Mother and daughter fight back against an armed robbery.

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by LIVEFRMNYC, Mar 3, 2018.

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Did they make the smart decision?

  1. YES!!! ABSOLUTELY!!! People will know not to try them again.

    33.3%
  2. Wrong timing. If he's leaving, just call the cops. Money is not worth the risk of your life.

    26.7%
  3. NO!!! They put their lives at greater risk. Someone else might attempt to rob them again anyway.

    26.7%
  4. YES!!! But only if they knew what they were doing. They were shooting wildly out of emotion.

    20.0%
  5. Stronger firepower is what was needed!!! Seems like they had a 38 and 22.(Not sure)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. LIVEFRMNYC macrumors 604

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    Oct 27, 2009
    #1
    Watch this video ......











    Now I would imagine that most pro gun people would celebrate this and say GREAT JOB defending what's your's. And I agree, but with the exception that it was actually a POOR JOB, and they are extremely lucky not to be seriously injured or fatally shot.

    The guy was leaving while still holding his weapon. Best thing to do is let him leave. But nope, they shot at him and put themselves in a situation that eventually the robber had the mother arms, and gained possession of her weapon. Also, the daughter almost shot her mother, while the mother and robber was in a struggle. There were so mistakes on their part, I'm pretty sure they survived based on the robber which seemed like a complete inexperienced idiot. If it were someone else, they wouldn't have been so lucky.

    In the second video, they claimed they saved each other's life. NO!!! They put their own lives at greater risk.


    What do you guys think? I personally think they just have guns for store protection, but never had a plan incase something like this actually happened.
     
  2. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    #2
    They executed poorly, once he fled they should have just kept the weapon drawn in case he came back, but had the other one dial the police, they both let their guard down.

    As soon as he started to re-enter the store they should have emptied their guns into him.

    Really dangerous for the woman to fire at the guy while her mom was struggling with him.
     
  3. Gutwrench Contributor

    Gutwrench

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2011
    #3
    Their lives were in grave danger. They were in survival mode. Good for them. I’m glad the guy has a few new holes to breath out of and the two females were physically unharmed. Lastly, I hope he goes to prison for life.
     
  4. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    #4
    The women handled it badly, but fortunately it turned out ok.
     
  5. bopajuice, Mar 3, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2018

    bopajuice Suspended

    bopajuice

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    #5
    Even with a plan it never goes as "Planned". These two appeared to have ZERO training.

    She was shooting at the guy out the front door? What about bystanders?

    Extreme luck. Gun or no gun, they are very lucky to be alive. I was amazed the daughter shot at the guy while he was struggling with her mom just a foot or two away. I don't care how good of a shot you are. Heat of the moment I guess.

    We can all look back in hindsight, review and critique the video and their actions, but either way they were just very lucky.

    Why the guy came back after being shot at is a mystery to me.

    This is a great example of why CCW's for everybody or teachers with guns is a bad idea. Training would be the only way, but how many of these "right to carry" citizens would complete proper training?
     
  6. BeeGood, Mar 3, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2018

    BeeGood macrumors 68000

    BeeGood

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    #6
    Like everyone else has already pointed out, it was poor execution. They should have both opened fire on the guy as he walked back in. It’s incredibly that nobody died.

    I don’t know what mom was thinking letting him approach her like that, but I guess you never know how you’ll react in a situation like that.
    --- Post Merged, Mar 3, 2018 ---
    That’s not quite what happened. They didn’t fire at him until the robber came back into the store and approached them as they hid behind the counter. Aside from shooting at him while he fled, I don’t see anything wrong with what they did up until the robber came back into the store for a third time. At that point, they should have ordered him to the ground and if he didn’t comply, they should have unloaded on him.
     
  7. ouimetnick macrumors 68020

    ouimetnick

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    #7
    Did they shoot him with BBs? Didn’t seem to slow the guy down much. Also the daughter nearly shot her mom..
     
  8. Snoopy4, Mar 3, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2018

    Snoopy4 macrumors 6502a

    Snoopy4

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    Dec 29, 2014
    #8
    Great job. Kept a deranged criminal from ruining their lives.

    Mom is a god shot and daughter was ready for backup.

    Almost shot her mom? LOL. You can’t make up some of these posts. The daughter did no such thing.

    Guns likely .22s. .45 would have ended his ass.
     
  9. LIVEFRMNYC thread starter macrumors 604

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    Oct 27, 2009
    #9
    1:35-1:36 ... Literally a split second before the mother was in the line of sight. The shot was fired between that second. NOT GOOD!!!!
     
  10. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #10
    1:33 on the first video. This is still a tricky situation since she allowed the guy to get close enough to grapple her, I don't know what she was thinking.
     
  11. LIVEFRMNYC thread starter macrumors 604

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    Oct 27, 2009
    #10
    Yea, she should have shot him at that moment when he was approaching her before the struggle.
    --- Post Merged, Mar 3, 2018 ---
    They weren't in survival mode when he was leaving. Some people died shooting or chasing a robber. It's not worth it.
     
  12. Gutwrench Contributor

    Gutwrench

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    Jan 2, 2011
    #11
    Oh so easy for you to say from that laz-e-boy of yours on Monday.

    The whole event on video was survival mode. Not everyone in these situations act like Jason Borne. Survival mode easily runs for many minutes afterwards.
     
  13. LIVEFRMNYC thread starter macrumors 604

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    #12

    So would they have went after the robber without a gun? We all know the answer to that. People are more logical and less risk takers without a gun. But with a gun, they think they can solve every single situation that comes their way.

    It's best to act as if you don't have a gun, if the danger is leaving your from your presence.

    What they did by shooting at him while he was leaving, was give him a reason to come back. And when he came back, he gained possession of one of their guns. That's ABSOLUTE PROOF that it was a bad idea, and could have been deadly for them. Now what if the mother was by herself, she would have been without defense against someone that has her weapon.
     
  14. linuxcooldude macrumors 68020

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    Mar 1, 2010
    #13
    After watching it several times, I think some people are assuming several things about the video. Keep in mind it was edited for television and the timeline might be accurate. It seems she only starts shooting when he comes behind counter, she fires once. Then as he's running towards the door she keeps on shooting. We need an unedited version to get an accurate account.
     
  15. LIVEFRMNYC thread starter macrumors 604

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    #14
    The video's not edited. It runs straight through.
     
  16. BeeGood macrumors 68000

    BeeGood

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    #15
    All right, so what if the two ladies don’t grab their guns and the guys intent is to rape/kill when he comes back in? You’re assuming that his return trip was to continue robbing them.

    Except that the guy came back with who knows what intentions. So, no, this principle might not have worked out for them.

    Huh? Are we watching the same video? He empties the register, leaves and then the ladies grab their guns and duck behind the register. They didn’t shoot until he came back and approached them behind the register.

    Their guns didn’t cause him to return, he decided to do that for reasons unknown. They had no clue what he was planning to do to them and neither do we.

    This isn’t proof of anything, because, again, we have no clue what happens if the women aren’t armed.
     
  17. linuxcooldude macrumors 68020

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    Mar 1, 2010
    #16
    Yeah, I was talking about abc news version but forgot about unedited version when ch I watched. But yeah, they didn't start shooting till he came back into store, behind the counter where they were hiding. They were justified to continue to shoot as he left the store as he could again return which he did.
     
  18. LIVEFRMNYC thread starter macrumors 604

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    Oct 27, 2009
    #17
    Yea, you're right. For some reason I thought she shot at him as he was leaving the first time. So that changes my stance on things.

    But they were still extremely unprepared and put themselves in more danger numerous of times.

    The daughter still almost shoot her mother. And the mother allowed him to gain possession of her gun.
     
  19. BeeGood macrumors 68000

    BeeGood

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    #18
    Agreed. They shouldn’t have fired at him as he fled and they should have opened fire as he came back in. Without those two decisions, mom doesn’t get in a wrestling match for her weapon and doesn’t nearly get shot by the daughter.

    But I’m not gonna armchair-quarterback them. I’ve been in an armed robbery before and you just never know how you’ll react unless you’ve had a good amount of tactical training. Most civilians aren’t going to execute perfectly.
     
  20. LIVEFRMNYC thread starter macrumors 604

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    Oct 27, 2009
    #19
    I agree, but my point is so many just purchase a gun, and that's it.

    It's like how everyone has a jack and a spare tire. But it's amazing that people don't touch it until they get a flat. Then they end up spending more time trying to figure out how to work it than it takes to swap the tire, and some can't even figure it out.

    Now apply that to a life threatening situation ..... That's how many treat their guns, like a jack they never expect to use. And when the poo poo hits the fan, they have no second nature to rely on.
     
  21. Gutwrench, Mar 3, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2018

    Gutwrench Contributor

    Gutwrench

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2011
    #20
    1. That hypothetical is totally irrelevant to our exchange.

    2. Btw - his returning without the shotgun changed nothing there. Lethal force was still authorized. I don’t think any reasonable person would see it any other way.

    More Monday morning Laz-E-Boy talk.

    Feel free to have this discussion with others because it has nothing to do with this crime.
     
  22. LIVEFRMNYC thread starter macrumors 604

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    Oct 27, 2009
    #21
    It has EVERYTHING to do with the crime. Because the probability of those women surviving a similar situation again making the same mistakes is extremely slim.

    Your mentality of nothing but praise, and not pointing out what should be corrected is dangerous.
     
  23. Gutwrench Contributor

    Gutwrench

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    Jan 2, 2011
    #22
    Pffft. You disagreed with my initial post that they were in survival mode. Situations like this happen in the real world and never go perfectly like they do from a comfy sofa.
     
  24. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    Texas
    #23
    It was poorly handled as many other people have stated but it turned out well. This might just be pure luck.

    I'd recommend people to go through training classes if they intend to do these type of maneuvers.

    Luck can't be depended on in a situation like this. So if people are serious about carrying and using guns, they should make sure they've got training/plans in place.
     
  25. LIVEFRMNYC thread starter macrumors 604

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    Oct 27, 2009
    #24
    Nobody's asking for perfect. In this case, the robber took the mother's own gun, the daughter almost shot her mother, and they had no type of confidence in their actions at all.
     
  26. blackfox macrumors 65816

    blackfox

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    #25
    Absurd. For better or worse, the guy just wanted the money. He got we came for. There's surveillance and eye-witnesses. He left w/o incident. Those two escalated the situation.
     

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26 March 3, 2018