiple millions so Apple can afford to spread that between multiple overlapping models (or the 13" MBP wouldn't exist and the M1 Air wouldn't have hung around). Desktops probably sell a fraction of those numbers so too much overlap would make some models uneconomical (by Apple's standards, not those of a smaller enterprise - they probably don't get out of bed for sales of less than a million).

BUT... Without support for AMD GPUs, are the slots necessary.

Plenty of other uses for PCIe slots - M.2 storage, specialist audio interfaces, Fibre Channel, heck even adding a load of top-level USB 2 ports to drive MIDI & audio devices with low latency (TB docks tend to end up connecting USB 2/3 devices via under multiple layers of internal hubs shared with other devices). If you have the slots, pretty much any such functionality which you could connect externally via Thunderbolt can be done more cheaply, neatly and reliably by plugging in the appropriate PCIe card.

However, its GPUs that tend to actually benefit from x16 slots whereas a lot of other uses would be viable in a TB-to-PCIe enclosure - and the 'clutter' issue could be addressed by rack mounting everything (spendy - but so is a Mac Pro).

The question is, how many "pro" users who rely on PCIe slots mainly for supporting existing hardware are actually ready and able to switch to ARM, or even to be forced onto the latest MacOS, which may not support their existing devices or specialist software? If you're starting a workflow from scratch, doing everything with new, external thunderbolt/USB-C devices (possibly rackmount) might be viable.

 

[Jorbanead]

The question is, how many "pro" users who rely on PCIe slots mainly for supporting existing hardware are actually ready and able to switch to ARM, or even to be forced onto the latest MacOS

I think this is a huge reason for the delay in the Mac Pro. ProTools for example is the industry standard for audio recording and they only recently released a public beta for native support. Media Composer just recently got native support this last year. MATLAB is still on beta. Autodesk Maya is still on Rosetta. Mathematicia got support only a year ago.

Many pro apps took much longer to receive native support (or still have not) than Apple likely suspected. What would be the point of a Mac Pro if major apps weren’t native. Apple needs to showcase how powerful pro software is otherwise professionals won’t get it.

 

[Boil]

I think the lineup will look like this:

Mac Studio: Max & Ultra
Mac Pro: Ultra & Extreme

I think there’s going to be overlap in the Ultra chips. The Mac Pro selling point could be more ports, slotted SSD so you can upgrade, and potentially PCIe slots as well. So if you want more modularity and upgradability, you’d get the Mac Pro.

For those who don't really need PCIe slots, but could use the extra compute, Apple needs to add an ASi Mac Pro Cube powered by a Mn Extreme SoC to the line-up...!

 

[Jorbanead]

For those who don't really need PCIe slots, but could use the extra compute, Apple needs to add an ASi Mac Pro Cube powered by a Mn Extreme SoC to the line-up...!

You’re talking about a niche within a niche. Apple doesn’t do that. The ROI would not be worth it. The Mac Pro alone is likely not even worth it, but since it functions as a halo product it becomes worth it for the company.

 

[tstafford]

You’re talking about a niche within a niche. Apple doesn’t do that. The ROI would not be worth it. The Mac Pro alone is likely not even worth it, but since it functions as a halo product it becomes worth it for the company.

You're right - it's probably best viewed as a halo product at this point. And that makes the fact that they apparently aren't redesigning it all the worse. A halo product needs to have a cool, new look. I like the cheese grater but they can't just dust that off.

The Studio design is the antithesis of halo - it's workperson like. Just sits there and does its thing. I love it.

I'm beginning to rethink my earlier take that the Studio isn't going anywhere. I'm seeing a world with a "Mini Pro" and then a gap to the lowest spec Pro. That would suck. But it's a problem I don't need to worry about for 5-7 years since my Studio will serve me just fine. The only annoying thing is it makes me wonder if I screwed up not getting 64GB RAM. I hate that we can't add RAM.

 

[JaredJenkinsDesign]

I would love it if the dumped the Studio. I'd feel great knowing I got one when I could. It's the best machine I've bought from Apple followed closely by the MBP14 and our old 2015 iMac.

I am very confident the Studio is a 5-7 year machine for me and there is nothing else that Apple sells right now that I could say that about.

It's not like if they were to dump it (which they won't) that it would stop getting OS updates. I honestly don't care if they make an M2 or M3 version. I have zero interest in upgrading as it works perfectly for me.

Side note: it's a testament to how awesome the Studio is that people would think it's a place holder for the Pro.

Same here! I really like the small form factor, power and ports without the need of spending $900-$1,100 more on the 14"/16" laptops. It simply gets the job done and it's already served me well with my Motion Graphics animations and should continue to do so for 5-7 years like you said.