New Details re Libya Attack: No Protests Took Place

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by segovius, Oct 9, 2012.

  1. segovius macrumors regular

    segovius

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    #1
    When the Libya attack occurred several things happened:

    1) All media reports were taken as unassailable truth - anyone suggesting otherwise was labelled an apologist and the auto da fe was fired up

    2) It was accepted as being no surprise as 'that's what Muslims do' (as opposed to 'that's what WE don't do)

    The underlying aims and assumptions of course are playing into the Straussian 'Clash of Civilizations' so encapsulated by the recent Posters in NYC about Muslims being 'savages' and practically everyone else being civilized.

    That meme has to be kept going and the people who do it are the media. The media is no longer a news source but in effect a propaganda arm of the government.

    Because the 'Muslim savages/ Clash of Civilizations' trope is not actually true (minor detail) the media have to lie.

    And despite all the hate-filled rhetoric, the foaming at the mouth about 'cancers' and the screams of 'apologist!!' so it turns out to be in this case as in so many others.

    No more comment - I'll just bold the bits that need thinking about below:

    New Details From Libya Consulate Attack: State Department Abandons Claim Of Protest Outside Gates
     
  2. thewitt macrumors 68020

    thewitt

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    #2
    I have no idea what point you are making in your post.

    It appears the Obama administration did noting to verify what happened before repeating the media reports, which is really quite frightening.

    The administration should have spoken with our people there and only then made a statement.

    Any sane person tied this first and foremost to the anniversary of the September 11 attacks and knew it was not a protest gone out of control. It's very scary that it took the US government three weeks to get there, and of course there will be no repercussions or retaliations.
     
  3. segovius thread starter macrumors regular

    segovius

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    #3
    I am expecting you will be one of many.....

    Link
     
  4. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

    Macky-Mac

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    #4
    so you're saying peace loving muslims murdered Ambassador Christopher Stevens without using a "protest" to cover their attack? :eek:
     
  5. segovius thread starter macrumors regular

    segovius

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    #5
    Joe Public #1: scumbag muzzlims - look at all this fuss...barbarians rioting over a cartoon

    Joe Public #2: yeah.... stone age religion etc etc etc etc

    "Discussion" about Free Speech™ and primitive barbarians who riot over cartoons with no other insights for page after page after page

    Rational Observer: wait, this might not have been about cartoons....here is evidence and here and here.....

    Mob with pitchforks: Apologist!!!! Religion is a cancer! Terrorist lover etc etc etc

    NEWS FLASH: it seems this wasn't about the cartoons at all.....

    Rational Observer: hey, here's a link which says these weeks later that it turns out this wasn't about the cartoons at all....

    tumbleweed roll, silence reigns and a whistling wind blows through the old dusty streets of the abandoned western town.....

    Tune in next week (or tomorrow, or tonight or 24/7) for the next thrilling installment of "Barbarians!!" the ongoing saga of guys in white hats and the cavalry that always comes to save America at the last minute from the sex-crazed camel-loving degenerates in the sandy backward wastes of nowhere.....
     
  6. myrtlebee macrumors 68000

    myrtlebee

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    #6
    I'm voting for Obama, but this whole situation seriously disturbs me.
     
  7. segovius thread starter macrumors regular

    segovius

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    #7
    It should disturb everyone. It's not about the Islamic angle at all....it's about the US government lying to the people and the news corporations supporting it.

    Or the other way round if you prefer - news agencies lying and the Gov supporting.

    That goes way beyond party politics and should be of grave import. The fact it doesn't seem to be - on either side - is even more disturbing.
     
  8. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #8
    So you are telling me that White house should of waited 3 weeks to make a statement? Boy we all know how the GOP lovers here would of spun that one.....
    Lets see protest did happen.
    The first reports that filtered in was it was from mod that did it. Followed by protest was used as cover. Now the 2nd one seems pretty likely as well as the first.

    Now would they of been able to pull it off with out the protest is very questaionable at best.

    But really the GOP has turned into the black helicopter nut jobs.
     
  9. thewitt macrumors 68020

    thewitt

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    #9
    Somehow I knew you would be the first one in this thread to make excuses for your boy Obama.

    They had no business making statements without first consulting with their own security agencies and no spin you can put on this will change that.

    They were, and continue to be, irresponsible and incompetent when it comes to all things related to foreign policy.
     
  10. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #10
    So what should they have done? Surely you can't expect them to have taken 3 weeks to issue a statement?
     
  11. edk99 macrumors 6502a

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    #11
    Maybe if they had the correct security in place to begin with and did not ignore warning and threats before the attack the ambassador wouldn't of been murdered.
     
  12. segovius thread starter macrumors regular

    segovius

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    #13
  13. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

    Macky-Mac

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    #14
    I suppose we'll have to wait for the rational observer then since none have stepped forward :p
     
  14. segovius thread starter macrumors regular

    segovius

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    #15
    Hehe Good one :D
     
  15. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #16
    And we're back inside the bubble. Aside of Republicans spouting off to TV news, please provide any proof that warnings were ignored.

    It's very rich watching the Republicans try and politicize national security issues while they voted to cut the State Depts. security budget.

    Source
     
  16. GermanyChris macrumors 601

    GermanyChris

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    #17
    And this is somehow different than status quo?
     
  17. obeygiant macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    #18
    Remember when we were all like,

    "Man, some of those Muslims must have been REALLY pissed about that crappy YouTube movie, because they pulled RPGs and heavy weaponry out of their backpacks, fought through our security, found the safe house where our people were taken, fought through that security with mortars and more heavy weaponry, and then tortured, raped and murdered our Ambassador"

    and our President, Secretary of State, Ambassador to the U.N. and all of their minions went on TV for weeks and were like,

    "Yup! That's exactly what happened! Al Qaeda? Who is Al Qaeda and what do they have to do with anything? Al Qaeda is losing! That YouTube movie is pure evil! Someone needs to be punished for firing up the crazies! And We Killed Bin Ladin!"

    Ahh. Those were the days!
     
  18. NickZac macrumors 68000

    NickZac

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    #19
    The fact that the government was so slow to label this an act of terrorism worries me that political correctness is undermining security.

    But you would also think the US government would have been smart enough to beef up security on such a significant day...
     
  19. segovius thread starter macrumors regular

    segovius

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    #20
    No, no. No difference at all.

    I'm just amazed people keep giving them the benefit of the doubt. Supporting them even.

    With a blank cheque like that no wonder they behave the way they do...who wouldn't?
     
  20. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #21
    In regards to our 50+ year empire, I'd agree. I'm embarrassed that Obama has only continued, and in certain ways escalated, the empire by force model that has carried on for far too long.

    It seems that every time a new boogeyman appears on the international scene, if you look back (say, 30 years) a certain global power was responsible for creating, or arming and training him.

    We've created most of the "enemies" we've had. Hell, Saddam and Bin Laden were swell guys when we had use for them weren't they.

    :rolleyes:
     
  21. NickZac macrumors 68000

    NickZac

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    #22
    This is termed, "unconventional warfare". I'm not saying I agree with it but if you want to look at this issue it is important to use the correct terminology. We never made them into "allies" or "swell" people; rather, we used them to fight wars so we wouldn't have to. Much of the Western world has done this over the past century at least.
     
  22. segovius thread starter macrumors regular

    segovius

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    #23
    I think that we - as humanity - are very, very near seeing the BS behind it all for what it is. Doesn't really look like it from the general tone of posts round here but in the real world the blinkers are really falling off more and more every day.

    All these ranting fundies and atheists foaming at the mouth subconsciously know this which is why they have their knickers in a twist. The dinosaurs have evolved a little bit this time - this time they know the meteorite is coming but they're still dinosaurs and there's nothing they can do about it....they're headed for the dustbin of history. I won't miss them.

    Your post above neatly encapsulates this fresh view. Yes, Obama is a disappointment but on another level you just don't get to me President if you aren't on the team.

    The choice doesn't come at the ballot box - that's the dog and pony show for Joe Public. It was chosen years back. Not who would win exactly but the type that will win. Now you have a choice of two in Nov. But it is really no choice at all: you will get the same thing either way.

    The house never loses.

    Similarly with Saddam and OBL: yep, real cool guys when they're on the payroll but the flipside is there again. Those NOT on the payroll...those who REFUSE the offer of the US and it's lackeys...they will be painted as 'evil'.

    But it doesn't mean they are anymore than it means Saddam was "good" when he was shaking Rumsfeld's hand.

    ----------

    Not true. Saudi is #1 ally in the region. They fund all Wahabi, Salafist and Deobandi madrasas and promote the teaching.

    They are the only source of it. No-one else....not Iran, not Libya, not Iraq, not Syria.

    In fact if you made a list of US Muslim enemies they would also be the key Saudi Muslim enemies. I saw figures of how many mosques in the US are Saudi funded - can't remember exactly but shockingly high: 70% plus. And then there's all the land they own in the US.

    And yet, the Saudi doctrines are the only ones the Islamists adhere to. Period.

    Bin Laden was a Saudi. So were the 19 hijackers on 911.
     
  23. elistan macrumors 6502a

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    #24
    My interpretation of your statement is that, since you don't have any commentary about what should have instead been done about the actual event that took place, you condone the reaction? (An initial statement based on what was known at the time which turned out to be incorrect and updated to reflect a more thorough understanding later.) And your main beef is the security situation that allowed the attack in the first place? And... this is pure speculation on my part, I don't know your political affiliation, please correct me if I'm mistaken - your solution to the problem is to vote for the GOP party, knowing their proposal to cut back on security spending for the State Department? (See rdowns' post.)
     
  24. NickZac macrumors 68000

    NickZac

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    #25
    Saudi Arabia is an ally and not part of the unconventional warfare practices. They've been an ally for quite some time and not part of what is deemed "unconventional warfare". Bin Laden and Saddam Hussein were not. Bin Laden's birthplace is really irrelevant in this regards nor are that of the hijackers. Unconventional warfare usually applies to smaller groups. When aid was given to them by Western nations, it was so they would literally fight a war on their behalf.
     

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