More Bali bombings!

Bern

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Again Bali has received attacks at the hands of it's own people.

The way I see it the answer is simple, we should stop holidaying in Bali. Of course that's what these people want and sure it will hurt the economy of Bali which supposedly depends on the tourist dollar. The bombers, attackers, terrorists or whatever you prefer to refer them by don't agree with western society way of life, but they don't seem to mind accepting our western money and education (Australia has a good portion of foreign Indonesian university students). So I say do what they want and don't give it to them. Don't chose Bali as your holiday destination and we shouldn't support them economically or educationally.

I am not racist at all, my 11 year long partner is Chinese, but I'm sick and tired of these people taking with one hand and slapping us with the other. At the end of day it has to be all or nothing. If these countries want to discard western influences than who are we to say that we won't stop forcing it down their throats. I don't care if the loss of tourism to Bali results in their economic demise, it is after all what they want.
 

skunk

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Jun 29, 2002
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Bern said:
The bombers, attackers, terrorists or whatever you prefer to refer them by don't agree with western society way of life, but they don't seem to mind accepting our western money and education (Australia has a good portion of foreign Indonesian university students).
Have you any evidence that any of the bombers has benefitted from an Australian education?

I am not racist at all, my 11 year long partner is Chinese, but I'm sick and tired of these people taking with one hand and slapping us with the other. At the end of day it has to be all or nothing. If these countries want to discard western influences than who are we to say that we won't stop forcing it down their throats. I don't care if the loss of tourism to Bali results in their economic demise, it is after all what they want.
You are indeed racist, despite having a Chinese partner. "but I'm sick and tired of these people taking with one hand and slapping us with the other" says it all. Who are "these people"? Are they the same in both cases? Or are they just brown?
 

DeSnousa

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Jan 20, 2005
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Could not agree more, we should stop trips to Bali. Besides Taiwan is a good substitution of what I have heard. I'm sick of these poor attacks which is killing their own people too.
 

Bern

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skunk said:
Have you any evidence that any of the bombers has benefitted from an Australian education?

You are indeed racist, despite having a Chinese partner. "but I'm sick and tired of these people taking with one hand and slapping us with the other" says it all. Who are "these people"? Are they the same in both cases? Or are they just brown?
You are quite wrong! I am not at all racist, you don't know me. What would you have preferred me to say other than "these people"? Are they not people in your eyes?
 

pseudobrit

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Jul 23, 2002
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Bern said:
You are quite wrong! I am not at all racist, you don't know me. What would you have preferred me to say other than "these people"? Are they not people in your eyes?
What's the difference between the people who "taking" your money and the people who bomb things? Apparently nothing, because according to you they're all the same group of "these people."
 

Bern

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pseudobrit said:
What's the difference between the people who "taking" your money and the people who bomb things? Apparently nothing, because according to you they're all the same group of "these people."
That doesn't make me racist.

I've been to most of these countries and the simple fact is Indonesia does not give two hoots about western society, whether you are talking about the bombers or not.

Rather than skim over my initial post and respond in an emotional and trendy, politically correct way accept the fact that it is in fact western society's insistence that we force our values and way of life onto such nations as Indonesia that result in these kinds of conflicts.

What was Indonesia before our society decided to go over there and influence it's way of life? Were the Indonesians less happy or less capable before we went over there and shared our materialistic views to them? I think not. Who are we to decide how people should live in their own society? But of course now that we have enforced our agenda onto countries like Indonesia we must continue to support them? Otherwise the very fabric of consumerism may destabilise?

I have heard people say "I will still continue to fly to Bali for my holiday despite these events" Great, in other words "I will continue to push my western beliefs onto these people despite them not wanting us in their own land".

I am sorry for the locals there, I truly am. But who is ultimately responsible for this happening in the first place? The terrorists doing the bombings or the people who are enforcing their way of life onto this country? And which of the two are racist, the people who don't want us there or us for thinking their way of life doesn't measure up to what ours?
 

zimv20

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Jul 18, 2002
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Bern said:
I have heard people say "I will still continue to fly to Bali for my holiday despite these events" Great, in other words "I will continue to push my western beliefs onto these people despite them not wanting us in their own land".
not sure i buy the tie between being on holiday somewhere and pushing one's values on the host country.
 

solvs

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Jun 25, 2002
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I think we should just nuke them. ;)

(in reference to the comments by a few posters here that we don't see too often anymore)
 

Bern

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zimv20 said:
not sure i buy the tie between being on holiday somewhere and pushing one's values on the host country.
Why would you go to Bali instead of the south of France for example? Another example Indonesia is a Muslim country where consumption of alcohol is against their religion, however bars are set up to cater for westerners.
 

Bern

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skunk said:
Presumably in your case because it's a damned sight closer.
I've been to the south of France :rolleyes: as well, but then Australians are recognised as being well travelled people and one of the most multicultural nations in the world.
 

Bern

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Peterkro said:
I suppose bringing up the treatment of Aboriginals would be an idea at this point.
Yeah that's very pertinent. Perhaps I could mention the treatment of the Irish. But then again it was the British who came to Australia and slaughtered thousands of aboriginals wasn't it?
 

skunk

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Bern said:
Yeah that's very pertinent. Perhaps I could mention the treatment of the Irish. But then again it was the British who came to Australia and slaughtered thousands of aboriginals wasn't it?
Don't say I didn't warn you....
;)
 

Peterkro

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Aug 17, 2004
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I don't know were you get the idea I would defend the British treatment of the Irish from.I lived in Oz for a number of years and spend time in many places away from the east coast.The treatment of the indigenous population is appalling.I have some very strong opinions on racism in the UK but nothing I've seen comes close.Also I'm not British.
 

zimv20

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Jul 18, 2002
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Bern said:
Why would you go to Bali instead of the south of France for example?
eh? though i've never been to indonesia, i've wanted to see it. how does the south of france become an alternative? why are you being the holiday nazi?
 

Thanatoast

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Dec 3, 2002
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zimv20 said:
not sure i buy the tie between being on holiday somewhere and pushing one's values on the host country.
I think this is the major point of contention, here, Bern. If zim chooses to go to Bali and drink at bars and send postcards and go scuba diving - and there are willing sellers of these services - then you can't really say that our post-card-sending, mai-tai-drinking culture is being *forced* on them.

*Some* people from Bali choose to accept and embrace our "culture", while some choose to violently resist any form of "contamination". Saying "these people" don't like us doesn't differentiate between one set of people and the other - hence the racist tag.

Will you stop visiting London because of the tube bombings? Under the logic of your original statement, you would have to.

Sorry for the repeating of themes and excessive use of puncuation.
 

Bern

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Thanatoast said:
I think this is the major point of contention, here, Bern. If zim chooses to go to Bali and drink at bars and send postcards and go scuba diving - and there are willing sellers of these services - then you can't really say that our post-card-sending, mai-tai-drinking culture is being *forced* on them.

*Some* people from Bali choose to accept and embrace our "culture", while some choose to violently resist any form of "contamination". Saying "these people" don't like us doesn't differentiate between one set of people and the other - hence the racist tag.

Will you stop visiting London because of the tube bombings? Under the logic of your original statement, you would have to.

Sorry for the repeating of themes and excessive use of puncuation.
Ok I do see your point, absolutely.

But what do you mean when you say some people from Bali choose to accept and embrace our culture? Again what should I have said instead of these people? Are they not people?

As for not visiting London because of bombings, absolutely. I avoided England during the IRA bombings for the same reason.