Moscow: largest election protest in years

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Solomani, Aug 10, 2019.

  1. Solomani, Aug 10, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2019

    Solomani macrumors 68040

    Solomani

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    #1
    50,000 demonstrate in Moscow in third weekend of protests for fair elections


    Too bad the USA has a Puppet President and his sidekick Moscow Mitch. Otherwise, any smart and proactive POTUS, along with an Intelligence services (CIA, FBI, NSA) that is on-the-level with him, would have easily taken advantage of this situation.

    If Moscow enjoys meddling in US elections…. then the US administration should reciprocate and pour GASOLINE onto these burgeoning Moscow protests, fanning the flames in Moscow. :D


    AAFD4iC.img.jpeg

    --- Post Merged, Aug 10, 2019 ---
    P.S. — in general I dislike the US strategy of regime change against sovereign nations. But this is an exception where Russia has clearly committed election meddling (which is attempted regime change) in the USA, therefore that makes Russia a valid retaliatory target for US-sponsored regime change IMO.
     
  2. FrankieTDouglas macrumors 65816

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    #2
    Oh look, another left-wing person advocating for a regime change war.

    Some things never change.
     
  3. stylinexpat macrumors 65816

    stylinexpat

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    #3
    Doesn’t this happen during every election in Moscow and Turkey..? In the end the same dictators win again o_O

    Local police and local authorities are not as nice to them though as they are in Hong Kong or Taiwan when they protest.
     
  4. Solomani thread starter macrumors 68040

    Solomani

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    #4
    Oh look, another right-wing Trump-Kremlin apologist who doesn't read the full OP post.

    Some effort in reading comprehension and you would have noticed what was already posted above:
     
  5. Tech198 macrumors G5

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    Is it me, or are these protests all central of communism clash ? There is one in HK, and just across the boarder is China.. and now comes Russia to join the action.
     
  6. itsmemuffins macrumors 68040

    itsmemuffins

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    #6
    Who’s to say this is t the result of US interface?
     
  7. FrankieTDouglas macrumors 65816

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    #7
    Not sure why you’re making assumptions like that. It’s not like I’m overtly trying to signal some sort of political stance on a computer company message board by using an illustrative negative avatar of the current president, and including him in my signature for even when I’m posting about phone gadgets elsewhere on the forum.

    Anyway. I did read what you said. That normally you’re totallly, like for real, super against them, but somehow you can cover your eyes in this one instance and support an action you’re normally, like, totally against on every level.
     
  8. stylinexpat macrumors 65816

    stylinexpat

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    And one in Palestine/Israel now too. Notice how each one is handled ;)
     
  9. Zenithal macrumors G3

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    The Russia problem is unique in that since communism fell, they haven't really had true elections. Communist leaders aside, no one living would even remember the Tsarist period with clear recollection. It's been a known fact since communism fell that elections are mishandled. The problems you see now are the young vs the old who have a golden memory of things before they changed. They're the one still holding out on communism somehow making a comeback. The young simply don't want corrupt leaders, which is a common trend in Russia. They make corruption in other parts of the world look like a joke. They'll go to university, put the time in and learn but there's no viable jobs in Russia or the former Bloc unless they expatriate to another country, a western one. Leaving everything behind them.

    The Russians have always placed emphasis on hard math and science, but job opportunities are slim. It's a terrible place to live in that regard unless you want to throw away that education and work simple jobs or in manufacturing. What many don't understand is the Russia today isn't the Russia during the USSR, and that wasn't the Tsarist and prior Russia either. While the Russians have great national pride, they fall short in acknowledging the reality of that pride, mostly because they killed everyone who developed a reason for that pride in the first place. When Putin dies or is taken out, there will be a massive power vacuum the likes we haven't seen in over half a century. It'll be a blood bath.

    The Russian people deserve better.


    On Trump: Republican voter. Don't like him. Don't support his Presidency. But he'll be here for another year if he loses, maybe another four if he wins. Reality is he won't be a "lifetime" leader like Putin. He's joked about it, but people would sooner physically revolt and we have the means thanks to our constitution. In 20 years, there will come along a liberal or conservative that will cause people to think warmly of Trump. I guarantee it.

    His kids stand no chance. There has not been a single politician who won because they emulated Trump. Mr. Trump is very much Mr. Trump; you cannot emulate yourself to a man and expect the people to fall for it. As dumb as the man is, he has charisma, and you cannot fake charisma.
     
  10. Number-Six macrumors 6502

    Number-Six

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    You say this as if the US hasn’t been trying to manipulate world events for the past 50-60 years.
     
  11. Solomani thread starter macrumors 68040

    Solomani

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    You must have a short memory. You did exactly that with your first post. You took a hard right-wing Trump-lover POLITICAL position attacking "all thoze left-wingers".

    That's not political attack or stance? :rolleyes:

     
  12. FrankieTDouglas macrumors 65816

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    Nah, you don’t have to be a hard right-wing Trump-lover, or even right-wing for that matter, to be able to acknowledge the left’s current infatuation with regime change wars. It’s like they saw Bush’s ideas in 2001, voted for it, then decided they wanted to take lead on them afterward.
     
  13. yaxomoxay macrumors 68040

    yaxomoxay

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    Question: do you think that the US has ever meddled in Soviet and/or Russian elections and/or government formation?
     
  14. stylinexpat macrumors 65816

    stylinexpat

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  15. Solomani thread starter macrumors 68040

    Solomani

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    Of course it has, that's a given since the Cold War. My OP point is not denying that. My OP post is simply stating that our current Administration should ratch up the pressure on Moscow right now as direct retaliation for Putin's meddling in 2016 Elections. It also to send a message to Comrade Putin, should he be tempted to try it again in 2020. My secondary point is that IMHO the current POTUS because of his fondness for Dictator Putin, will be unlikely to crank up the pressure on Moscow now (at a time when tens of thousands of Muscovites are bold enough to protest against their own tyrant).

    You probably disagree with my secondary point, I take it.
     
  16. yaxomoxay macrumors 68040

    yaxomoxay

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    But then you should also accept that from the Russian point of view, their actions are a retaliation for US involvement in Russian affairs. In other words, if we go by your standards (and I do not disagree with them), their actions are as legitimate as the Americans'.

    I don't necessarily disagree - if nothing else, because I like elections in which no one really meddles - but for the good of me I can't find a reasonable way of doing so. We know that US and Russia always meddled in each other affairs, but today in the XXI century we also have the problem of the 24/7 high tech news feeds through virtually infinite channels including social media. Adding sanctions to Russia, or crushing the Venezuela regime or toppling Russian-friendly countries, will not stop Russian hackers and spies from opening a plethora of Facebook and Twitter accounts that are meant to destabilize the political process (independently on the candidate). The Russian serious involvement through social media began around 2013 and 2014 according to the Mueller's report. This is about 3 years BEFORE the 2016 elections, we didn't even know who the candidates to the primaries were going to be. I expect that the Russian planning for the operations started at least two years prior. I don't think that there is anything that the US can do to stop Russian meddling using foreign policy tools, the same way that there is nothing that the Russians can do to stop US meddling. Russia minimizes the US operations' impact by crushing down its own freedoms. Personally, I think that that would be the only way even in the US, that is a reduction of the freedom of the press, and social media regulations, which is of course something I can't agree with.
    To add another layer, the above does not even consider China which I am sure is also meddling in American domestic policy.
     
  17. TheFluffyDuck macrumors 6502

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    This is a Russain problem to fix. First, they had the Czars, they got a Duma in 1905 the only free election they ever had, that was revoked first by the Czar because he wanted to be an autocrat, then in 1917 communists dissolved the second duma during the revolution, plunging them into darkness. Then in 1993 all they had elections for the first time since before the 1st world war, but since then corruption has maintained that Putin is in power one way or the other.

    This is Russias problem to sort out. They have been trying for over a century now. If Spain and Italy have taught us anything, the autocrat will need to die before democracy can prevail, and so long as men die, neither will liberty.
     
  18. upandown macrumors 6502a

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    hahahah that was good and hard to argue against
     
  19. stylinexpat macrumors 65816

    stylinexpat

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    In Moscow if you protest you get a beating like you do in Syria,Saudi,China,US,Palestine/Israel and others around the world. In Hong Kong and Taiwan things are a bit different. Before we had what wa called the Arab Spring. Something new arising now..?

     

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18 August 10, 2019