No more smoking in public places in NYC

diorio

macrumors 6502a
Aug 22, 2002
774
0
Originally posted by edvniow
Poor smokers.

I'm not one of them, but I kinda feel sorry for them, I mean they can't smoke anywhere now without somebody bitching about it.

I never saw what the big deal was anywayz.....
Oh poor smokers. They have too pay so much for a pack of cigarettes. I mean all that they are doing is a: killing themselves b: polluting the air and c: killing others with their second hand smoke. I think thats the best idea that NY has ever had.
 

Mr. Anderson

Moderator emeritus
Original poster
Nov 1, 2001
22,561
0
VA
Originally posted by edvniow
Poor smokers.

I'm not one of them, but I kinda feel sorry for them, I mean they can't smoke anywhere now without somebody bitching about it.
If you don't smoke you really shouldn't be subjected to it, especially when eating. There are a couple places here in Alexandria that I like to go to once in a while, but I end up having to change clothes and take a shower afterwards because everything smells of smoke. Ugh!

D
 

ChicagoMac

macrumors regular
Nov 8, 2002
117
0
Battle Creek, MI
The big deal for me is that I don't want to breath in their smoke or walk out of a store or restaurant smelling like cigarettes. Of course, most of them just stand right outside the door so you still get it coming and going. I lived in Minneapolis when they passed the indoor clean air act and it was great!
 

vniow

macrumors G4
Jul 18, 2002
10,266
0
I accidentally my whole location.
Originally posted by diorio


Oh poor smokers. They have too pay so much for a pack of cigarettes. I mean all that they are doing is a: killing themselves b: polluting the air and c: killing others with their second hand smoke. I think thats the best idea that NY has ever had.


What's the big deal about smoking?

People have been doing it since they figured out that things could be smoked, I just don't see what the big deal is over it.
I mean second hand smoke, jeez, there's many more things that are much more dangerous and life threatening (like cars) that aren't banned. Why smoking?

Edit: I agree that it's excessive in some situations, but I think people make a bigger deal out of it than it really is.
 

diorio

macrumors 6502a
Aug 22, 2002
774
0
Originally posted by edvniow




What's the big deal about smoking?

People have been doing it since they figured out that things could be smoked, I just don't see what the big deal is over it.
I mean second hand smoke, jeez, there's many more things that are much more dangerous and life threatening (like cars) that aren't banned. Why smoking?
Are you serious? Smoking is the foulest thing a human being can do to their body willingly. It has been proven to cause cancer, and ultimately a shorter life span. It has also been proved that second hand smoke can cause cancer. Why should a nonsmoker have to be around those smoking? What have we done to deserve this foul invasion of poisen into our lungs? The smoke from cigarettes a: stinks b: lingers in your clothers c: is life threatening, must I go on?
 

ChicagoMac

macrumors regular
Nov 8, 2002
117
0
Battle Creek, MI
Go put your mouth over someone's tailpipe and tell me if you feel the same;) I don't go home smelling like car exhaust after a meal. Just because people learned that things can be smoked doesn't mean we should smoke them.
 

vniow

macrumors G4
Jul 18, 2002
10,266
0
I accidentally my whole location.
Originally posted by diorio


Are you serious? Smoking is the foulest thing a human being can do to their body willingly.
So let them.

They're fully aware of the risks involved, just like the people who get into a car everyday and drive off to work where they could easily get into an accident. Just like the people who fly in a plane...I could go on and on, but the point is that smoking is dangerous. So what?

That's a part of life whether you like it or not and I'm not about to tell somebody that they can't because of a few people who can't seem to take it.

ChicagoMac:


Just because people learned that things can be smoked doesn't mean we should smoke them.
But does that mean they can't smoke them?
Pot doesn't kill and is less dangerous than cigarettes (in some parts) and it's illegal for some reason.
Alcohol kills more peopole every year than cigarrettes and that's not ilegal for some reason either........

What a funny take on drugs we have in this country.

BTW, both of my parents smoked since before I was born and didn't quit until I was about 10.
I hated every breath I took around them, but whenever I went to a resturant or whatever, it was always in the non-smoking section and I could breathe peacefully and let the smokers have their own little section.
 

diorio

macrumors 6502a
Aug 22, 2002
774
0
Originally posted by edvniow


So let them.

They're fully aware of the risks involved, just like the people who get into a car everyday and drive off to work where they could easily get into an accident. Just like the people who fly in a plane...I could go on and on, but the point is that smoking is dangerous. So what?



That's a part of life whether you like it or not and I'm not about to tell somebody that they can't because of a few people who can't seem to take it.





But does that mean they can't smoke them?
Pot doesn't kill and is less dangerous than cigarettes (in some parts) and it's illegal for some reason.
Alcohol kills more peopole every year than cigarrettes and that's not ilegal for some reason either........



What a funny take on drugs we have in this country.

BTW, both of my parents smoked since before I was born and didn't quit until I was about 10.
I hated every breath I took around them, but whenever I went to a resturant or whatever, it was always in the non-smoking section and I could breathe peacefully and let the smokers have their own little section.


Why should I have to take part in it?
Actually more and more are quitting, and I hear more and more bitch about smokers all the time. Why should I have to "take it"? I'll bet that before I die, smoking will be extint, because us non smokers are growing more and more, and starting to say "why should I put up with this ass who is polluting the air?"
By drinking, you don't directly effect me until you wreck into me.

There you go. You hated every breath around them. Second hand smoke isn't pleasent is it? Just because they have their own little section doesn't mean anything. You can still smell it and it still gets on your clothes.
 

Nipsy

macrumors 65816
Jan 19, 2002
1,009
0
Here's what is wrong with the logic:
Do you know anoyone addicted to secondhand smoke? No. Second hand smoke is like living in LA, you can get away from it very easily.

Bars should be exempted:
There is already a diverse selection of non-smoking bars. To make all bars enforce this is bad for the owners and the customers. 10% of people on the street smoke. 50% of people in bars smoke. Therefore the legislation does nothing good for NYC bars.

I live in SF, and have watched as some really great holes in the wall have been run under because their clientele (mostly smokers) had to find new, less legally aware watering holes. Furthermore, the bar & club night life in the city has visibly deteriorated since the smoking law went into effect.

I understand restaraunts, workplaces, etc. but bars should have the descretion to decide based on their clientele.
 

Nipsy

macrumors 65816
Jan 19, 2002
1,009
0
Originally posted by diorio


Are you serious? Smoking is the foulest thing a human being can do to their body willingly. It has been proven to cause cancer, and ultimately a shorter life span. It has also been proved that second hand smoke can cause cancer. Why should a nonsmoker have to be around those smoking? What have we done to deserve this foul invasion of poisen into our lungs? The smoke from cigarettes a: stinks b: lingers in your clothers c: is life threatening, must I go on?
A smoker puts out less pollution and carcinogens in a lifetime than an SUV (almost all cars actually) puts out in a month. Here's an experiment. Sit in the garage with a case of cigarettes. Smoke them. sit in the garage with a running car. See. Remember that when you bitch and moan.

Additionally, I, a smoker, never smoke near children, in restaurants, etc. I have resepect for those around me. I do not have any patience for a person who will walk across an empty park, sit next to me on a bench, and start making those fake little coughs.

I would gladly quit smoking if everyone else in the country would give up cars which require a gas guzzler tax.
 

vniow

macrumors G4
Jul 18, 2002
10,266
0
I accidentally my whole location.
Originally posted by diorio


There you go. You hated every breath around them. Second hand smoke isn't pleasent is it? Just because they have their own little section doesn't mean anything. You can still smell it and it still gets on your clothes.

Exactly my point.

Second hand smoke isn't pleasent, but it's definaltly not addictive or life threatening and it's not something that's worth my time bitching about to the city council or whatever.
 

funkywhat2

macrumors 6502a
Jul 14, 2002
669
0
I can't wait to have Bloomberg take the rest of my rights away, and I don't even live in the city. Now he wants to tax me for using the train, but I can't drive by myself until after 9.

I thought he was supposed to be better that Guliani.

Everyone that voted for him hoping to get a few rights back but be kicking themselves.
 

ChicagoMac

macrumors regular
Nov 8, 2002
117
0
Battle Creek, MI
You must have been smoking some to think that pot is less dangerous. Where did you get that from?

As far as the non-smoking section goes, what a joke! Everybody knows that you smell the smoke no matter where you sit.

Also, your comparison of driving vs. smoking is silly. That would be like someone forcing me to ride in their car. I don't want a ride from a stranger anymmore than I want to take their smoke into my lungs.
 

vniow

macrumors G4
Jul 18, 2002
10,266
0
I accidentally my whole location.
Originally posted by ChicagoMac
You must have been smoking some to think that pot is less dangerous. Where did you get that from?

As far as the non-smoking section goes, what a joke! Everybody knows that you smell the smoke no matter where you sit.

Also, your comparison of driving vs. smoking is silly. That would be like someone forcing me to ride in their car. I don't want a ride from a stranger anymmore than I want to take their smoke into my lungs.
Pot does not kill.

There have been meny studies proving this, even my anti-every-drug-in-existence hs heath teacher confirms that.
You can smoke all the pot you want and not die from it. You can't do that with cigarrettes however.......

And I think you missed the point about my driving/smoking comparison.
Driving is dangerous and life threatning.
Smoking is dangerous and life threatning.
You can not take a ride from a stranger.
You can also not breathe in smoke from a stranger by moving away from them or kindly tell them to stop.

There are better things to complain to your city council about than second-hand smoke.
 

mnkeybsness

macrumors 68030
Jun 25, 2001
2,511
0
Moneyapolis, Minnesota
it really sucks for people like me who are completely allergic to tobacco smoke...if i'm even just walking by some people that are smoking i have to hold my breath otherwise i will literally cough up a lung...i was in a really really smokey building one night and was sick for about a week...i could barely breathe :(

jerks...do it in private...not around other people who care about their lives
 

Nipsy

macrumors 65816
Jan 19, 2002
1,009
0
Originally posted by mnkeybsness
it really sucks for people like me who are completely allergic to tobacco smoke...if i'm even just walking by some people that are smoking i have to hold my breath otherwise i will literally cough up a lung...i was in a really really smokey building one night and was sick for about a week...i could barely breathe :(

jerks...do it in private...not around other people who care about their lives
Why did you enter/stay in a really smoky building?

If you have an allergy, you should make an effort to avoid smokers. They should not make an effort to avoid you.

My friend's daughter has an allergy to chlorine, that's why she doesn't use public pools. Public pools do not close because of this.

People, both smoker's and non, should be respectful. As a smoker, I look to smoke in a way that won't affect non smokers. Non smokers should similarly look for a way no to be affected by smokers. However, if I am standing clearly away from people on a street for example, 2 times in 10, someone who could do the same, will stand next to me, and start making contrived coughing noises.

Militant smokers & militant smokers do have one thing in common, they're all jerks!
 

Sun Baked

macrumors G5
May 19, 2002
14,859
57
About time, it's not like smoking is healthy for the addict and/or the poor sap standing next to them.

And I don't hear any of the the pot/crack smokers complaining this ban infringing on their right to smoke in public. ;)
 

strider42

macrumors 65816
Feb 1, 2002
1,460
6
such rules are usually set up to protect employees, not patrons. it makes a lot of sense for that point of view. A waitress would be subjected to a lot of smoke in bars, all night, every night. In that case second smoke certainly is dangerous. And what if she's pregnent, you can't ask her to stop working, but the environment is very dangerous.

Here in california we've had this law for a long time now. its worked great. We can't smoke anywhere in doors anymore where employees will be subjected to it. There is a bar near where I live where what they did was simply set up a room where its self service, lots of ventillation, and you can legally smoke in there. Works great

Here's the funny thing about laws banishing smoking, myself (i recently quit) and my friends (most of whom smoke), actually liked it better. It limited how much we smoked so we didn't feel totally disgusting the next day. And even as a smoker, I didn't particularly like smokey bars most of the time. It really worked out better for everyone.
 

MacAztec

macrumors 68040
Oct 28, 2001
3,023
1
San Luis Obispo, CA
Wow....

I didnt think smoking "effected" so many people. ahahahhaha.

Give me ONE CASE where second hand smoke has killed someone. Just one. And pot? Give me one there.

Driving a car is the same thing. It kills you. Its polluting the air! OH NO! The ozone layer is deflating! People worry about smoking more than air pollution (not that I care for either). Its stupid. More people drive in the U.S. than smoke. An exhaust pipe is what, about 3 1/2 inches in diameter and its pumping out CARBON MONOXIDE?

A Cigarette is what, .8cm in diameter and its stinks (to some people) and its only harmful to the person smoking it?

Oh jesus, I bet you wont be able to fart in public soon. It realeases a gas, and it stinks! Oh no! Lets pass a law saying you cant fart in public. Oh and how about one saying you cant wear cologne in public because it is allergic to some people and some people say the alcohol in it is bad for you.

Cmon, what is the world coming to....

Edit: And no offence to the person that said they are allergic to smoke. Im just saying that people are allergic to everything. Im allergic to grass, should that be banned too?
 

Sun Baked

macrumors G5
May 19, 2002
14,859
57
Old study http://www.epa.gov/iaq/pubs/etsbro.html

Second-hand smoke is the third-ranking known cause of lung cancer after active smoking and indoor radon. Exposure to second-hand smoke during adult life increases the risk of lung cancer in non-smokers. Lung cancer now kills more women than breast cancer, and is the second leading cause of premature death for men. The 1992 EPA report confirms that second-hand smoke is a human lung carcinogen, and is linked to 3,000 lung cancer deaths annually in the U.S.8 Since in this case geographic and cultural differences are probably not significant, it can be assumed that the numbers are proportionately similar in Canada and Ontario. The cancer mortality from second-hand smoke alone is greater than the combined mortality from all regulated environmental carcinogens.9
 

strider42

macrumors 65816
Feb 1, 2002
1,460
6
Re: Wow....

Originally posted by MacAztec
I didnt think smoking "effected" so many people. ahahahhaha.

Give me ONE CASE where second hand smoke has killed someone. Just one. And pot? Give me one there.

Driving a car is the same thing. It kills you. Its polluting the air! OH NO! The ozone layer is deflating! People worry about smoking more than air pollution (not that I care for either). Its stupid. More people drive in the U.S. than smoke. An exhaust pipe is what, about 3 1/2 inches in diameter and its pumping out CARBON MONOXIDE?

A Cigarette is what, .8cm in diameter and its stinks (to some people) and its only harmful to the person smoking it?

Oh jesus, I bet you wont be able to fart in public soon. It realeases a gas, and it stinks! Oh no! Lets pass a law saying you cant fart in public. Oh and how about one saying you cant wear cologne in public because it is allergic to some people and some people say the alcohol in it is bad for you.

Cmon, what is the world coming to....

Edit: And no offence to the person that said they are allergic to smoke. Im just saying that people are allergic to everything. Im allergic to grass, should that be banned too?
Yeah second hand smoke never killed anyone. The kids and spouses of smokers with life threatening asthma and cardio pulmonary disease are just a statistical anomaly. For people around second hand smoke a lot, it can kill. For kids, its even worse since they bodies aren't fully developed. yes cars put out more, but we don't run them in a closed room day after day. I can promise you that as a smoker I got it much worse form smoking and being around smokers than around my cars because the environment matters just as much as the source. There's reasons so many house hold items say to use in well ventilated areas. The people working in these bars are exposed to 8 hours of heavy smoke every night they work. it ads up, and only ends up costing us all money with higher insurance costs and upblically funded health care.

Smokers should just be considerate of others, go outside for a smoke. its better for all of us. It never bothered me when I smoked, and like I said earlier, i actually liked it a lot, lot better. I have no problems with smokers (espcially being a recent quitter), but I wish those smokers that try to say it doesn't hurt anyone else would just get real about it. it does, it will, and such laws aren't relaly that huge an incovience. everyone bitched when it happened in in california. No one even thinks about it anymore.
 

Nipsy

macrumors 65816
Jan 19, 2002
1,009
0
Originally posted by Sun Baked
Old study

Second-hand smoke is the third-ranking known cause of lung cancer after active smoking and indoor radon.
So why don't we hear any news about news laws to eliminate Radon through Gov't mandated ventilation?

BTW, food poisoning kills thousands, mis-prescribed drugs kill ~10,000. Drunk drivers (car, train, ship, plane, bus) kill many. Chemical waste must be up there too. These are VERIFIABLE facts, yet the smoker remains the persecuted species. There are many ways to spend tax dollars to save lives which ARE MUCH MORE EFFECTIVE!

3,000 deaths "linked" to second hand smoked is a statistic. It could be 0, 1, 1,000 or 5000 caused by second hand smoke, but 3000 are "linked". If I get lung cancer because I worked in a polyester plant, but my wife smoked, that could be "linked".

Not to belittle the issue, but rather than legislate smoking, why not apply pressure to the tobacco companies to remove some of the added carcinogens (good for everyone), the auto companies to ensure emissions from SUVs meet passenger car standards, the doctors/pharmacists deliver the right drugs, and the cooks are better trained in food safety?

Don't even get me started on the American obese...
 

irmongoose

macrumors 68030
The immediate effects of breathing second-hand smoke include an increase in heart rate and blood pressure, and dangerous levels of carbon monoxide in the blood. The smoke from the burning end of a cigarette is filled with hundreds of dangerous chemicals and contains more tar and nicotine then the smoke that is directly inhaled.
Exposure to secondhand smoke may increase the risk of gum disease, study results suggest.

Nonsmokers inhaling environmental tobacco smoke at work or home increased their chances of developing periodontal disease about 1.5 times, according to
researchers from the University of North Carolina School of Dentistry in Chapel Hill.

Even though this increase in risk is much smaller than the increase in risk associated with active cigarette smoking (which is up to 5 times greater), environmental
tobacco smoke could account for many cases of periodontal disease nationwide,'' according to lead author Dr. Samuel J. Arbes, Jr.
* 3,000 lung cancer deaths (in nonsmokers) annually.
* Up to 300,000 lower respiratory infections in babies and toddlers under 18 months old. How could people do this to babies and toddlers?
* Asthma in children and aggravations of symptoms in adults who already have asthma.
* Increased risk of SIDS (sudden infant death syndrome).
* 36,000 deaths from heart disease.
* Irritation of eyes, noses and throats in the vicinity.
* Diminished capacity for young students in math, logic and reasoning.
Tobacco smoke contains about 4,000 chemicals, including 200 known poisons. Every time some one smokes, poisons such as benzene, formaldehyde and carbon monoxide are released into the air, which means that not only is the smoker inhaling them but so is everyone else around him. Many studies now show that this secondhand smoke can have harmful effects on nonsmokers and even cause them to develop diseases such as lung cancer.

You decide for yourself.




irmongoose
 
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