Market free fall

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by MacNut, Jun 6, 2008.

  1. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #1
    Rather than post the whole sad story here is the headline.
    The Dow's 395-point drubbing is its biggest one-day point loss in 15 months, after crude prices' largest one-day advance ever and a poor jobs report.
    Want to read on...http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/06/markets/markets_newyork/?postversion=2008060617

    $5.00 gas anyone?
    http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/06/news/economy/gas_prices/index.htm
     
  2. Mavimao macrumors 6502a

    Mavimao

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    #2
    Another foreboding sign of Peak Oil? Or just a temporary spike?

    In any case, I'll be car free next week when I sell my BMW. Just a personal baby step.
     
  3. MacNut thread starter macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #3
    It is more like futures scare tactics to drive the prices higher. These high prices have nothing to do with demand, demand is down. It is all investors pushing it higher.

    Oil dropped yesterday, then today a report says $150 a barrel by July 4th, so prices rocket up.
     
  4. Blue Velvet Moderator emeritus

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    #4
    I read an amusing article that said it was all Obama's fault; the probability of increased capital gains taxes if he should win the election. I'm sure it has nothing to do with the alarming US employment figures that were released earlier today.
     
  5. MacNut thread starter macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #5
    It is one big snowball, High oil means no earnings so jobs and economy falls.
     
  6. Cleverboy macrumors 65816

    Cleverboy

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    #6
    Israel just threatened to attack Iran. Anyone saying it has to do with a presidential candidate, especially the ONLY one that said that "consumption" is at the root of our gas problem... is smoking the gange.

    I just left work early and filled up my tank. Screw you, Bush. Thanks a lot, buddy.

    ~ CB
     
  7. MacNut thread starter macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #7
    Consumption has been falling for weeks yet the prices climb.
     
  8. fotografica macrumors 68040

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    #8
    It doesn't help with the dollar being in the toilet either..Investors look elsewhere..Gold was up 23.50 and platinum was up 68.80.. The Dow is down 8% YTD,the NASDAQ 6.7% YTD..
     
  9. MacNut thread starter macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #9
    Yet by investing in oil it drives everything else higher making the dollar weaker and the economy worse. So is it really worth the investment.
     
  10. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #10
    Just wait until the international community finally decides to decouple oil sales from the petrodollar. Bye bye $.
     
  11. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #11
    That report was based on growing future demand in Asia along with serious problems in Nigeria. It's also partly due to airlines buying fuel for the future. If it goes any higher, many will be going out of business.

    I honestly don't think the current high prices for oil are a bubble. Moreover, the plummeting dollar is pushing prices higher. It would be in our long term interests if oil was priced via a basket of currencies rather solely via the dollar.

    US and western demand may be down, but for the remaining 4 billion people in the world, demand is growing.

    All it would take right now for gas in the US to hit $6+ a gallon is war in Iran or a major strike on a large scale pipeline, major oil field, etc.
     
  12. fotografica macrumors 68040

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    #12
    Or a hurricane,Cat 5 or not,tearing thru the Gulf of Mexico this summer..
     
  13. MacNut thread starter macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #13
    I think it is a combination of both over pricing and the lower dollar. They both go hand in hand. The more the price rises the lower the dollar sinks.
     
  14. jmadlena Guest

    #14
    Better thank him for the booming economy that the US enjoyed for the past 8 years.

    Presidents (including candidates, in the case of the Obama comment) get too much credit when things go well, and too much blame when they don't.

    On the topic of higher gas prices... it is just further proof that we need to get over our bad oil habit. It's like an addiction; it'll suck trying to get off of it, but once we kick it we will feel much better.
     
  15. Blue Velvet Moderator emeritus

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    #15
    Well, as long as you're wearing a flag lapel pin and holding your hand across your heart, everything will be alright.
     
  16. MacNut thread starter macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #16
    10 years is a long time to wait. We might not survive that long.
     
  17. blackfox macrumors 65816

    blackfox

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    #17
    Well, although I can't say I enjoy being subject to it's ill-effects - I guess a day of reckoning and subsequent reorganization was bound to happen.

    I can see gas prices continuing to rise - or at least staying level at near the current price-point. Athough this has wrenching effects on the logistics of our economy - There is bound to be an adjustment by producers and consumers alike to this new reality.

    Sadly, lots of industries and individuals will fail - still, hopefully more creative alternatives will spring from this new reality.

    I think it is safe to say that much that we in the US have grown used to is coming to end. I hope we have the character to make the change well...
     
  18. fotografica macrumors 68040

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    #18
    I remember sitting in my dad's car in the early 70's,in a line stretching out on the street waiting to get gas. Stations were running out of gas then. Over 30 years later,we're still as oil hungry as ever..When will Washington get the message?
     
  19. Cleverboy macrumors 65816

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    #19
    I'd link to an article dealing with how Bush's policies created an artificial bubble, instead of focusing on the avoidable and upcoming problems now reaching maturation... but I sware I feel its way too self-evident. I don't think he's the entire cause... I just think his policies were very bad for the country. I remember when he went pushing his tax cuts, against the advice of economists. That stuff scared me then. I remember as the war raged on with no exist strategy, that people started sounding alarms about the fact that we're borrowing money to fund it and the debt is going wildly out of control. No... SQUARELY in his lap. I agree with the "too much credit, too much blame" statement, but there are certainly exceptions. Read Gore's "Assault on Reason" book. It's maddening.

    ~ CB
     
  20. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

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    #20
    The problem is, of course, that consumption isn't falling in the world market. India, China, and a host of other transition countries are starting to use oil in record numbers.

    Today's numbers are very scary though. Hopefully this represents the point in time when we get serious and do something.
     
  21. iJohnHenry macrumors P6

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    #21
    Up +US$10 today, to US$138.54.

    That will mean $1.38 a litre up here, PDQ.

    :eek:
     
  22. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #22
    Which came first? The Chicken or the Egg?

    No matter what, our insatiable greed is what's led us to this point. If others are taking advantage of that, can you really blame them?

    We use ~25% of the world's oil. Not only that, but we've built our lives around the preposterous notion of Cheap Oil Forever!

    The world knows this only too well. All you have to do is tune into any American TV show and you'll find monstrous gas guzzling vehicles (with a single occupant) driving off into the sunset to some far away and sterile suburb, burning 2 or 3 gallons each way.

    If you had a captive market, and one that not only didn't want to change its addictive habits, but wouldn't (BECAUSE IT"S MY GOD GIVEN RIGHT TO DO WHAT I WANT BECAUSE I"M AN AMERICAN AND DAMN THE CONSEQUENCES!!!!!!) What would you do? Keep the price low or maximize your profits?

    If you choose the first option, I'll have no option but branding you a communist :D with no concept of the term, supply and demand.
     
  23. MacNut thread starter macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #23
    What counts as profit, oil companies have been making profits as long as they have been in existence. Now it is bordering on greed. Eventually we will run out of oil. How much will they then charge. It would have to be 0 as there would be nothing left.

    Why not charge the countries by usage. Not as a lump sum.
     
  24. iJohnHenry macrumors P6

    iJohnHenry

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    #24
    So, this is a hedge against the future??

    You're not helping!!!

    :p
     
  25. MacNut thread starter macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #25
    The problem is that we don't have a time machine to tell us the future. It is all guessing. We might get a cat 5 hurricane in 2 months, then again we might not. These are 5 year projections. How many more years of oil do we have left. Project out 5 years then charge us that price then.

    If Apple sold computers now based on market conditions in 5 years nobody would buy.

    Not to mention the fact that the oil coming out of the ground now won't be in our tanks for at least 6 months. So why doesn't the price adjust then.
     

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