Obama - the Anticolonialist?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by fivepoint, Sep 12, 2010.

  1. fivepoint macrumors 65816

    fivepoint

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    #1
    Intriguing piece by Dinesh D'Souza regarding the anti-business, anti-capitalist positions of President Obama, and a new thought process into how these positions originated (anticolonialism). Seems to be an inordinate number of assumptions in this piece, but Dinesh generally does it homework... I'm guessing his upcoming book on the same topic will go into much more detail and explain/validate many of those seen here.

    Does any of this ring true?
    Do you care at all about Obama's childhood?
    Is the 'how' Obama came to his opinions important, or just 'what' those opinions are that matters?
    I'm not sure what all of this means, but it is interesting.


    [continued below]
     
  2. fivepoint thread starter macrumors 65816

    fivepoint

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    #2
    [continued from above]

     
  3. flopticalcube macrumors G4

    flopticalcube

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    #3
    Reposting an entire article is not only bad form but probably infringes copyright.
     
  4. OutThere macrumors 603

    OutThere

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    #4
    Well, I read the whole article...

    Obama's actions must be judged on their value rather than their intent, not that I really believe the author's idea that Obama is somehow motivated by his father to pursue the same goals. I think it is incredibly unfair to judge someone so strongly based on the actions and political intent of their absent father. That said, I also disagree that the author 'did his homework' on the subject, as much of it is geared to create a reactionary emotional response and intended less to promote rational political discussion. Certainly anyone that begins with an abrupt accusation of Obama as the most 'anti-business' president in American history is not preparing for a balanced discussion.
     
  5. bobber205 macrumors 68020

    bobber205

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    #5
    Yeah our deficit was < a trillion before he came into office! Facts check ftw! :rolleyes:
     
  6. Rt&Dzine macrumors 6502a

    Rt&Dzine

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    #6
    Dinesh should lay off the weed.

    This is choice . . .
     
  7. Peace macrumors Core

    Peace

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    #7
    Couldn't you just have posted a link to the article ?
     
  8. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #8
    What a waste of my time. All of it can be easily refuted but this piece stood out above all.

    So the last president (who was Republican by the way) when he quite strangely stated that America was addicted to oil is also an anti-colonialist? What does America's addiction have to do with anything? Perhaps that just underlines his own tortured relationship with his patrician blue-blooded father and grandfather who funded Hitler?

    What is the point of this article again, oh that's right, there is none, he or she, is just rambling on about a whole bunch of pointless issues in hope of perhaps making a point if only by mistake.

    FP, you really need to stop breathing in whatever you are breathing. If you believe this article has any relevance to anything...........
     
  9. .Andy macrumors 68030

    .Andy

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    #9
    Got this far and couldn't read from laughing :D.
     
  10. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    #10
    I'm not sure how seriously to take an essay by the author of "The Enemy at Home: the Cultural Left and It's Responsibility for 9/11" a book that put the cause of 9/11 on the left for a "...an aggressive global campaign to undermine the traditional patriarchal family"

    As Publisher's Weekly writes: "Pointing to Hillary Clinton, Britney Spears and Noam Chomsky, he decries those who have teamed up with Hollywood and the U.N. to foist an irreligious, sexually licentious, antifamily liberal culture—epitomized by Eve Ensler's play The Vagina Monologues and gay marriage initiatives—on a Muslim world that rightly reviles it."

    That said, I find D'Douza's argument unconvincing. First, the idea that Obama is the "most anti-business president" in a generation seems oddly laughable considering recent legislation and his support of Wall Street. Moreover, the short-term and limited loans and stock-buyouts were designed to save American businesses.
    Additionally, D'Souza's argument about the underwriting of the Brazilian oil rig makes a claim for American oil versus Brazilian oil, a completely non-sensical point since oil is entirely fungible on the open market. Further, Obama's speech about America's dependence on oil was entirely apropos: the Gulf disaster came about because the world needs huge amounts of oil to keep going. Obama didn't ignore the clean-up, instead he used that speech as an opportunity to talk about "green" technologies.
    Lastly, I have very little patience for pop psychology readings of people. D'Souza attempts to get into Obama's head, but does so without compassion or interest into why Obama may be trying to do some good. Instead, he uses Obama's father as hammer to throw. And the whole operation fails like nearly all of D'Souza's essays. The only more laughable conservative essayist is Jonah Goldberg.
     
  11. zap2 macrumors 604

    zap2

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    #11

    That was particularly disrespectful and entirely unneeded. It certainly turned me away from participating in this thread.
     
  12. remmy macrumors 6502a

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    #12
    Agree totally, better to put a link, and a short quote which may some up the article.
     
  13. Ttownbeast macrumors 65816

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    #13
    Yep, you probably should have stopped at that thought rather than copying, pasting, and posting another time wasting Obama critical diatribe.:rolleyes:
     
  14. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #14
    Obama isn't an anti-capitalist. No major country in the world is anti-capitalist.
     
  15. Peterkro macrumors 68020

    Peterkro

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    #15
    Take for instance the Petrobras loans/guarantees,approved by the Export-Import Bank (U.S. version) these loans by commercial lenders are not as you might imagine to help out the Brazilian oil industry but to create a advantageous position for the sale of goods and services by U.S. companies to Petrobras.The board at the time of the approval consisted of three Republicans and two Democrats all of whom were appointed by Bush Jnr,the guarantees are so that these "free" market lenders take no risk at all,if it all goes pear shaped the U.S. taxpayers will bail them out,Capitalism red in tooth and claw indeed.

    It strikes me as strange that someone who criticises Obama:
    "The real problem with Obama is worse--much worse. But we have been blinded to his real agenda because, across the political spectrum, we all seek to fit him into some version of American history. In the process, we ignore Obama's own history. Here is a man who spent his formative years--the first 17 years of his life--off the American mainland, in Hawaii, Indonesia and Pakistan, with multiple subsequent journeys to Africa."
    spent his "formative years" as a citizen of another country,how many years?oh that's right,seventeen.In spite of the hypocrisy he is coming close to saying anyone who has ever held a passport has been exposed to the devils ideas and therefore is not a "real" American.

    As for fivepoints copy and paste method of political spam,I would expect nothing else.
     
  16. niuniu macrumors 68020

    niuniu

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    #16
    "Incredibly, the U.S. is being ruled according to the dreams of a Luo tribesman of the 1950s. This philandering, inebriated African socialist, who raged against the world for denying him the realization of his anticolonial ambitions, is now setting the nation's agenda through the reincarnation of his dreams in his son"


    Article will be very appealing to closet racists I have no doubt, and the author knows exactly how to play them :rolleyes:
     
  17. Shivetya macrumors 65816

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    #17
    a cute story trying to come up with a purpose behind someone who is clueless in governing. As in, people will look under every rock before declaring the fact its just incompetence and self worship
     
  18. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #18
    Are we supposed to take this seriously? Did any of this really not ring any alarm bells in the OP's head?

    Nice thread title, BTW. Perhaps there's a job opening writing lower-thirds for Fox.
     
  19. fivepoint thread starter macrumors 65816

    fivepoint

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    #19
    Interesting... now it seems Newt Gingrich (who most political pundits would consider to be a popular potential candiate for the Republican Presidential nomination in 2012) is buying into Dinesh's article and being rather vocal about it...


    Also, those of you who have criticisms about the way I quoted the article are truly laughable. ;)
     
  20. CaptMurdock macrumors 6502a

    CaptMurdock

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    #20
    The only thing laughable I've seen is the idea that Newt Gingrich is going to Save Us All from the Mad Kenyan Anti-Colonialist. This guy couldn't save old newspapers from the incinerator. He's a political punchline that only rabid right-wingers still have faith in. Running him against Obama in 2012 would be a bigger embarrassment to the GOP than Dole in '96. (Not that that's ever stopped 'em...)
     
  21. Queso macrumors G4

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    #21
    Gingrich for President? My, they are scraping the barrel aren't they? :D
     
  22. .Andy macrumors 68030

    .Andy

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    #22
    Who would have thought the echo chamber would swing into action so quickly.....
     
  23. Sdashiki macrumors 68040

    Sdashiki

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    #23
    TL;DR.

    5P = dont care.

    5P replies = hilariously obvious.
     
  24. Rt&Dzine macrumors 6502a

    Rt&Dzine

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    #24
    The author is a known race-baiter.
     
  25. fivepoint thread starter macrumors 65816

    fivepoint

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    #25
    I think there's some truth here. Obviously good people anywhere would agree that great leaders can come from any sort of background, and that one's actions as an adult should not be limited or tied down by their actions, etc. as a child. I also think though that it is useful to look at someone's upbringing to better understand the man/woman they are today and what worldviews were present in their lives at a young age. Even if their own personal views are exactly the opposite when they grow up, learning about their childhood can help explain how they came to their current viewpoints and what life-changing event led them to take such a starkly different path than their parents who obviously played a major role in their lives. I think many capitalists/conservatives do have a concern about someone who's parents were marxists/socialists and what that might mean for the psychology of their offspring. And if their child grew up to have very different view points (even though as recently as college he admitted to seeking out the 'marxists professors'), what changed all that? Who was it or what was it that caused Barack Obama's massive switch in worldview? It wasn't Jeff Jones, it wasn't Rev. Wright, so who was it? What event caused him to change his views on socialism/marxism or as Dinesh states... anti-colonialism.



    The point is to better understand the POTUS, who he is, his history, how his worldviews were created, when/if/how those wordviews changed as he grew up or if the viewpoints of his father can be used to better understand his actions today. It's attempting to bring the American people to a better understanding for who the POTUS is, there are many Americans who feel like they don't know him at all, and what they see doesn't always make perfect sense considering his history, etc. If you personally don't see any value in such a thing, I would suggest not participating in the discussion. Certainly many people don't care about the past, just want to focus on the present/future and judge him solely on his current actions. I'd say that's completely fair.



    I'd like to see you get into a debate with Dinesh. The man is quite intelligent and obviously well studied. Plus, he's a foreign minority college professor, so you liberals should love him! ;)




    Agreed, I don't necessarily find him to be the most anti-business POTUS ever. There are several different ways to measure it, but he's most certainly more anti-business that the vast majority of U.S. presidents. Also, his anti-business intentions may also be a bit stifled by the unique requirements of the time and the down economy. Even if he wanted to be more 'anti-business' he couldnt' afford to be in this political climate with the economy taking such a huge fall.

    I also agree that the oil argument was a bit of a reach. Like I said in my OP, many assumptions were made in this article, I can only hope he backs them up with more facts in his book. But the entire argument he's making relies on a good amount of conjecture just on the very nature of it... which he'd obviously admit to. It's just a theory, a way to look at Obama's actions and get a better understanding for what's going on in his head as he makes these decisions... decisions many of us find to be nonsensical. You hit the nail on the head when you said it was a psychology reading... and of course Dinesh being a conservative, he approaches it from that worldview, not from the 'what good can come from Obama's anti-colonialist worldview' that more liberal essayist might take. To dismiss the reading as pure nonsense, or as worthless though I think is doing a disservice to the article though. There's some interesting ideas here, and I do think it brings a bit of insight into the positions of Obama.






    Projecting your own insecurities about race onto Dinesh is pretty sad, considering he is an immigrant from India himself. If you liberals can't see racism, you do whatever you can to try and find it. Your arguments have gotten lazy over the years, and many liberals rely on race baiting to win arguments. Its easier to argue policy if you an simply paint your opponent as an anti-immigrant racist.





    A far more simple and potentially just as accurate analysis. Incompetent in understanding mainstream America, sure. Incompetent in communication/politics, no. Incompetent in economic theory, absolutely.



    Got you to read it, didn't I? BTW, that would be a fun job! Don't know if I'm edgy enough to write headlines for the HuffPo though.
     

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