MP 1,1-5,1 MP5.1 from High Sierra to Catalina with an RX5700

Temesta

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Jan 11, 2020
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Hi,

Can somebody help me with the correct steps in order to upgrade my Mac Pro 5.1 from High Sierra to Catalina, with a new RX5700 GPU ? At this moment everything in my MP 5.1 is standard with default GPU + OSX is currently updated to high sierra.
I wonder if it is actually possible to run the patched catalina (dosdude1) installer when the RX5700 is already inside the machine ?
Or is it possible to install catalina using intel HD graphics, and afterwards switch to the RX5700 ?

So is the following procedure possible ? :

- Install the latest version of the system's BootROM (Is this really necessary if high sierra is working fine ?)
- download catalina installer and patch it with dosdude1
- create USB installer
- insert RX5700
- boot from USB and install catalina with RX5700

As I understand it will always be a clean install of OSX. It does not seem to be possible to just do an update of OSX ?

Thanks
 

MarkC426

macrumors 65816
May 14, 2008
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What BootRom are you currently on?
You say standard gpu (ati 5770 presumably)?

In order to upgrade to Mojave you need a metal gpu (5770 is not), Mojave needs the latest bootrom updating (144).
Mojave will not recognise the rx5700 (This needs Catalina).

I don’t know how the dosdude patch works in regards to metal and upgrades etc (there is a thread for this).

see page 1 for bootrom info
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/mp5-1-bootrom-thread-144-0-0-0-0.2132317/
 
Last edited:

Temesta

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Jan 11, 2020
8
0
What BootRom are you currently on?
You say standard gpu (ati 5770 presumably)?

In order to upgrade to Mojave you need a metal gpu (5770 is not), Mojave needs the latest bootrom updating (144).
Mojave will not recognise the rx5700 (This needs Catalina).

I don’t know how the dosdude patch works in regards to metal and upgrades etc (there is a thread for this).

see page 1 for bootrom info
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/mp5-1-bootrom-thread-144-0-0-0-0.2132317/

I can't check my MP at this moment, but the GPU is indeed ATI HD 5770 and does not support metal...
I'm well aware of this.

The question is which steps are required to get the RX5700 working in Catalina. I don't think Mojave will even work with the RX5700 ? Or does it ?
 

MarkC426

macrumors 65816
May 14, 2008
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UK
Correct, the RX5700 needs 10.15.
Since the 5.1 doesn’t officially support Catalina, I don’t know which bootrom is needed, presumably 144.
I do know when you upgrade to Mojave it needs to update to 144.

Whether the dosdude patch works differently I don’t know.

Do you have the RX5700?
If not, then get a metal gpu and upgrade to Mojave...... 😜
Updates will be available for another 2 years (roughly).

You will be asking for trouble down the line I think by going to Catalina, with incompatibilities, unless you just want to tinker.
Every update will give you a new headache.
 

MIKX

macrumors 68000
Dec 16, 2004
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Aussie in Japan
I won't be using Catalina until it goes GM and if Dosdude1's hack is still working . . . maybe.
Mojave currently performs perfectly for my needs.

Maybe by then ( laughs ) someone will have found a way to get 32bit apps running in Catalina but that is probably very unlikely.
 
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Temesta

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Jan 11, 2020
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I haven't bought the videocard yet just because I'm unsure whether it will work out as planned. Since it's a 350 euro videocard, I don't want to waste money. The main reason I want this card is for good gaming performance in windows (dual boot). The RX580 or RX590 should be compatible with mojave, but those cards are a lot slower.

So it would be nice if someone with an RX5700 in a MP 5.1 could share some information about how to do this....
 

bsbeamer

macrumors 68040
Sep 19, 2012
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10.15.1+ is required, not 10.15. Might make a big difference for your install.

RX580 in Mojave is faster in all benchmarks and testing than RX 5700 XT in Catalina. I’ve thoroughly reported the RX 5700 XT benchmark results in eGPU. The macOS drivers for AMD 5000 series are just not good and same issues with 5500M. I would not recommend anyone purchases until this GPU until it is worked out. 10.15.3 or 10.15.4, hopefully. By the time W5700X is available, drivers better be fixed and addressed.
 
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h9826790

macrumors G5
Apr 3, 2014
14,139
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Hong Kong
I won't be using Catalina until it goes GM and if Dosdude1's hack is still working . . . maybe.
Mojave currently performs perfectly for my needs.

Maybe by then ( laughs ) someone will have found a way to get 32bit apps running in Catalina but that is probably very unlikely.
Netkas found that 3 months ago

 
Last edited:

MIKX

macrumors 68000
Dec 16, 2004
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Aussie in Japan
WOW ! Thanks h9826790 ! I haven't been following the Netkas page much lately. I'll check it out.

Is the thread in Rom Things or Video Cards ?

( Happy Chinese Lunar New Year ! )
 
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h9826790

macrumors G5
Apr 3, 2014
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WOW ! Thanks h9826790 ! I haven't been following the Netkas page much lately. I'll check it out.

Is the thread in Rom Things or Video Cards ?

( Happy Chinese Lunar New Year ! )
Just click my link. It’s on his blog, not forum.
 

MIKX

macrumors 68000
Dec 16, 2004
1,721
637
Aussie in Japan
Just click my link. It’s on his blog, not forum.
Thanks, just found it. Terminal + Netkas comes to the rescue again. 😄

But I still will not consider Catalina matures to something like 10.15.6. I did the same with Mojave and seeing how many subsequent Mojave builds were released it seems a good idea to wait.
 
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Temesta

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Jan 11, 2020
8
0
10.15.1+ is required, not 10.15. Might make a big difference for your install.

RX580 in Mojave is faster in all benchmarks and testing than RX 5700 XT in Catalina. I’ve thoroughly reported the RX 5700 XT benchmark results in eGPU. The macOS drivers for AMD 5000 series are just not good and same issues with 5500M. I would not recommend anyone purchases until this GPU until it is worked out. 10.15.3 or 10.15.4, hopefully. By the time W5700X is available, drivers better be fixed and addressed.

But you are measuring performance in OSX. I don't care since I'm not doing anything GPU intensive in OSX.
I need speed in windows / dual boot. Still it's unclear how I can update from High Sierra to Catalina with the RX5700 ?
 

tsialex

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Jun 13, 2016
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Still it's unclear how I can update from High Sierra to Catalina with the RX5700 ?
You can't. NAVI GPUs don't have drivers with High Sierra or Catalina Mojave and won't work at all, no pre-boot configuration support (Mac EFI) to rescue.
 
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Temesta

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Jan 11, 2020
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Ok ... But there are drivers in Catalina that support the RX5700. And with the dosdude1 patch, you should be able to install catalina on a MP 5.1 with an RX580 ... Right ?
So if you first install everything with the RX580 and then just switch the GPU to 5700 ? This could work ?
 

tsialex

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Jun 13, 2016
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Ok ... But there are drivers in Catalina that support the RX5700. And with the dosdude1 patch, you should be able to install catalina on a MP 5.1 with an RX580 ... Right ?
So if you first install everything with the RX580 and then just switch the GPU to 5700 ? This could work ?
After you have done all the firmware upgrades and have 144.0.0.0.0, you can do a clean install of Catalina with your RX 5700XT, no problem. You can't upgrade a previous install, but the full Mac App Store installer for 10.5.2 has the drivers. A patched dosdude installer will boot with a MP51 + 5700 XT.
 

Temesta

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Jan 11, 2020
8
0
After you have done all the firmware upgrades and have 144.0.0.0.0, you can do a clean install of Catalina with your RX 5700XT, no problem. You can't upgrade a previous install, but the full Mac App Store installer for 10.5.2 has the drivers. A patched dosdude installer will boot with a MP51 + 5700 XT.
So first I need to upgrade the firmware to 144.0.0.0.0. But can I do this without with the standard MP ati 5770 ? In your post (https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/mp5-1-bootrom-thread-144-0-0-0-0.2132317/), you say "This firmware upgrade requires a METAL supported GPU." The RX5700 is a metal GPU, but not supported in Mojave. Doing what you describe below is not possible ? Or at which point do I switch to the 5600 GPU, going from high sierra to catalina ?

Download the full Mac App Store installer for Mojave, the most recent one (10.14.6), open it and then do as the installer says to upgrade to 144.0.0.0.0. After the firmware upgrade reboot, you can close the installer app. This firmware upgrade requires a METAL supported GPU.

Confusing...

Ok, In another post you mention :

You can't upgrade MP5,1 BootROM with a RX5700XT, even if it's a METAL GPU, since it's a unsupported card with HighSierra/Mojave.


So is it correct to say that in order to upgrade the firmware to 144.0.0.0.0, it is only possible with a metal GPU, supported in Mojave ? So I first need one of the supported GPU's like the RX580. Then update firmware. Then get the patched catalina installer. And finally install Catalina with the RX5700 ... ? So I need 2 GPU's to get there ?
 
Last edited:

bsbeamer

macrumors 68040
Sep 19, 2012
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RX 5700 & RX 5700 XT both REQUIRE macOS 10.15.1+. That is the first version that included drivers. You cannot use those GPUs with Mojave (no drivers).

RX 580 works with High Sierra, Mojave and Catalina. Would recommend anyone with an MP5,1 they’re upgrading at minimum have one on a shelf for issues, if not to use as daily GPU. They’re slowing going out of stock from retailers as new, FYI.
 
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tsialex

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Jun 13, 2016
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So first I need to upgrade the firmware to 144.0.0.0.0. But can I do this without with the standard MP ati 5770 ? In your post (https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/mp5-1-bootrom-thread-144-0-0-0-0.2132317/), you say "This firmware upgrade requires a METAL supported GPU." The RX5700 is a metal GPU, but not supported in Mojave. Doing what you describe below is not possible ? Or at which point do I switch to the 5600 GPU, going from high sierra to catalina ?

Download the full Mac App Store installer for Mojave, the most recent one (10.14.6), open it and then do as the installer says to upgrade to 144.0.0.0.0. After the firmware upgrade reboot, you can close the installer app. This firmware upgrade requires a METAL supported GPU.

Confusing...
That post was written before any GPUs that work with 10.14.5+ (VII) or Catalina (NAVI) only. I'll clarify that later.

You need a METAL supported GPU that works/have drivers with HighSierra.

Ok, In another post you mention :

You can't upgrade MP5,1 BootROM with a RX5700XT, even if it's a METAL GPU, since it's a unsupported card with HighSierra/Mojave.

So is it correct to say that in order to upgrade the firmware to 144.0.0.0.0, it is only possible with a metal GPU, supported in Mojave ?
GPU needs to have METAL support and to work with High Sierra. You can't upgrade the BootROM unless the GPU works with High Sierra.

So I first need one of the supported GPU's like the RX580. Then update firmware. Then get the patched catalina installer. And finally install Catalina with the RX5700 ... ? So I need 2 GPU's to get there ?
Yes. You need a METAL GPU supported with High Sierra. Can even be a NVIDIA GPU that is not supported with Mojave, like GTX 980 or 1080.

A Catalina only GPU like NAVI won't work, nor a 10.14.5+ GPU like VII.

BTW, if you have a BootROM earlier than MP51.0089.B00, you will need an Apple OEM or a flashed GPU to get to MP51.0089.B00, then you install your High Sierra METAL supported GPU to upgrade to 144.0.0.0.0, only after that you can install RX 5700XT/Catalina
 

tsialex

macrumors 604
Jun 13, 2016
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Explained on the MP5,1: What you have to do to upgrade to Mojave (BootROM upgrade instructions thread) the fine point of the METAL requirement:

*METAL capable GPU as in any METAL supported GPU that works with High Sierra:

Can even be a NVIDIA GPU that has METAL support and don't work with Mojave, like GTX 980 or GTX 1080. Newer AMD GPUs that won't work with High Sierra, like VII (only works with 10.14.5+) and RX 5700 XT (only works with 10.15.1+) won't work for upgrading the Mac Pro BootROM. High Sierra METAL support it the key.
 

Temesta

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Jan 11, 2020
8
0
Thank you so much Tsialex for making things clear. I have a GTX980 here ... So to come back to my initial question, I could do the following steps :

1) first check if MP bootROM is at least MP51.0089.B00
2) in case not, first upgrade to MP51.0089.B00
3) Physically install my METAL GPU (GTX980) to work in high sierra
4) Upgrade firmware to 144.0.0.0.0
5) Create patched catalina installer for MP 5.1 on USB
6) Physically install the RX5700
7) Do a clean install from the USB

Why the hell am I doing this whole process .... It's crazy
 

tsialex

macrumors 604
Jun 13, 2016
7,649
8,358
Brazil
Thank you so much Tsialex for making things clear. I have a GTX980 here ... So to come back to my initial question, I could do the following steps :

1) first check if MP bootROM is at least MP51.0089.B00
2) in case not, first upgrade to MP51.0089.B00
3) Physically install my METAL GPU (GTX980) to work in high sierra
4) Upgrade firmware to 144.0.0.0.0
5) Create patched catalina installer for MP 5.1 on USB
6) Physically install the RX5700
7) Do a clean install from the USB

Why the hell am I doing this whole process .... It's crazy
You need to install the NVIDIA web drivers, if not yet installed in High Sierra, or METAL won't work. 1-4 are correct, don't know the rest since I don't use dosdude patched installs.
 

MarkC426

macrumors 65816
May 14, 2008
1,061
319
UK
Thank you so much Tsialex for making things clear. I have a GTX980 here ... So to come back to my initial question, I could do the following steps :

1) first check if MP bootROM is at least MP51.0089.B00
2) in case not, first upgrade to MP51.0089.B00
3) Physically install my METAL GPU (GTX980) to work in high sierra
4) Upgrade firmware to 144.0.0.0.0
5) Create patched catalina installer for MP 5.1 on USB
6) Physically install the RX5700
7) Do a clean install from the USB

Why the hell am I doing this whole process .... It's crazy
Seems like a whole big pain, just to play some games.

It would be easier to get a PC/console for gaming and keep your Mac separate.
Don’t even know how performance is in Windows with the 5700 for games.....?
 

Temesta

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Jan 11, 2020
8
0
I guess I'm lucky :) ... I have bootROM "MP51.0089.B00" on my mac pro....
 

VaZ

macrumors regular
Aug 31, 2012
202
62
So can i still do all this with a MP3,1 with bootrom MP31.006C.B05? Is that the latest bootrom for it?
 

Noobraino

macrumors newbie
May 25, 2020
1
0
Thanks @Temesta for this post, I was in the same camp as you.

Now for the moment being I decided to upgrade my original ATI Radeon HD 5770 with a slightly better card that will enable the Mojave and Cataline upgrade (Metal support) so here is my question:

Once Catalina installed with this card, I will most likely buy the RX5700, is there any other steps necessary for the install or I can simply put the card in the MP and replace the old one?

Thanks a lot guys.
 
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