New DHS Immigration Policy

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Rhonindk, Feb 21, 2017.

  1. Rhonindk macrumors 68020

    Rhonindk

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    #1
    Wow. Looking at the newest to come from the DHS on illegal immigrants. After living a good portion of my life in Az and Ca, I have to say I am all for it. Then add in the newer illegals from places other than Mexico.
    Personally I feel this is a good thing. My parents were immigrants. Still, how do we handle all those currently here? How do we minimize the rhetoric the "OMG!!! You are all going to be deported ASAP!!!" and the falsehoods like those from Kamala Harris.
    How do we encourage and allow for those that need our help against the crime, the gangs, those we need gone.

    Couple of articles from both sides....
    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/02/21/new-immigration-policies-draw-both-praise-and-alarm.html
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...47f8cf9b643_story.html?utm_term=.cf2af3d19f1d
     
  2. Snoopy4 macrumors 6502a

    Snoopy4

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    #2
    I don't believe any of it is "new" it's simply enforcement of what's on the books.
     
  3. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #3
    That's how I understood it too. It's basically enforcing the laws already written. However, they are honoring the dream act. I'm sure there are arguments on both sides for that.
     
  4. Snoopy4 macrumors 6502a

    Snoopy4

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    #4
    If they can figure out where the parents are from, then see ya as far as I'm concerned.
     
  5. DrewDaHilp1 macrumors 6502a

    DrewDaHilp1

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    #5
    14th Amendment needs clarified, then I am okay with your plan.
     
  6. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

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    #6
    How funny. If they had said the same thing before and during Ellis Island. A number of people, more than likely yourself, would have been sent back.

    Lest you forget that this country was founded by persecuted British colonials - immigrants themselves.

    BL.
     
  7. Rhonindk thread starter macrumors 68020

    Rhonindk

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    #7
    I think the laws are original.
    What I see new is the guidelines and memoranda Kelly sent down.
     
  8. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #8
    Yeah and look at how brilliantly that has worked out for the Native Americans. History is there as a lesson. The perfect definition of insanity is repeating the same processes over and over then expecting different results.
     
  9. Rhonindk thread starter macrumors 68020

    Rhonindk

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    #9
    How so?
    Looking for an honest answer. My mom came over as a child in the 30's and my dad during WWII from .... Germany.
     
  10. DrewDaHilp1 macrumors 6502a

    DrewDaHilp1

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    #10
    Key word you left out is illegal.
     
  11. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

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    #11
    The natives had their own nations and were doing just fine before the colonials came off the boat.

    BL.
     
  12. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #12
    Yeah so, just imagine a culture completely different from ours currently. Imagine that these new people didn't speak your language. You offer them hospitality! What do they do? They take everything from you. Now imagine that repeating itself. Is it really that far fetched to think it couldn't happen again? Except this time, you are the barbarian for believing in God. You are the one who is attacked for living in your own way of life and not converting. The newcomers seem so backwards to you but too bad because you lost the fight for your own freedom.

    Not a very fun thought is it?
     
  13. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

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    #13
    As I said before, if today's policies were applied back then, the same thing would happen. Most people back then didn't come across the ocean with official paperwork.

    Prime Example: Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882.

    I'm native. Not much of a stretch for me to imagine.

    BL.
     
  14. Septembersrain Contributor

    Septembersrain

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    #14
    Then you should understand why we have laws. History need not repeat itself. For the sake of the people here now and those who come here to enjoy our way of life.
     
  15. blackfox macrumors 65816

    blackfox

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    #15
    Oh. That's a new argument. Yeah, skip over the late 19th Century and early 20th when Irish, Italians, Polish (etc) were actively discriminating against each other (often violently) - I may have inferred your post wrong, but I sincerely hope you're not equating yourself (and other US citizens) as the Native Americans a few hundred years ago...
     
  16. LovingTeddy macrumors 6502a

    LovingTeddy

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    #16
    Yet we still not something anything favor to aboriginals people. White settlers came to NA , occupied lands, killed lots of Indians...

    Rather you want to agree or not. Canada , USA are land of immigrant. Did founder of USA came here as legal immigrant? Most of people on the Mayflower are refugees who trying to get away from religious suppression.

    Yet , when people trying to get away from war zone in the ME, we turn blind eye to them.

    Look. Do you really think it is reasonable to deport a person who has family in US? These illegals has family here, they have their children. Why can't we give them second chance and do the proper way? Let them pay the tax they owned, grant them the temperary resident status and go through all the paperwork.

    Do you really think hint them down and deport them is the best way? I don't agree.
     
  17. Rhonindk thread starter macrumors 68020

    Rhonindk

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    #17
    Yes. Deport them. MO YMV
    Watched an interesting local talk show and the deportation topic was raised: Because Juan G. (my version of John Doe) is an illegal immigrant, is a convicted felon, was deported, had come back into the US illegally again, and now has a child. Why should we treat him any different than if he didn't have a child? Sharply divided opinions. Only agreement was when a child is involved folks get emotional.
     
  18. LizKat macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #18
    I agree. My concern currently is that ICE will now be mining local law enforcement blotters for low hanging fruit, like cops having busted some kid for lifting a steak out of a supermarket, where the supermarket made good on "all shoplifters will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law." Let's get real, who skates on those gigs are kids with lawyers hired by mommy and daddy; pricey guys who come down there and tell the supermarket security force "how can you impose this heartbreaking ruin on little Thomas when it was just an error in judgment?!" and then throw in a remark about how daddy is on the zoning board in case the market thinks to expand some time.

    I can certainly understand deportation of convicted and violent criminals who are here illegally.

    But, I am a fan of making a legal pathway to citizenship for people who have been here a long time, worked, paid taxes into a system from which they don't even benefit. Let them pay penalties, step to end of line, but stay here and become legally what they already are, underpinnings of our economy. Growers and dairy/livestock owners are already wondering how badly Trump's blanket orders are going to mess up agricultural production.

    I don't give a tinker's dam if a kid stole an apple or chicken out of a market when they were 17. I would have cared then, to the point of usual application of related law -- sure, bring the mom in, lay the kid out in lavender, tell him "yo next time it's juvie court, get it kid?!"-- but not decades later when he's been working and contributing positively to community. Deporting someone all those years later would seem cruel and unusual punishment for having straightened up and flown right like any other once-mischievous kid growing up in America.

    Well the order is the order but I hope and pray some of its seeming excesses will be taken to court by the likes of the ACLU, and also that the immigration judges don't just rubber stamp deportation of people rounded up now. There's plenty of easy marks to be had in local LE blotters wherever migrant workers are hired or in the southwestern states where anti-immigrant sentiment has been high in recent years.

    Sections of this order sound very much like you can now be deported for having had a local cop decide to write you up for driving 31 in a 30-mph zone. My question is who all got written up for that particular violation? People driving while Mexican in a township in Georgia or Florida where migrant workers pick crops or process poultry?

    If you'd argue for your own kid not to get a record when he's busted for shoplifting, it's more than hypocritical to argue for deportation of an undocumented kid busted for the same thing.
     
  19. LovingTeddy macrumors 6502a

    LovingTeddy

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    #19
    Look, if you say that illegal committed the felony crime, then I probably will agree with you to deport.

    Like you said, if a someone determine to come here. Regardless if you deport him or her, he or she will come back again.

    Yes, you can always play rat and cat game forever. If you can give them a pathway to become legal immigrant, why the heck not. Rather deport, then come again, then deport, the come again then deport.

    When illegal comes here, they established their family. You really think tear the family apart is reasonable thing to do? Who is going to take care thbe kid? Kids has no fault here, you leave the kid alone? You end up with government take care of these poor kids.

    I am all for establishing a pathway for illegal to become legal immigrant.
     
  20. Rhonindk thread starter macrumors 68020

    Rhonindk

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    #20
    Not totally against - how do you filter out those who are sincere and want to become true US citizens?
    My feeling; lets get rid of the criminals, those that are a potential threat to the US, take a look at what is left and develop a process. Until we get to that point, keep sending them home and find a way to turn off the flow.
     
  21. LizKat macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #21
    This is what NYC has decided to do.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nypd-won-immigrants-trump-deportation-orders-article-1.2979616

    In the wake of a new federal crackdown on undocumented immigrants, Police Commissioner James O'Neill reiterated the city's commitment to immigrants, assuring residents that cops will leave the roundup to someone else.

    "The NYPD is committed to maintaining a welcoming environment for immigrant communities while also maintaining public safety for all," O'Neill wrote Wednesday in an internal memo.

    "The NYPD does not inquire about the immigration status of crime victims, witnesses, or others who call or approach the police seeking assistance."

    ===

    O'Neill said his department is concerned only about detaining immigrants "who have been convicted of a violent or serious felony, or are on the terrorist watch list."

    "It is our city's resolve to remain a safe and welcoming place for all immigrants," O'Neill said. "And it is incumbent upon the men and women of the NYPD to maintain the trust and confidence of all who depend on the services of our police department for their safety."
     
  22. Rhonindk thread starter macrumors 68020

    Rhonindk

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    #22
    So they are aligning to the current DHS effort..... ;)
    Mostly
     
  23. Snoopy4 macrumors 6502a

    Snoopy4

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    #23
    The left is good at that. Clearly unable to distinguish betweeen the two. I encourage congress to make illegal entry a felony.
    --- Post Merged, Feb 22, 2017 ---
    Fixed by ending birthright citizenship.
     
  24. Zenithal macrumors 68040

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    #24
    Not a bad move. And you'd want to throw them in jail, right? They'd just continue to keep coming back anyway.
     
  25. Snoopy4 macrumors 6502a

    Snoopy4

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    #25
    Plenty of space in the desert to build them.
     

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