Microsoft Windows Officially Broken


angelwatt

Moderator emeritus
Aug 16, 2005
7,842
7
USA
While reading this I was invisioning Gates red in the face pulling his hair out in frustration over the fact that his dream was becoming a nightmare and him fighting off the realization that Longhorn would never be. I almost feel sorry for him ... almost :D

Too bad a couple of intelligent people worked to save the system and had the balls to tell Gates that Longhorn was dead and that they'd need to go back to the drawing board. I'm sure that took some guts, but with Gates' small physique he isn't exactly intimidating in a muscular way, haha.
 

stridey

macrumors 65816
Jan 21, 2005
1,136
0
Massachusetts, Connecticut
Not to nitpick the article and totally neglect the content matter, but...

Accordingly, according to the Journal, Microsoft then went down the Linux path of first developing a solid kernel for what's now called Vista.
What kind of sentance is that? "Accordingly, according"? Great job guys... :rolleyes:
 

SiliconAddict

macrumors 603
Jun 19, 2003
5,889
0
Chicago, IL
Seriously though. I think Microsoft is finally getting "it".

This by far is the best news in the article:

Accordingly, according to the Journal, Microsoft then went down the Linux path of first developing a solid kernel for what's now called Vista. It is now adding the features it wants, one by one.

Its only taken MS the better part of a decade to get "it"
 

edesignuk

Moderator emeritus
Mar 25, 2002
19,077
1
London, England
SiliconAddict said:
Its only taken MS the better part of a decade to get "it"
And now they (or if they) have "it", should we be worried? I have been reading up on Vista a little recently (my work is PC support), many of the features do sound impressive...now if they are actually going to work, that's something else ;)
 

bryanc

macrumors 6502
Feb 12, 2003
335
0
Fredericton, NB Canada
This is exactly what Microsoft has needed, and I'm much more confident that Vista, or at least one of its descendants, will be a great OS.

What this illustrates very clearly is that Microsoft needs competition to force it to improve. If Linux, Apple and Google weren't leading the way, Microsoft wouldn't be forced to follow.

Back in 2000, when Microsoft was buying its way out of the Anti-trust judgement, the remedy everyone was talking about was breaking MS up into three smaller, more agile companies. Back then, there were many of us who, despite being disgusted at MS's egregious abuse of its monopoly and generally poor products, argued that even MS would benefit from such a restructuring. It seems that now, even MS recognizes this, and is going ahead and doing to themselves what they avoided having the DOJ do to them.

The only downside to this is that the 'new Microsoft' may make a good enough OS to hold onto it's monopoly, and effectively stop the rise of alternative computing platforms like Linux and MacOS. If they succeed in doing this, we'll be back into the situation we had in the late 90's, with no competition, and a stagnating industry as a result.

Even people who love using Microsoft's software should appreciate Apple, Linux and Google as the competitors that stimulate Microsoft to develop new things (and, yes, I know... these aren't new things... they're largely copied from Apple, Google and Linux, but that's not the point).

Cheers
 

cal6n

macrumors 68000
Jul 25, 2004
1,935
24
Gloucester, UK
Hmmm...

Using this approach (inspired by Linux, they say. Copied from the open source community and a certain long term rival of theirs, more like...) Microsoft might actually be able to produce a working operating system. What would be really innovative would be to ditch DOS and use a Unix core. Backwards compatability may be a problem, though. Perhaps they could boot a stripped down version of XP within Vista, when required, and call it "Legacy Mode" or something...
 

Stella

macrumors G3
Apr 21, 2003
8,273
4,636
Canada
This is standard microsoft practice.

When a new version of windows is released, microsoft trash the previous version. They want to tell you why you should buy the next release of windows.

Since microsoft have never released a piece of good software, ever, I really don't think Longhorn / vista / whatever is going to change this suitation.
 

Chef Medeski

macrumors 6502a
Jun 14, 2005
983
0
New York, NY
stridey said:
Not to nitpick the article and totally neglect the content matter, but...



What kind of sentance is that? "Accordingly, according"? Great job guys... :rolleyes:
The guy also repeated the same sentence within two paragraphs. The reason why microsoft is going towards a new business plan of three companies in order to be nimbler and productive. That sentence was said twice in the first page. Some writer....
 
yeah, this thing's rife with grammatical errors. Seriously bad reporting.

But then again, wow, if microsoft actually did this, started clean, with a core of good software, and only built on as made sense... that would be something. That's exactly what's needed for a good OS. All the features they didn't end up putting in would actually be a good thing if they got rid of the bloat. Meanwhile, I'm actually kind of hoping apple sees a bit of the same light, because (thought it's no where NEAR as bad as XP) OS X is getting a little bloaty and unstable, at least on my machine.
 

nagromme

macrumors G5
May 2, 2002
12,551
1,186
Interesting article. Scrapping the thing and starting over is indeed what Windows needs. That and some copying of Mac OS X features ;)

It will be interesting to see how much of a "total fresh start" they can really pull off. And, if they do, if the transition from old to new will be seamless for users.
 

Mainyehc

macrumors 6502a
Mar 14, 2004
589
121
Lisbon, Portugal
cal6n said:
Hmmm...

Using this approach (inspired by Linux, they say. Copied from the open source community and a certain long term rival of theirs, more like...) Microsoft might actually be able to produce a working operating system. What would be really innovative would be to ditch DOS and use a Unix core. Backwards compatability may be a problem, though. Perhaps they could boot a stripped down version of XP within Vista, when required, and call it "Legacy Mode" or something...
Classic Mode? :p (someone had to say it... :rolleyes: )
 

brentonbrenton

macrumors member
Oct 4, 2002
61
31
this really illustrated the scene much like the titanic; where google, apple and opensource software had burst holes in the bottom of the rusty ms tin-can and now we were watching the ship, rear in the air, sinking.

can we expect to see ms adopt opensource software [maybe as far as a unix core?] into windows in a few years and claim it a saviour and pretend like they were the first to do it? they practically just buy what they want these days and paste it together with used band-aids, lazy is as lazy does

no matter what, longhorn with be another in a long line of stinkers from go to woe
 

ibook30

macrumors 6502a
Jun 4, 2005
815
3
2,000 light years from home
edesignuk said:
And now they (or if they) have "it", should we be worried? I have been reading up on Vista a little recently (my work is PC support), many of the features do sound impressive...now if they are actually going to work, that's something else ;)
Fair statement. M$ can make impressive stuff. But- one of the reasons I got back to Apple was the Microsoft software often fails. Ho hum.

Whenever I read about this sort of stuff I wonder what part is truthful - and where do the calculated media maneuvers end. I am anxious to see more stories on this- and how M$ spins it. I'm sure it'll be a fun ride! I can see a lot of good PR for Microsoft in this- (if) when they release the software, it'll be that much of a bigger deal with a little mythology and street lore behind it. And they can appeal as a pseudo underdog - a phoenix rising from it's ashes.
 

hansen

macrumors regular
Feb 12, 2004
158
0
Denmark
Stella said:
This is standard microsoft practice.

When a new version of windows is released, microsoft trash the previous version. They want to tell you why you should buy the next release of windows.

Since microsoft have never released a piece of good software, ever, I really don't think Longhorn / vista / whatever is going to change this suitation.
bla bla bla

One could easily write a little script that kept forums like this busy with interesting and groundbreaking arguments like this... come on!
 

Mindcrime

macrumors regular
Oct 24, 2003
134
46
Houston, Texas
Really poorly written article. I love how the author holds Google up as the gold standard of next generation code programming, when in fact Google doesn't have an OS. The guy should have looked harder at Apple and OS X, which did basically what Microsoft is now doing - building a brand new OS from the ground up.
 

weckart

macrumors 601
Nov 7, 2004
4,665
1,656
cal6n said:
Hmmm...

What would be really innovative would be to ditch DOS and use a Unix core. Backwards compatability may be a problem, though. Perhaps they could boot a stripped down version of XP within Vista, when required, and call it "Legacy Mode" or something...
Microsoft achieved this innovation as far back as 1992 when the Beta of NT 3.1 was released. Neither NT 3, 4 nor 5 (aka Win2k and XP) uses DOS for its kernel; that was reserved for the "consumer" OSes Windows 1.0 to 3.11, 95, 98 and ME. As for Unix, Windows 3.51 was supposedly POSIX compatible FWIW.
 

SiliconAddict

macrumors 603
Jun 19, 2003
5,889
0
Chicago, IL
weckart said:
Microsoft achieved this innovation as far back as 1992 when the Beta of NT 3.1 was released. Neither NT 3, 4 nor 5 (aka Win2k and XP) uses DOS for its kernel; that was reserved for the "consumer" OSes Windows 1.0 to 3.11, 95, 98 and ME. As for Unix, Windows 3.51 was supposedly POSIX compatible FWIW.
And it still is. There is still a subsystem for POSIX in NT = 2K = XP. It just hasn't been kept up. I believe it was co developed with IBM who helped in the development of the original Windows NT before they parted ways and worked on WARP.