Paper or Plastic ?

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Plutonius, May 7, 2019.

  1. Plutonius macrumors 604

    Plutonius

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    Feb 22, 2003
    Location:
    New Hampshire, USA
    #1
    New Jersey is going to be voting on a bill that prevents food industry stores from supplying both single use paper and plastic bags. The bill is expected to pass.

    In places that have tried this, people are bringing in their own trash bags (to use as grocery bags) which are worse for the environment then the current bags.

    Are you in favor of similar legislation or do you think the government should stay out of it.
     
  2. ouimetnick macrumors 68020

    ouimetnick

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    #2
    I know some town and cities in Massachusetts have banned single use plastic bags, but they still use the brown paper bags. I don’t see why one would ban single use brown paper bags? Sure ideally I would have my reusable bag with me, but paper also works. (I also use the empty paper bags for other things including reuse until they are to be recycled)
     
  3. Sydde macrumors 68020

    Sydde

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  4. T'hain Esh Kelch macrumors 601

    T'hain Esh Kelch

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    Denmark
    #4
    Actually, that is very much a global problem. An estimated ~13 million tons of plastic end up in the oceans every year. And I wouldn't exactly call Kenya, the first country in the world to ban plastic bags, a first world country.

    Downplaying the plastic issue equals ignorance.
     
  5. Chew Toy McCoy macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

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    May 13, 2016
    #5
    To one degree or another that has been the case in CA for years. Shocking, I know. I’m well used to it and have some nice washable canvas bags with long straps I can sling over my shoulder. This has enabled me to carry way more in a trip than traditional paper/plastic bags, especially considering I live in a 2nd story apartment. Couldn’t imagine going back to the free paper and plastic options.

    And I've never seen anybody bring in trash bags but maybe the east coast is more ghetto than here.
     
  6. Peterkro macrumors 68020

    Peterkro

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    #6
    Kenya had a very encompassing ban but Bangladesh ( also a developing country) had the first ban.
     
  7. A.Goldberg macrumors 68020

    A.Goldberg

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    #7
    In Boston plastic isn’t banned but they created an ordinance to charge $0.05 per bag. Half the time they forget to charge me. Honestly for $0.05 I don’t think that’s going to change a lot of behavior- it doesn’t with me. $0.50 or $1.00 might have more of an impact. I’m pretty sure the rule here in Brookline you have to give out paper or reusable plastic bags (thicker plastic than regular bags). The reusable plastic bags I suspect are thrown away at the same rate as regular plastic bags, which probably makes things worse.
     
  8. AlliFlowers Contributor

    AlliFlowers

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    L.A. (Lower Alabama)
    #8
    I understand banning plastic. We've gotten ourselves in trouble using so much plastic. But paper? That can be recycled easily.

    I'm all for banning plastic when possible.
     
  9. Chew Toy McCoy macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

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    #9
    I don’t get the whole charge per bag thing as any kind of deterrent. Seems to me that it’s just a way for the store to recoup the cost of the bag after just giving them away for free for the last century. What’s next, fast food places charging you per packet of ketchup because, you know, plastic.
     
  10. ronntaylor macrumors regular

    ronntaylor

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    #10
    Both are problematic as they're resource hogs that eventually harm the environment. Canvas bags are best and last much, much longer.
     
  11. Plutonius thread starter macrumors 604

    Plutonius

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    #11
    I hope you wash the canvas bags on a regular basis to prevent bacteria contamination.
     
  12. ericgtr12 macrumors 65816

    ericgtr12

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    #12
    Yep, in California everyone is used to it and though you see trash on the streets, plastic bags are a rare site these days as a result.

    The reality is that it's bad for the environment in many ways, pollutes all the streets and waterways and lasts forever. This legislation has proven to be effective and the Government not only has a role, but a responsibility because the people who toss them sure's hell don't care.

    This talk about brining in trash bags must be a joke, was that on Fox News or something? I have never once seen this in either the poorer or affluent stores around the city, everyone just brings in their own bags.
    --- Post Merged, May 7, 2019 ---
    Yesterday I was out taking photos in a delta area away from people in the bay, it's very rare that I can get a photo like this without plastic somewhere, it's just sad.

    IMG_8202_forweb.jpg
     
  13. lostngone, May 7, 2019
    Last edited: May 7, 2019

    lostngone macrumors 65816

    lostngone

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    #13
    I remember when they told us we had to switch to plastic because we were decimating all those forests with the paper bags. Now the plastic bags are bad too.
    --- Post Merged, May 7, 2019 ---
    This also sounds like a business opportunity. Organize the homeless/less fortunate to sell paper and plastic bags outside stores at a premium. You could even run a racket to put the best people in the best spots.
     
  14. ronntaylor macrumors regular

    ronntaylor

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    #14
    My mother in-law insists on single use before they're piled up to be washed. We have dozens of those bags (many from local grocers that love her). And as a former cafe manager that passed NYC's stringent food safety course, I wash my fruits, veggies, and all surfaces and utensils/tools that may come in contact with food.
     
  15. ericgtr12 macrumors 65816

    ericgtr12

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    #15
    It's common knowledge for those of us who are used to it, this thread is just hyperbolic.
    --- Post Merged, May 7, 2019 ---
    Reality check for those not paying attention, there are literally islands of plastic in our oceans

    [​IMG]
     
  16. JayMysterio macrumors 6502a

    JayMysterio

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    Rock Ridge, California
    #16
    Hawaii is .15 a bag. Kind of off putting buying expensive things, then getting hit for .15 to put that item in a bag.
     
  17. Altis macrumors 68030

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    #17
  18. ericgtr12 macrumors 65816

    ericgtr12

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    #18
    Couldn’t disagree more, every step we take plays a role and at a local level it’s made a huge difference in cleaning up the streets.

    Basically all you are saying here is that if you can’t stop it all then there’s no point in even trying. Everyone must do their part and lead by example for those who don’t.
     
  19. LordVic macrumors 603

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2011
    #19
    Both can very well be true.

    Plastics have a very high environmental impact in their entire lifespan. From production to disposal. Recycling plastic is very costly and inefficient.

    However, Paper does generally require deforestation in order to continue to produce as much paper products as we go through. Though Paper's disposal is far less impactful as it biodegrades fairly quickly and is easier to recycle.

    IT turns out. A lot of things we take for granted for convenience, have negative affects on our planets ecology. We need to reduce those where we can and look for new, viable, and innovative ways of accomplishing the same tasks, but with less environmental impact.
     
  20. PracticalMac macrumors 68030

    PracticalMac

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    Houston, TX
    #20
    Costco and Sam's Club does not offer paper nor plastic bags.

    What is the big deal??? [​IMG]
     
  21. blackfox macrumors 65816

    blackfox

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    PDX
    #21
    depending on the plastic bag referred to, results are mixed with regards to paper bags. Here in Portland, paper bags are banned (at least for grocery). It's fine. I have reusable canvas bags anyhow. Yet, sometimes paper bags are worse than modern plastic bags in terms of resources used for production, usability, and utility.
     
  22. Plutonius thread starter macrumors 604

    Plutonius

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    #22
    Do you periodically wash your canvas bags ?
     
  23. blackfox macrumors 65816

    blackfox

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    #23
    not often, but yes.
     
  24. Plutonius thread starter macrumors 604

    Plutonius

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    #24
    It's recommended that people wash them on a regular basis to prevent bacteria food contamination.
     
  25. blackfox macrumors 65816

    blackfox

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    Feb 18, 2003
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    PDX
    #25
    This is true. Frankly, I keep them in the trunk of my Saab wagon for whenever I need to go to the store. Also, to point, my veggies and fruits are all still protected by plastic bags I get inside the store (but not at checkout) - so this is all kinda ridiculous, right?
     

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