Tablets Microsoft surface trampled at the bottom of the tablet pile this christmas

Discussion in 'Alternatives to iOS and iOS Devices' started by AutoUnion39, Dec 27, 2012.

  1. AutoUnion39 macrumors 601

    AutoUnion39

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2010
    #1
    http://bgr.com/2012/12/26/microsoft-surface-sales-christmas-2012-268839/

    [​IMG]

    where's the iPad killer everyone was predicting
     
  2. aneftp macrumors 68040

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2007
    #2
    I have been trying to look at ebay and Craigslist for Microsoft Surface tablets.

    1. Very few available for resell (which means very few have purchased)
    2. Those that are being resold. Not sure who's buying them cause I wouldn't pay more than $300 for one.

    Only time will tell. I am looking for a bargin with 2nd hand surface just to play around. Maybe wait 2 more months as people get desperate to sell them.

    Like the Blackberry playbook. So much potential. But not enough buyers.
     
  3. AutoUnion39 thread starter macrumors 601

    AutoUnion39

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2010
    #3
    Didn't they only originally sell at Microsoft stores? And there's only a handful of them, so I'm not surprised that you can't find a used one.

    Good comparison, but the Playbook cost too much and had poor software. Windows RT is pretty damn good.
     
  4. aneftp macrumors 68040

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    Jul 28, 2007
    #4
    I just think its a price issue.

    The only reason android has surpassed Apple iPhone in the phone market is the confusing subsidy game cell phone companies play. We all know carriers pay close to retail minus 10% of the $650 msrp for the iPhone. Carriers pay much less sometimes 30-40% less than the msrp for even a high end Galaxy S3 from Samsung. So msrp of the S3 maybe $550. But carriers are probably getting the S3 close to $400 in bulk and turning around and trying to sell for $199 on contract.

    Now with the tablets. There is close to no subsidy 99% of the time. Microsoft cannot sell a $500 tablet and expect to sell as well as the iPad. Sure it's got 32gB as base but consumers still see $500 as price tag. And Microsoft advertises the heck out of the keyboard but consumers will quickly realize that's its another $100 for the keyboard.

    Just like the playbook mistake. Blackberry tried to compete at the same price point as the iPad $500. We all know how well that went.

    Maybe $399 and throw in the keyboard will move sales. But Microsoft isn't willing to do that.......yet.
     
  5. ReallyBigFeet macrumors 68030

    ReallyBigFeet

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    Apr 15, 2010
    #5
    Another example for the tech industry. Specs only get you so far in the marketplace right now. Its all about the ecosystem.
     
  6. phr0ze macrumors 6502a

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    Jun 14, 2012
    Location:
    Columbia, MD
    #6
    I'm not in the market for the Surface, but with all the Ads around that keyboard, they should definately be including it. At least initially call it a bundle, give the keyboard for free. get some market share and stop selling the bundle.
     
  7. AutoUnion39 thread starter macrumors 601

    AutoUnion39

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2010
    #7
    Yup, Microsoft hasn't learned from HP (TouchPad) and RIM's mistakes. You can't just bring out a tablet with an iPad-like pricetag and expect it to sell. It just doesn't work like that.

    The Amazon/Google approach is best by being the cheaper underdog, then move up market, which is exactly what was done with the Nexus and Fire tablets.

    ----------

    Not even $199. On Black Friday, people were getting S3s for free. Android surpassed iOS because there are SO MANY different models and 9 out of 10 times, come in at a cheaper price point than an iPhone.
     
  8. redman042 macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2008
    #8
    I tried the Surface and a competing RT tablet (Asus I think) at Best Buy this weekend. I wasn't impressed.

    While there are nice things about them, apps load WAY too slowly for a tablet released in late 2012. The Windows Desktop mode is stupid. Buttons in Word are way too small. And taps are sometimes ignored.

    I've been enjoying the sleek responsiveness and comprehensively designed UI of iPads for far too long to live with the mediocre performance of a Surface tablet.

    Microsoft is off to a decent start I suppose, but this first release is NOT going to achieve any kind of parity with the iPad. They are going to have to keep at it, and keep pouring money down the hole, before they will get remotely close.
     
  9. CylonGlitch macrumors 68030

    CylonGlitch

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    Jul 7, 2009
    Location:
    SoCal
    #9
    My co-worker came in the day after Christmas with a Surface RT. So we got to play with it a little. I asked him about it, he already has an iPad 2. He said that he asked for a "Nexus 10" but it was sold out so his dad purchased the Surface for him . . . he wasn't too happy. He things it's fine but it's slow.

    I just thought it funny that he ended up with it only because what he really wanted was sold out.
     
  10. mproudfoot macrumors member

    mproudfoot

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2008
    #10
    I personally feel that part of the issue is that people are looking at the Surface/RT devices and comparing them with the iPad/Android tablets. You can't really pigeon-hole the Surface RT - with a fully functional operating system behind it, it's more than just another content consumption/entertainment tablet and yet with the hardware limitations imposed by the ARM architecture, it's by no means a laptop replacement.

    It's something else.

    I've had the iPad (the original first gen and then the iPad 2) since release. When they first came out, they were impressive devices and in my mind, the possibilities were endless. However, they were not endless - at the end of the day, the iPad (and the similar Android tablets) run what is essentially a smartphone OS designed primarily with content/entertainment in mind. That's not necessarily bad thing is that's your primary requirement - for me, the iPad only gets used as a movie player on long flights (where the in-flight entertainment may not be up to the task) and as a portable web browser. That's it.

    The limitations of the iPad have always resulted in me needing to take a laptop on previous trips - even with a 64Gb model, there's no way I could use an iPad in my photography workflow (import photos, edit, export) - on my trip to Asia last year, I had nearly 50Gb of photos (including raw files) to process and this year's Kenya trip, more than that - even removing all of my videos and existing content wouldn't have left enough room. Next year's trip to Costa Rica, I'll be ditching both the iPad and the laptop and taking the Surface RT - with a photo editing app, a multi-card reader (for compact flash and SDXC) and an external USB HDD, I'll be able to do what I need to do quickly and easily.

    Another short business trip to Israel this year, I could have just done with a light device capable of editing and displaying PowerPoint presentations, exporting the files to USB for the audience, and starting a remote desktop session into a remote server (using the a wireless mouse to navigate the server desktop and being able to seamlessly multi task between the presentation and the RDP session) so again, I needed to take the laptop. The next time I have this requirement, I can do it all on the Surface.

    There are probably ways to get perform the above actions on the ipad and Android (e.g. using third party apps and something like a Wi-Drive) but it's by no means a smooth and easy process. In my mind, without file management and proper multitasking, the iPad is like a toy compared to the Surface which takes me back to my first point - it's like comparing apples to oranges.

    As for the constant references (in various reviews and forums) to the limited number of apps in the Windows app store, I believe I read somewhere recently that the app store had more apps on it by the end of the first month than both the iPad (not counting scaled up iPhone apps) and Android tablets. Those eco-systems may now have millions of apps but they have a few years of a head start. I distinctly remember getting my first iPad and having very little on it but a couple of the initial iPad apps and a bunch of iPhone apps which looked pretty terrible.

    Additionally, people are comparing RT to iOS and Android. You don't need apps for some of these things - e.g. Facebook, Twitter, Wikipedia, YouTube etc. Remember that RT is a fully featured OS with a proper browser experience (including Flash of which I'll admit I am not a fan of) - you don't need these apps on your windows MacOS environment, so do we really need apps for these on RT? On other tablets there are limitations that necessitation dedicated apps (e.g. not being able to access the file system) but not here.

    Anyway, I've got a Surface RT 64Gb (with a 64Gb Sandisk Ultra MicroSDXC) on the way - this may not work out (as happened when I tried the Galaxy S3 over an iPhone) but I'm optimistic that the benefits of the OS will outweigh any of the disadvantages.
     
  11. nickftw8686 macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2011
    #11
    Well said, I picked up a surface rt on Thursday and love it so far. My previous tablets were the nexus 7, iPad mini, transformer prime, and so far this is my favorite.


    I think it comes down to your main use for a tablet and the ecosystem your invested in.

    I for one run Windows 8 at home, 7 at work and have a Windows phone so it made sense for me to try one out.
     
  12. Vetvito macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2012
    #12
    They put too much emphasis on the damn kick stand and materials instead focusing on the OS.

    When you tap a tile it opens a splash screen and takes its time loading and then opening the app.

    It's Office Student versions, so you CAN'T use it for any business reasons. So that stops any real enterprise businesses right there. No outlook?

    Tries to be a master of all but isn't good at anything.

    I take that back, the desktop browser allows me to do some work via sslvpn.


    Vivo tab user
     
  13. Macman45 macrumors demi-god

    Macman45

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    Somewhere Back In The Long Ago
    #13
    And 4 hours battery life?:eek: I might grab a really cheap one to play with, but seriously...as a work tool? I just don't see it.
     
  14. mproudfoot macrumors member

    mproudfoot

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2008
    #14
    Not strictly true as anyone who is licensed to use Office 365 or Office 2013 is covered by that license:

    [​IMG]

    The lack of Outlook I agree is a pretty glaring omission. I know that Nitrodesk are brining Touchdown to RT (I used it on my S3 and it's actually really good) but Microsoft really missed a trick here.

    ----------

    Are you referring to the rumoured Surface Pro battery life? (and not the RT which, according to almost all reviews, actually manages 7-10 hours depending on use).
     
  15. cynics macrumors G3

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2012
    #15
    After playing with one in the store I'm very curious about it.

    I'm just not a fan of the iPad. My iPad 3 can't do anything my iPhone 4S can't do. I'm currently typing this in tapatalk on my 4S with my iPad 3 in arms reach. This is just easier.

    I also have an N10 but I think that's a little better because widgets can be used better. And I don't use an Android phone so that helps lol.
     
  16. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

    Staff Member

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    Location:
    Boston
    #16
    I think this is the major reason. More so for the pro version which is due to come out soon. I think I read the pro version will be 900 dollars. I understand that its more aimed at enterprises but still wouldn't an enterprise rather buy two iPads which has much more apps and popularity then a single tablet that few folks are buying at 900 dollars?
     
  17. zhenya macrumors 603

    zhenya

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    Jan 6, 2005
    #17
    While that's a good potential use case, I'm not convinced its going to be all that easy in practice. How long is it going to take to import gigs of photos to the RT, process them (with what software?) and then export them to a portable drive? It'd still be much easier to carry a MacBook Air or ultra book and an ipad mini or other small tablet of choice, rather than trying to force one device to do everything, and then having to carry a bag of peripherals as well.

    I really want to like the RT. I'm tempted to buy one despite being a happy ipad user. I love that MS has taken design seriously. I wish their oem's were following suit. I just can't justify it though. I don't need office, and the RT won't integrate well into my Apple household. I hope they continue to refine it though.
     
  18. ipsychedelic macrumors 6502a

    ipsychedelic

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    Mar 8, 2012
    #18
    Kinda.
    I mean, the Pro is supposed to be the "real deal" here, as the RT is more of the guinea pig (although of course they already had the Pro ready), and people will have to wait for the 'MS-Store' to slowly catch up as developers port their apps (if possible in all senses) to ARM architecture....
    The Pro then stands as a "Look at me, I run Windows 8 alright? Full fledge!!!", and even if Windows 8 has a "strong" touch component, it makes you wonder indeed, who is going to buy the Pro if there are already pretty good laptop choices on the 900-1000 USD range?
    Maybe people who want something even lighter than a macbook air-ish win8 laptop? People who want the touchscreen?

    I don't think the real competition for the Pro, at that price range, is any other tablet, more like laptops.

    Other than that, I don't know, it feels like the deceased Zune.
     
  19. HishamAkhtar macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2011
    #19
    I don't think so. Apple advertised the smart cover/case for the iPad but it's still an optional extra. Perhaps $50 would have been a better price for it since it costs them around $20 to make...
     
  20. zhenya macrumors 603

    zhenya

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    Jan 6, 2005
    #20
    Yes but it's pretty obvious that the Apple cover is not integral to the experience the way Microsoft is trying to push their cover.
     
  21. Rodster macrumors 68040

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    May 15, 2007
    #21
    I tend to agree as well. I had a go with Windows RT on an ASUS T600 at Best Buy and I thought Windows 8 was pretty slick and did things on the UI side that iOS doesn't do.

    If Microsoft really wanted these things to fly off the shelves they should have subsidized a $399-450 price point, which is what they did with the original XBOX.
     
  22. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    Boston
    #22
    When MS unveiled the surface I wanted one - still do. I think the idea of running the full version has some benefits, but as the price was leaked out, it was way beyond what I'm willing to pay.

    Even if it had a fruit logo on the back, I'd not want to spend 900 dollars for a tablet. Its just way too much money (to me). The RT version doesn't have the same draw due to the under-powered CPU, and lack of software
     
  23. Vetvito macrumors 6502a

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    Sep 30, 2012
    #23
    That blows. How many businesses actually upgrade Office versions. We've been on 2007 for a long time.
     
  24. IbisDoc, Dec 29, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2012

    IbisDoc macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2010
    #24
    The kickstand is awesome. The live tiles are awesome. The machine is totally underpowered. Microsoft office (the only reason to purchase the damn thing) is unusable. Tried to edit one of my word documents on it - there's a huge delay when scrolling, it stutters, lags, freezes.

    Shameful when these companies release underpowered products for a premium price. I'm almost as irritated as I was when I purchased that criminally underpowered first generation MacBook Air, which will always stand a the best example of a company's cynical exploitation of consumers.
     
  25. Rodster macrumors 68040

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    May 15, 2007
    #25
    That's why I think the best W8 hybrid tablet going is the Dell XPS-12 but again it's freakin' $1300. No thanks !
     

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