NV Dem convention in chaos

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by thewap, May 16, 2016.

  1. thewap macrumors demi-god

    thewap

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  2. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #2
    The DNC is trying to coronate Hillary at all cost , Hillary supporters don't care and many democrats will still vote for her even if she cheats
     
  3. zin macrumors 6502

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    #3
    Bernie has received something close to 70% of the independent vote share in the primaries. Clinton is sinking with this demographic against Trump. The Democratic Party might just have something unpleasant coming their way in November if they think independents and Sanders voters are going to jump in line and vote for her, especially when these kinds of tactics serve to alienate more and more members.
     
  4. thewap thread starter macrumors demi-god

    thewap

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    #4
    The bogus tactics used against the Bernies were also used against Trump, but Trump overcame it with massive votes.
    The dems however have so many "superdelegates" ie; party politicians and lobby cronies, that Bernie doesn't stand a chance.

    One article mentioned that chairs were thrown at the delegates at this caucus, but have not found a video showing that yet.
     
  5. VulchR macrumors 68020

    VulchR

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    #5
    As chaotic as this looked, you have no evidence that Hillary had anything to do with it, or indeed whether any cheating went on. What there is evidence of is a very close vote and passions running high.

    Still, it seems to me that there should be wholesale reform of the primary voting processes. It certainly does not look like one-person-one-vote....
     
  6. thermodynamic Suspended

    thermodynamic

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    #6
    Isn't there a qualifying percentage that mandates a recount, albeit a small one like 2 or 3%?

    Agreed.

    Unless the superdelegates change their minds, Hillary is pretty much the nominee - and I've read enough articles that actually do discuss how Bernie can get ahead, from enough MSM sources (e.g. Huffpo) that I don't believe the media is rabidly anti-Bernie. Trump has gotten a lot of press that could qualify under the "equal clause" act.
    --- Post Merged, May 16, 2016 ---
    Each side has many supporters that give a free pardon to their candidate while talking about the others. Politics is known for not always being honest 100% of the time. So we can all say "______ supporters don't care" for any of the candidates, which would be true statements, and nothing is achieved.

    So what's left seems simple: Look at each candidate, find out where they are the most consistently true on, coupled with soft skills since that's as much part of the job as anything else and relevantly so, and go from there. As a result...
     
  7. Fancuku macrumors 6502a

    Fancuku

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    #7
    The party of fairness and tolerance, alright!
     
  8. Robisan macrumors 6502

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    #8
    Meanwhile, in the real world...

    Here's John Ralston, the preeminent and non-partisan political reporter in Nevada:

    Despite their social media frothing and self-righteous screeds, the facts reveal that the Sanders folks disregarded rules, then when shown the truth, attacked organizers and party officials as tools of a conspiracy to defraud the senator of what was never rightfully his in the first place. Instead of acknowledging they were out-organized by a Clinton campaign chastened by county convention results and reanimated to cement the caucus numbers at the Paris, the Sanders folks have decided to cry conflagration in a crowded building, without regard to what they burn down in the process.

    ~~~

    Despite all of this, the Sunday chalking of the walls and sidewalks and the social media nastiness still going on, some facts are ineluctable, some of them elucidated in this post from the state Democratic Party:

    Sanders lost the caucus on Feb. 20. He had no right to the most delegates, even if the Clinton campaign was asleep at the switch for the county conventions. The Sanders campaign simply did not follow through. As the Medium post reveals, the Sanders folks just did not show up; the Clinton delegates did:

    Clinton only had 27 delegate positions vacant on Saturday. Sanders left 462 vacant. Clinton filled 98 percent of her available delegate slots at the State Convention, and Sanders only filled 78 percent of his available delegate slots.

    End of story. They lost

    ►On the 64 delegates the Sanders campaign insists should have been seated, the Democratic Party post reveals only six showed up and:

    The remaining potential delegates were ineligible for two main reasons: 1) They were not registered Democratic voters in Nevada by May 1, 2016, and 2) Their information — such as address, date of birth and name — could not be found or identified, and they did not respond to requests from the party and campaigns to correct it.

    Rules, it appears, have no place in a revolution.

    “They're lazy, they don't read the rules and when the rules are pointed out to them, they cry by exaggerating some Democratic talking point (everyone should participate, rules are unfair, it's mean to do this),” said one longtime Democrat who attended what he called his "first and last convention.”
    BernieBro dead enders are just a bunch of crybaby sore losers.

    --- Post Merged, May 17, 2016 ---
    Why should they do that? Clinton has won the most pledged/earned delegates and has received the most votes. Wouldn't it be more outrageous for the superdelegates to go against the will of the voters?

    Look forget the superdelegates - Bernie lost fair and square. He got fewer delegates and fewer votes than his opponent. He lost. There is NO reason for the superdelegates to give the nomination to the loser of the primaries.
     
  9. FrankieTDouglas macrumors 65816

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    #9
    I know a lot of Bernie supporters who are definitely not voting for Hillary. Some will go for Stein, while quite a few others are going to vote Trump.
     
  10. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #10
    Super delegates should follow democracy. And that means Clinton.
     
  11. APlotdevice macrumors 68040

    APlotdevice

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    #11
    There is a very good reason: Hilary is damaged goods. The only saving grace to her dismal favorably rating is that Trump's is slightly worse. If a scandal broke out during the general... like say the FBI indicting her... then the Democrats can kiss any chance of keeping the White House goodbye.
     
  12. zin macrumors 6502

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    #12
    On a per state basis, sure. And not before your state has voted.

    Clinton had a de facto delegate lead of about 450(?) before the first primary had even begun.
     
  13. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #13
    She has won more elected delegates too and won a larger share of the popular vote.
     
  14. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #14
    I'm currently at work and haven't been able to see this video. What I have noticed is the very suspicious wording of reports that chairs were being thrown. Lots of talk about it, haven't seen one video in a room that was clearly being recorded from nearly every angle. Does anyone have a link to verify the "reports of chairs being thrown?"

    Something on the coverage here doesn't smell right, especially because I haven't heard one MSM report of what these people were actually pissed about (voice votes that were clearly not distinct).

    Hillary and the DNC have a major problem, they're going to be abandoned by the next generation if they don't go back to New Deal ideals.
     
  15. zin macrumors 6502

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    #15
    I'm not disagreeing with that. But do you honestly think you should be starting an election with what amounts to a 450 delegate lead before anybody has even voted?
     
  16. lowendlinux Contributor

    lowendlinux

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    #16
    Here's the NYT take on it

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/17/u...ick&contentCollection=Politics&pgtype=article
     
  17. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #17
    No.
     
  18. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #18
  19. FrankieTDouglas macrumors 65816

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    #19
    What the **** does that even mean? It's common knowledge that the protesting, violence, and destruction at Trump rallies was by this same general group, not Trump supporters.
     
  20. Robisan macrumors 6502

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    #20
    What she had was endorsements, not votes. Superdelegates don't vote until the convention, like every other delegate. Notwithstanding their pre-primary endorsements, when the SDs cast their actual votes at the convention they will almost certainly vote for whoever won the most pledged delegates and most primary votes.

    Look at what happened in 2008. I don't have the exact numbers but Clinton started that race with more SD endorsements than Obama. But when Obama won the most votes and pledged delegates the SDs voted to make Obama the nominee.

    One other point - like everyone else, SDs have a 1st Amendment right to express their preference of who they support. The fact is, that's all they can do - express a preference - before the convention actually votes.
     
  21. zin macrumors 6502

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    #21
    Yes, they are endorsements and can change. The difference is almost every delegate tracker included them before the primary had even started. Not only that, but you have states that voted Sanders with their super delegates going Clinton.

    You can't honestly tell me that seeing and hearing that Clinton is 170 delegates away from winning (or having a ~700 delegate lead) wouldn't influence some people, despite both statements being incorrect.

    Also, in 2008, Mrs. Clinton actually held onto ⅓ of the super delegates. That is a sizeable number who did not choose to respect the final pledged delegate count.
     
  22. Robisan macrumors 6502

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    #22
    On any number of fronts I wish we had a better press corp. This is just another example. Not sure that the answer is to tell SDs "sorry, because the press sucks you have to ST*U and are not allowed your 1st Amendment rights."
    --- Post Merged, May 17, 2016 ---
    Stay classy BerniBros. Some of you really do belong with Trump...

    Since the convention, state party chair Roberta Lange has reportedly continued to receive death threats over the phone and via texts after a Sanders activist posted her personal contact information online. A sampling of voicemails Lange has been receiving posted by Ralston Reports include threats that she "should be hung in a public execution" and that she should "pack your bags right now because the **** storm you’ve ensued is coming."

    The Nevada Dems' complaint, meanwhile, included texts sent to Lange telling her to "Prepare for hell" because "We know where you live," "Where you work," "Where you eat," "Where your kids go to school/ grandkids."​
     
  23. aaronvan Suspended

    aaronvan

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  24. Fancuku macrumors 6502a

    Fancuku

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    #24
    More like #BernieOrBurnThePlaceDown
    Why are these Bernie supporters so hateful and violent?
     
  25. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #25
    If Trump or Clinton were the nominee wouldn't you be hateful and violent too?
     

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