Need a job? Don't use a Mac


swingerofbirch

macrumors 68040
The reason I bought a cheap PC is because I work from home for a teleservices company that only works with Windows.

All the things you've hear about Windows being a pain to use are true...and worse....

I would love it if the company I work for made a Mac version, I asked about it, but it's a nonstarter.
 

PCMacUser

macrumors 68000
Jan 13, 2005
1,690
6
It's just the way it is. I work in the IT industry and can honestly say that becoming too Mac specific (knowledge wise) is a great way to end your career.
 

cwtnospam

macrumors regular
Sep 4, 2004
148
0
PCMacUser said:
It's just the way it is. I work in the IT industry and can honestly say that becoming too Mac specific (knowledge wise) is a great way to end your career.
That's because they fear the Mac. Any computer that works too well is a threat to IT job security. For example, virus problems just help prove to the end user that IT support is necessary.
 

Chacala_Nayarit

macrumors 6502
Oct 6, 2005
315
0
Lakewood, Washington
Trouble Makers
Posted by: Dwaine Maggart
Posted on: October 27, 2005, 2:27 PM PDT
Story: Need a job? Don't use a Mac

Perhaps the companies using these IE only sites are doing so for a purpose. Perhaps they want employees who will conform meekly to the company line. Perhaps they think that hiring those non-conformist Mac people would be nothing but trouble?
Are those questions or statements in that passive-agressive post? Us non-conformist Mac users - my, my. :rolleyes:

Folks, I once had a chick I meet online come to my apartment (mistake). She looked at my PowerMac G4 and gave this angry look. She than asked, "Oh so you are one those Mac users?"

I asked her to explain her question. She said Mac and Linux users are trouble makers. I showed her fat-ass to the door. :p
 

nagromme

macrumors G5
May 2, 2002
12,551
1,186
This is specifically about collecting job applications via BrassRing's software. This is about the machine the applicant applies FROM (at home or their old job). This is not about which computers are used ON the job once you get it, and it's not about IT skills.

BrassRing's lack of Mac support means that Mac users must use a library PC, friend's PC, or virtual PC to apply to companies that use BrassRing. That's inconveniencing a lot of talented potential employees, and some big companies do their hiring through BrassRing.

BUT, as the article states, demand for Mac support is growing, and so the NEXT version will gain limited support for Macs. This December :)

If that trend continues, then this article is GOOD news in my book :)
 

parenthesis

macrumors member
Mar 22, 2003
89
0
Here and there
Coding for Standards

This is just another example as to why there needs to be a push to code for STANDARDS, not for platforms/browsers.

How hard is it to make sure that your code is W3C compliant? Not very. You can run it though the W3C validator and get an instant result. You could also use a tool (like Macromedia Dreamweaver) that writes standard HTML documents.

If the BrassRing software is written in Java, PHP, Pearl, Python, or any other standards-based language, then there is, again, no reason for this to happen.

It just makes me angry when this happens...:mad:
 

KREX725

macrumors regular
Apr 20, 2003
154
0
Chacala_Nayarit said:
Are those questions or statements in that passive-agressive post? Us non-conformist Mac users - my, my. :rolleyes:

Folks, I once had a chick I meet online come to my apartment (mistake). She looked at my PowerMac G4 and gave this angry look. She than asked, "Oh so you are one those Mac users?"

I asked her to explain her question. She said Mac and Linux users are trouble makers. I showed her fat-ass to the door. :p
Dude, I think I dated that girl too. She totally gave me the "Ewww. Mac?" when she saw my old Performa 6220. She couldn't explain her position and only stated Mac people were snobs, but provided no examples.
 

mkrishnan

Moderator emeritus
Jan 9, 2004
29,641
12
Grand Rapids, MI, USA
It does kind of surprise me, though, to see people still deploying this type of web-based application without support for Firefox after a year of so much press about IE's vulnerability. I mean... come on. Everyone in IT knows how much overlap there is between the list of technologies supported in IE and not FF, and the list of technologies responsible for the poor security track record of the Windows platform. :rolleyes:
 

Whyren

macrumors 6502a
parenthesis said:
This is just another example as to why there needs to be a push to code for STANDARDS, not for platforms/browsers.

How hard is it to make sure that your code is W3C compliant? Not very. You can run it though the W3C validator and get an instant result. You could also use a tool (like Macromedia Dreamweaver) that writes standard HTML documents.

If the BrassRing software is written in Java, PHP, Pearl, Python, or any other standards-based language, then there is, again, no reason for this to happen.

It just makes me angry when this happens...:mad:
I think this sort of programming blindness is along the same lines as application programmers who don't take the time to streamline their code, because computers nowadays are so fast, efficient code isn't necessary.
:rolleyes:
 

Photorun

macrumors 65816
Sep 1, 2003
1,216
0
NYC
cwtnospam said:
That's because they fear the Mac. Any computer that works too well is a threat to IT job security. For example, virus problems just help prove to the end user that IT support is necessary.
Exactly the point, that's not a theory, that's a fact. My university was 80% Macs 10 years ago and only needed less than a half a dozen tech support people, it's not 80% peecee and it has close to 20. That is, in part, due to how bad Windoze is to maintain, run, fix, but also because now the IT department wields more power, universities having their little fiefdoms. They hate the Macs too because they can't cripple them like they can the peecees so you HAVE to call them. Worse, they don't "get" Macs and should someone need assistance (though it's rare, they're on a Mac after all) they usually screw them up. Then again, they've screwed up a LOT of peecee through incompentence... or maybe it's just because they're peecees... both. Peecee = IT job security.
 

KREX725

macrumors regular
Apr 20, 2003
154
0
I realize this isn't the exact goal of the article, but I'm noticing a lot of places will say Mac users aren't supported just so they don't have to offer customer service to Mac users if they experience any problems. I've noticed this with online banking, online education, and other online applications. In each of these cases, my Mac worked fine to submit whatever. But for a Mac user who might not realize what's really being said in these cases, they may assume it's the same as reading the system requirements on software at the store and not even try.

I'm guessing that this application program for AMEX is actually software and not just a browser formatted application process.
 

Nermal

Moderator
Staff member
Dec 7, 2002
18,678
1,183
New Zealand
Conversely, sometimes they use the other definition of "support". Yesterday I tried to view a music video and got a message saying that Macs aren't supported. Well that's great, I don't want support, I just want to play the thing! However, it didn't seem to want to play.
 

Chacala_Nayarit

macrumors 6502
Oct 6, 2005
315
0
Lakewood, Washington
I always hated hearing, "Nobody uses Macs in the 'real world'!" I heard this at college, and I thought universities were supposed to be hotbeds of intellectualism. Not anymore when my former school, 86% of students were going after business degrees - oh such smart people! :rolleyes:

So, what happens? My first job using a computer was at a newspaper - on a PowerMac G4! :eek:

Damn college lied to me! :mad:

Funny thing, their Web site has stated for years it only works with IE and Windows, when for years I was accessing it with a Mac. They would not change their statement even after I presented evidence of using it on OS-X, OS-9, and several distros of Linux. They just laughed at me.

The University of Alaska is a joke. I should repeat that for search engines:

The University of Alaska is a joke. The University of Alaska is a joke. The University of Alaska is a joke. The University of Alaska is a joke. The University of Alaska is a joke. The University of Alaska is a joke. The University of Alaska is a joke. The University of Alaska is a joke.The University of Alaska is a joke.The University of Alaska is a joke.The University of Alaska is a joke.The University of Alaska is a joke.The University of Alaska is a joke.

Cool :D
 

winmacguy

macrumors 68020
Nov 8, 2003
2,237
0
New Zealand
Nermal said:
Conversely, sometimes they use the other definition of "support". Yesterday I tried to view a music video and got a message saying that Macs aren't supported. Well that's great, I don't want support, I just want to play the thing! However, it didn't seem to want to play.
Hopefully that will change with quicktime videos being distributed podcasts and other video capable iPods
 

ibook30

macrumors 6502a
Jun 4, 2005
815
3
2,000 light years from home
I say it's a good thing that they recognize the rise in demand for mac friendly environments. But maybe it says something about job seekers- perhaps fewer mac users need a job. Maybe we all get paid too much and won't ever leave our jobs 'cause 'the man' loves us and needs us since we are mac users. I bet five bucks that's the case. :D
 

TwitchOSX

macrumors 6502
May 2, 2002
496
2
Southern Oregon
Listen People...

Obvously.. being here is my objection to this article in the first place. The problem is that these people that create the websites to interact with the end user do that Microsoft certification training on whatever they are working on. The problem with MS training is that its training in proprietary BS. Mostly.. like banks.. want to make it as easy as possible and make it do MS Explorer only crap. One of the problems is MS. They tend to make things work only their way. Yea.. Apple does this with fairplay and other stuff but still, MS does it more heavily. I had to deal with Frontpage crap at the last job I worked at. Luckily I didnt have to use it at all, but we had to "support" it which sucked. Thats how MS is though. Either way, F__K MS.
 

p0intblank

macrumors 68030
Sep 20, 2005
2,557
2
New Jersey
At least the rise in Mac sales and the number of users is being recognized. This story isn't a huge deal to me, as I will most likely be working on a Mac when I become a professional graphic designer for an organization. After all, the Mac IS the standard this area of study, so I'm not really worried or affected by this. And plus even if I was forced to use a Windows machine (let's hope I am not...) in my career, it isn't a big deal to me since I know the OS very well. That's why I enjoy being both a Mac and a Windows user. I have good knowledge of both platforms, and I know that will come in handly later on in my life.
 

Analog Kid

macrumors 601
Mar 4, 2003
4,771
2,793
cwtnospam said:
That's because they fear the Mac. Any computer that works too well is a threat to IT job security. For example, virus problems just help prove to the end user that IT support is necessary.
I disagree. It's just a matter of staying with what you know. MS sells its stuff as all being seamlessly interoperable-- for the most part it's not (just look at Office), but they sell it that way. They also license things in packages so that having a license for Exchange or whatever means you have some other MS tool laying around.

When there's a problem to solve, the first thing a company asks is "what does MS offer?".

IT management doesn't have much experience outside the Windows realm and their primary concern is that the bulk of users are supported. If they use only MS tools, the thinking goes, then Windows users will operate fine.

I got into a pretty heated argument with our CIO one time because he claimed that Linux wasn't Unix-- not in the purist sense that "only Berkley Unix is real Unix" or anything like that, but because "Linux doesn't have all these configurations like Unix does" .:eek:

I really think it's as simple as that-- IT departments with the breadth of skills required are relatively new. Management hasn't kept up with what's happening in the field-- hell, I don't know if anyone can really keep up. 90% of the infrastructure is MS based and 98-100% of the users are on Windows. They can't do anything to jeopardize their users and the only sales folk they're in regular contact with are MS folk.

They're not going to listen to someone saying "well, if you go to Sourceforge you can pull down the latest beta of an application that I think we can customize for what we need".

Moving to OS X as the infrastructure, or even Linux, wouldn't put them out of jobs-- it would simply change the job. They'd spend their time developing automation tools and productivity enhancements to get the most out of the system rather than wiping and reinstalling the OS all over the place and figuring out which port they need to block today.

If corporations realized how important a good IT infrastructure was, they'd push to open standards very quickly (and MS would be forced to follow).

If IT personnel realized that moving to another system meant they could move up the skill chain and start exercising their talents they'd push for it too. Nobody wants to be on Helpdesk watching the install progress bar the rest of their life...
 

rdowns

macrumors Penryn
Jul 11, 2003
27,345
12,408
My work Mac story

I run the Internet division of my company and wanted a Mac to be able to test our site and a few other tasks. IT fought me tooth and nail, said the web developer tested it at home with his Mac and that was good enough. I did too but the site had issues with Safari.

Besides he said, Apple had only like 5% market share. My reply, that's OK, we didn't want to do business with 5 out of every 100 visitors to our site. :rolleyes:

As a VP, I basically demanded one and the Pres. authorized my purchase. The eMac is in one of my spare cubicles and I use it often.

Fast forward a year and one of our dealers was having issues connecting to one of our sites. IT was stumped and asked me for help. My reply, Apple had only like 5% market share. Pres. called me in and it led to a very productive discussion of our sloppy Windows programmers and web standards. We are now in the middle of a 6 month project to fix all of our sites. Oh yeah, took all of 5 minutes to assist the dealer who was having issues. While I don't handle the dealer side of our business, I made us a customer for life.
 

PCMacUser

macrumors 68000
Jan 13, 2005
1,690
6
KREX725 said:
Dude, I think I dated that girl too. She totally gave me the "Ewww. Mac?" when she saw my old Performa 6220. She couldn't explain her position and only stated Mac people were snobs, but provided no examples.
Well, it is true really - Mac people ARE snobs :D
 

Bad Beaver

macrumors regular
Nov 27, 2003
115
0
Chacala_Nayarit said:
Folks, I once had a chick I meet online come to my apartment (mistake). She looked at my PowerMac G4 and gave this angry look. She than asked, "Oh so you are one those Mac users?"

I asked her to explain her question. She said Mac and Linux users are trouble makers. I showed her fat-ass to the door. :p
Oh no! Yet another nonconformist troublemaker! Yet another one who will not just shut up and do as told! Burn! Burn! :rolleyes: :D

My personal approach is that I will just not apply for a job that will not allow me to freely choose my platform. The job can't be worth it anyway since the employer obviously doesn't give a **** about whether I work at maximum productivity or whether I am feeling limited all day long. No thanks. Anyway, not being able to apply for a job due to using a certain modern platform is plain discrimination and any company allowing for such happenings is just asking to get sued. I mean, come on, it's the US of A, how comes nobody sues the **** out of such companies? They are begging for class-action. Must be one of those 5% things.
 

PCMacUser

macrumors 68000
Jan 13, 2005
1,690
6
Bad Beaver said:
My personal approach is that I will just not apply for a job that will not allow me to freely choose my platform. The job can't be worth it anyway since the employer obviously doesn't give a **** about whether I work at maximum productivity or whether I am feeling limited all day long. No thanks. Anyway, not being able to apply for a job due to using a certain modern platform is plain discrimination and any company allowing for such happenings is just asking to get sued. I mean, come on, it's the US of A, how comes nobody sues the **** out of such companies? They are begging for class-action. Must be one of those 5% things.
Haha, well I'm not sure how well your argument would hold up. They would probably suggest that if you are unable to reap as much productivity out of a PC as you can from a Macintosh, then you require further training.

A few years ago I worked as a hardware technician, and sometimes my employer provided me with manual screwdrivers, and other times with electric screwdrivers. It's ridiculous to suggest that I could sue for discrimination if they didn't always provide electric screwdrivers...