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Need to BU a HS mac to a 2020 Catalina iMac.

Dannydematio

macrumors member
Original poster
May 17, 2016
41
10
I have a slightly tricky situation from my point of view. I haven’t had to restore a machine for a very long time.

I had a 27’ 2009 iMac die running High Sierra. (Logic board/GPU). Machine can’t be started up except in safe mode. (Not sure how long this will work)

I also had an up to date CCC back up on an external. When the iMac 27 2020 arrives, I want to get the apps iPhoto library and network settings moved over. I’m assuming migration assistant will work, but.....

Can I use AMA to integrate the CCC bootable back up volume and selectively install what I want? Typically this is done only Mac 2 Mac.

Any issues with going from High Sierra to Catalina?

I could of course do a messy manual back up and reinstall the apps, but I would much much rather get everything moved over except the files/documents because the old iMac has a 2TB HD and the 2020 has a 1TB SSD.

I’ll be keeping all files on an external drive, apps on boot in future.

Just wondered which is the best way to go about this.

thanks.
 

chscag

Contributor
Feb 17, 2008
3,940
1,417
Fort Worth, Texas
You should be able to open the CCC backup with Finder and pull off what you need from it. The only problem you may run into is if any of your HS apps were 32 bit, they're not going to work with Catalina.

You could give MA a try from the CCC clone to your new iMac. I've honestly never used MA that way. I usually do a MA to a new machine from a Time Machine backup as that works best.
 
Comment

Dannydematio

macrumors member
Original poster
May 17, 2016
41
10
You should be able to open the CCC backup with Finder and pull off what you need from it. The only problem you may run into is if any of your HS apps were 32 bit, they're not going to work with Catalina.

You could give MA a try from the CCC clone to your new iMac. I've honestly never used MA that way. I usually do a MA to a new machine from a Time Machine backup as that works best.

Yep, I was thinking just pulling the files off the external might be my only option. Still I will have a go with MA first and see how it works out.

I assume that I can boot the 2020 iMac off the High Sierra CCC bootable back up? Is there any reason why I can’t do that if I want to run a 32 bit app that way?

thanks
 
Comment

Fishrrman

macrumors Core
Feb 20, 2009
20,445
7,253
You are wise to have a recent CCC cloned backup.
This gives you options.

ONE WAY TO DO IT:
You can use setup assistant when you first boot the NEW iMac to move over apps, settings, and your basic account data.

I believe you can "go into" your account (while setup assistant is running) and "UN-check" stuff you DON'T WANT to be brought over. For example, you can "leave behind" your Photos library or iTunes music folder if that's what you want.

Then, you can access those files/libraries on an external drive.
There's very little to this... it's easy.

ANOTHER WAY TO DO IT:
You could set up the new iMac "fresh and clean", and then reinstall apps and move data over manually.
Nothing wrong with doing it this way, but it's "more work" and requires some advance thinking.
You also have to take steps (when connecting your cloned backup) to avoid permissions problems. This is because your NEW iMac will view ownership of your NEW account as being "different than" who you were on your OLD iMac.
(this isn't a problem when using setup assistant because the utility takes care of that behind the scenes)

I'll suggest the first option as being the best.
a. When the new iMac comes, DO NOT rush the setup. DON'T press the power-on button yet.
b. Go to the OLD iMac and do a "final update" on your CCC cloned backup. This will represent "the old computer at the moment you moved to the new one". Or, use the backup you have now.
c. Take the NEW iMac out of the box and set it up on the table, and connect your CCC cloned backup.
d. NOW is the time to press the power-on button for the very first time.
e. Begin setup. At the appropriate moment, setup assistant will ask if you wish to migrate from another drive. YES, you want to do this.
f. "Aim" setup assistant at the CCC cloned backup, and give it a few minutes to "digest everything". BE PATIENT.
g. Setup assistant will present you with a checklist of stuff to migrate. I suggest you migrate
- applications
- settings
- accounts
-- if you don't want EVERYTHING to migrate, I think you can click the disclosure triangle and DE-select stuff you don't want to "go over". LOOK AT THIS CAREFULLY. The idea here is that you want your basic account to be migrated, but leave the large libraries (movies, music, pics) "behind" for now.
- I believe there's also a "data" checkbox that may refer to stuff (that you've created) that is "outside of" the home folder. Migrate or not -- your choice.
h. When you've got this all set up, turn setup assistant loose and let it run. Again, be patient.
i. When done, you should see your login screen, so "log in and look around".
 
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Dannydematio

macrumors member
Original poster
May 17, 2016
41
10
You are wise to have a recent CCC cloned backup.
This gives you options.

ONE WAY TO DO IT:
You can use setup assistant when you first boot the NEW iMac to move over apps, settings, and your basic account data.

I believe you can "go into" your account (while setup assistant is running) and "UN-check" stuff you DON'T WANT to be brought over. For example, you can "leave behind" your Photos library or iTunes music folder if that's what you want.

Then, you can access those files/libraries on an external drive.
There's very little to this... it's easy.

ANOTHER WAY TO DO IT:
You could set up the new iMac "fresh and clean", and then reinstall apps and move data over manually.
Nothing wrong with doing it this way, but it's "more work" and requires some advance thinking.
You also have to take steps (when connecting your cloned backup) to avoid permissions problems. This is because your NEW iMac will view ownership of your NEW account as being "different than" who you were on your OLD iMac.
(this isn't a problem when using setup assistant because the utility takes care of that behind the scenes)

I'll suggest the first option as being the best.
a. When the new iMac comes, DO NOT rush the setup. DON'T press the power-on button yet.
b. Go to the OLD iMac and do a "final update" on your CCC cloned backup. This will represent "the old computer at the moment you moved to the new one". Or, use the backup you have now.
c. Take the NEW iMac out of the box and set it up on the table, and connect your CCC cloned backup.
d. NOW is the time to press the power-on button for the very first time.
e. Begin setup. At the appropriate moment, setup assistant will ask if you wish to migrate from another drive. YES, you want to do this.
f. "Aim" setup assistant at the CCC cloned backup, and give it a few minutes to "digest everything". BE PATIENT.
g. Setup assistant will present you with a checklist of stuff to migrate. I suggest you migrate
- applications
- settings
- accounts
-- if you don't want EVERYTHING to migrate, I think you can click the disclosure triangle and DE-select stuff you don't want to "go over". LOOK AT THIS CAREFULLY. The idea here is that you want your basic account to be migrated, but leave the large libraries (movies, music, pics) "behind" for now.
- I believe there's also a "data" checkbox that may refer to stuff (that you've created) that is "outside of" the home folder. Migrate or not -- your choice.
h. When you've got this all set up, turn setup assistant loose and let it run. Again, be patient.
i. When done, you should see your login screen, so "log in and look around".

Wow, thank you so much for explaining this to me.

I will most definitely carefully follow your advice. What I want off the old iMac is only my iPhoto library and iPhone backups/apps, plus account details.

I would consider leaving the iPhoto library out at this point, because I plan to keep it on an external drive going forwards, so long as I can definitely copy it successfully that makes sense.

I’m not sure that I can make a final CCC back up, because CCC might not run in “safe mode” and I’m kinda afraid to try it, in case it goes wrong and mucks up the existing CCC back up, which is only a couple of weeks behind the fail date of my old iMac.

Thanks for the step by step instructions, which are very helpful indeed.

Kind regards.
 
Comment

Fishrrman

macrumors Core
Feb 20, 2009
20,445
7,253
If you can't run CCC again, just "use what you have now". No problems.

If the ONLY THING you may want to bring over is an iPhoto library (or not even that yet), then set up the new iMac WITHOUT plugging in the backup drive. You can do "manual migrating" later.

But BE SURE THIS IS WHAT YOU REALLY WANT.
The only way to get "a full and easy migration" from old-to-new is to do it at the very beginning, first time you plug in and set up the new Mac.

If one waits "until later", things get more complicated.

Be aware that new Macs now use "Photos" instead of "iPhoto".
You can still open and use the old iPhoto library...
 
Comment

Dannydematio

macrumors member
Original poster
May 17, 2016
41
10
If you can't run CCC again, just "use what you have now". No problems.

If the ONLY THING you may want to bring over is an iPhoto library (or not even that yet), then set up the new iMac WITHOUT plugging in the backup drive. You can do "manual migrating" later.

But BE SURE THIS IS WHAT YOU REALLY WANT.
The only way to get "a full and easy migration" from old-to-new is to do it at the very beginning, first time you plug in and set up the new Mac.

If one waits "until later", things get more complicated.

Be aware that new Macs now use "Photos" instead of "iPhoto".
You can still open and use the old iPhoto library...

understood.

I’ll do it exactly as you described from first power up. I’m waiting, as delivery of the 2020 is in a few weeks.

The external back up is on a 2TB usb drive so it will take time. I already got a usb-c to usb cable. The old iMac had a 2TB boot and the new machine 1TB SSD. I don’t recall the High Sierra iPhoto size, guess well under .5 of a TB. I might try check this first in safe mode and if it’s larger, I will abandon AMA and go drag n drop. I will put it on an external and set photos to select it as my library.

Lining up a new 4TB USB-C ext, which I will partition, split as a TM BU and photos/media. I’ll add a 2TB SSD with TB3 connection a bit later and move the photos library there. I’ll also add a CCC bootable BU to the TM back up.

Incidentally, does anybody use Blue Ray optical media to archive images? I guess flash is used, but for long term archival, what are people using these days?

thanks.
 
Comment

Fishrrman

macrumors Core
Feb 20, 2009
20,445
7,253
"Incidentally, does anybody use Blue Ray optical media to archive images? I guess flash is used, but for long term archival, what are people using these days?"

I'd be looking at M-DISC BluRay discs.
You'll need an external USB burner that is M-DISC and BD capable.

M-DISC uses non-organic media and has an extremely long lifespan.
The discs you burn will outlive you... (sigh)
 
Comment

Dannydematio

macrumors member
Original poster
May 17, 2016
41
10
"Incidentally, does anybody use Blue Ray optical media to archive images? I guess flash is used, but for long term archival, what are people using these days?"

I'd be looking at M-DISC BluRay discs.
You'll need an external USB burner that is M-DISC and BD capable.

M-DISC uses non-organic media and has an extremely long lifespan.
The discs you burn will outlive you... (sigh)

M-DISC, Interesting, Ill look into it.

Who wants to live as a human being forever? They say the fire of hell is time!
 
Comment

Dannydematio

macrumors member
Original poster
May 17, 2016
41
10
You are wise to have a recent CCC cloned backup.
This gives you options.

ONE WAY TO DO IT:
You can use setup assistant when you first boot the NEW iMac to move over apps, settings, and your basic account data.

I believe you can "go into" your account (while setup assistant is running) and "UN-check" stuff you DON'T WANT to be brought over. For example, you can "leave behind" your Photos library or iTunes music folder if that's what you want.

Then, you can access those files/libraries on an external drive.
There's very little to this... it's easy.

ANOTHER WAY TO DO IT:
You could set up the new iMac "fresh and clean", and then reinstall apps and move data over manually.
Nothing wrong with doing it this way, but it's "more work" and requires some advance thinking.
You also have to take steps (when connecting your cloned backup) to avoid permissions problems. This is because your NEW iMac will view ownership of your NEW account as being "different than" who you were on your OLD iMac.
(this isn't a problem when using setup assistant because the utility takes care of that behind the scenes)

I'll suggest the first option as being the best.
a. When the new iMac comes, DO NOT rush the setup. DON'T press the power-on button yet.
b. Go to the OLD iMac and do a "final update" on your CCC cloned backup. This will represent "the old computer at the moment you moved to the new one". Or, use the backup you have now.
c. Take the NEW iMac out of the box and set it up on the table, and connect your CCC cloned backup.
d. NOW is the time to press the power-on button for the very first time.
e. Begin setup. At the appropriate moment, setup assistant will ask if you wish to migrate from another drive. YES, you want to do this.
f. "Aim" setup assistant at the CCC cloned backup, and give it a few minutes to "digest everything". BE PATIENT.
g. Setup assistant will present you with a checklist of stuff to migrate. I suggest you migrate
- applications
- settings
- accounts
-- if you don't want EVERYTHING to migrate, I think you can click the disclosure triangle and DE-select stuff you don't want to "go over". LOOK AT THIS CAREFULLY. The idea here is that you want your basic account to be migrated, but leave the large libraries (movies, music, pics) "behind" for now.
- I believe there's also a "data" checkbox that may refer to stuff (that you've created) that is "outside of" the home folder. Migrate or not -- your choice.
h. When you've got this all set up, turn setup assistant loose and let it run. Again, be patient.
i. When done, you should see your login screen, so "log in and look around".

Hi Fishrrman,

Just thought I would update you on how things went on migrating my old iMac to the 2020.

first, I did everything exactly as you said. Connected the BU drive first, then powered up and followed the prompts. However, I never got the option during “set up” to migrate the CCC back up on the attached drive? No idea why not.

The set up completed and the CCC BU drive was mounted on desktop.

So I fired up migration assistant and went through the steps to select what I wanted and let it go ahead. Unfortunately I had the BU on a FW800 drive and since I did not have a TB3 to FW adapter cable, I used USB. (Mistake)

Now I’m waiting and waiting and waiting......

I understand from asking around that this can take a few days. What concerns me is the message I am seeing says transferring data “starting up” and the progress bar is solid, no movement, so I’m wondering if this is normal or is the process is hanging?

see the screen shot below.

I would have made sure I had the adapter cable to speed things up if I had thought about how slooooow USB can be.

live and learn!
 

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Don_the_Editor

macrumors newbie
Oct 16, 2020
1
0
I learned the hard way too about USB... so since then, anytime I get a new Mac, I make sure I have adapters (cables) to connect to any older devices I have at the highest possible speed. Thunderbolt to Firewire for example. Best $30 I ever spent.
 
Comment

Fishrrman

macrumors Core
Feb 20, 2009
20,445
7,253
OP:

You only get "one shot" to do a migration with setup assistant the proper way... looks like you "missed the prompt" during setup. I don't know why.

If I was you, at this point I would GIVE UP on migration assistant, and consider moving things over manually.

I have no experience with time machine. I've never once used it, and never intend to use it, ever.

I DO know about clones.

You can mount a cloned backup directly in the finder and it will look like any other drive mounted in the finder. You can then copy things from the backup drive to the new Mac.

WARNING:
YOU MUST take steps to overcome permissions problems when moving from an old account to a new account -- even if you have the same username and password. The Mac OS will think these are TWO DIFFERENT ACCOUNTS.

How to overcome this:
1. connect the backup
2. click on it ONE TIME to select it
3. bring up the "get info" box (type command-i)
4. at the bottom of get info, click the lock and enter the password you use on the NEW Mac
5. in "sharing and permissions", put a CHECKMARK into "ignore ownership on this volume".
6. close get info.

Now you can copy almost whatever you want from the backup to the new Mac, and the items/folders copied "come under the ownership" of your NEW account.

WARNING #2:
You have to be careful about what you copy from your old home folder to the new one.
YOU CANNOT COPY "the top level folders", such as "movies", "music", "pictures", and "documents".
However, YOU CAN COPY the stuff that is INSIDE OF these folders. That includes files and folders.
So you have to open each one of the top level folders, and select and move things over that way (to the new home folder on the new Mac).

GET A PENCIL AND PAPER AND KEEP HANDWRITTEN NOTES as you go along. Otherwise, you may get lost (I speak from experience).

PRINT OUT this post, and keep it for future reference.
 
Comment

Dannydematio

macrumors member
Original poster
May 17, 2016
41
10
I learned the hard way too about USB... so since then, anytime I get a new Mac, I make sure I have adapters (cables) to connect to any older devices I have at the highest possible speed. Thunderbolt to Firewire for example. Best $30 I ever spent.

Yes, you are spot on and I have learnt that lesson just now. It’s been a heck of a long time since I had to do this, well over a decade. So although I thought about everything and checked here for excellent advise, I forgot to think about speed of conduits. If I was doing this a bit more regularly I would have known.

So after 40 wasted hours waiting, I finally cancelled the process a few mins ago and found nothing had been happening.....

I suspect the USB cable was the culprit, although I did see the icon for the CCC BU drive on my desktop before I fist started AMA rolling.

This particular WD Back up drive has always been reliable but always connected to my old iMac by FW800. This is first time ever using the USB. It’s one of those tiny connectors on the drive side and USB on the other. May not have been the original shipping USB cable, so perhaps that’s what was wrong.

This would also explain why I didn’t see the migration option when I first started up the 2020 with this drive already connected.

So now (as I see it) I have two choices.

Just drag n drop what I want off the CCC back up and dig for serial numbers and reinstall everything.

I really only wanted to bring across my iPhoto library to photos and all my Apps/settings.

Or I can try Apple migration assistant again.

I have a USB-C to USB cable here off a new Sandisk 1TB ext SSD, so I guess I could go ahead and try that. Or wait till I get hold of a Apple TB to FW 800 cable. Hmmmm?


I just updated Catalina to latest version so it’s doing that as I write.

I’ll next see if the CCC volume connects ok via the USB-C to USB. It’s literally just a very short USB-C cable, that has a dongle with a regular USB connector.

Since I have gone through the “set up” my new iMac has my regular Apple ID but, I suppose it won’t be an issue with the BU drive. Let’s see!

Many thanks to everyone who tried to help.
 
Comment

Dannydematio

macrumors member
Original poster
May 17, 2016
41
10
OP:

You only get "one shot" to do a migration with setup assistant the proper way... looks like you "missed the prompt" during setup. I don't know why.

If I was you, at this point I would GIVE UP on migration assistant, and consider moving things over manually.

I have no experience with time machine. I've never once used it, and never intend to use it, ever.

I DO know about clones.

You can mount a cloned backup directly in the finder and it will look like any other drive mounted in the finder. You can then copy things from the backup drive to the new Mac.

WARNING:
YOU MUST take steps to overcome permissions problems when moving from an old account to a new account -- even if you have the same username and password. The Mac OS will think these are TWO DIFFERENT ACCOUNTS.

How to overcome this:
1. connect the backup
2. click on it ONE TIME to select it
3. bring up the "get info" box (type command-i)
4. at the bottom of get info, click the lock and enter the password you use on the NEW Mac
5. in "sharing and permissions", put a CHECKMARK into "ignore ownership on this volume".
6. close get info.

Now you can copy almost whatever you want from the backup to the new Mac, and the items/folders copied "come under the ownership" of your NEW account.

WARNING #2:
You have to be careful about what you copy from your old home folder to the new one.
YOU CANNOT COPY "the top level folders", such as "movies", "music", "pictures", and "documents".
However, YOU CAN COPY the stuff that is INSIDE OF these folders. That includes files and folders.
So you have to open each one of the top level folders, and select and move things over that way (to the new home folder on the new Mac).

GET A PENCIL AND PAPER AND KEEP HANDWRITTEN NOTES as you go along. Otherwise, you may get lost (I speak from experience).

PRINT OUT this post, and keep it for future reference.

Ok I’ve just seen your reply after I made my recent post.

I’m thinking now that this is getting to complicated and messy. I may just drag over what I want, which means the iPhoto library. I want to get that right.

everything else files wise I have on multiple backups. I only had one bootable CCC back up, but it wasn’t much use to me in the end.

thanks again.
 
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