Police Shooting Frenzy Raises Concerns

steve knight

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Jan 28, 2009
2,596
6,958
crazy they shot everything including themselves. But this is florida so this is what we have come to expect.

http://miami.cbslocal.com/2014/05/06/police-shooting-frenzy-raises-concerns/
MIAMI (CBSMiami) – On December 10, more than two dozen police officers from across Miami Dade County converged on a blue Volvo that had crashed in the backyard of a townhouse on 65th Street just off 27th Avenue.
As the car was wedged helplessly between a light pole and a tree, nearly a minute passed before officers opened up – firing approximately 50 bullets at the car and the two unarmed men inside the vehicle.
The two men inside the car survived that initial volley of gunfire, according to witnesses, who said they could see the men moving inside the Volvo. Everything went quiet for nearly two minutes before the officers opened up a second time – unleashing an unrelenting torrent of bullets that lasted almost 25 seconds. By the time it was over, the two men inside the car were dead.
CBS4 News has learned a total of 23 officers fired a total of at least 377 rounds.
Bullets were sprayed everywhere. They hit the Volvo, other cars in the lot, fence posts and neighboring businesses. They blasted holes in a townhouse where a 12-year-old dove to the ground for cover and a four month old slept in his crib.
“It was like the Wild Wild West, man, crazy,” said Anthony Vandiver, who barely made it through the back door of his home before the gunfire erupted. “Shooting just wild; shooting all over the place. Bullets could have come through the window. Anything could have happened man. They weren’t thinking, they weren’t thinking at all.”
 
Last edited by a moderator:

rhett7660

macrumors G5
Jan 9, 2008
12,245
2,257
Sunny, Southern California
Not justifying the shooting by any means, but these guys did shoot at police and did shoot a police officer earlier in the night.

Again not justifying, but that part was left out of the initial quote above.

Jesus 377 bullets!
 

steve knight

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Jan 28, 2009
2,596
6,958
yes they did. but they did not shoot back after the first round or even before.
 

Southern Dad

macrumors 68000
May 23, 2010
1,532
547
Shady Dale, Georgia
Adrenalin runs high in a situation like that. Two officers were hit in the crossfire. I'm sure they thought that there was fire being returned. Shooting a police officer is taken pretty seriously. They figure if you will kill a cop and steal his car, you'll just about do anything.

Obviously, they need a lot of training in calm down.
 

benthewraith

macrumors 68040
May 27, 2006
3,073
80
Miami, FL
No, I was referring to your quote of the article, not the original quote. I only found about the previous shooting from reading the whole article.

That is all I was saying.
One of the guys committed no crime.

But what police didn’t realize before they started shooting at the Volvo is there was a second man in the car – Corsini Valdes – who had committed no crime.
Sounds like Corsini may have been picked up by a friend not knowing he was wanted by police. They were both unarmed at the time.

But Montesano and Valdes weren’t the only ones struck – two Miami Dade police officers were hit as well – caught in the crossfire. One officer was shot in the arm and the second was hit in the arm and grazed in the head. If the bullet had struck just a half an inch to the side the officer would have been killed.
Bullets were sprayed everywhere. They hit the Volvo, other cars in the lot, fence posts and neighboring businesses. They blasted holes in a townhouse where a 12-year-old dove to the ground for cover and a four month old slept in his crib.
Spray and prey nearly got their own comrades killed as well as jeopardized the lives of innocent people living in the neighborhood. Jesus.

Oh Florida...
It isn't just Florida. This is done everywhere, including NYC and Las Vegas.

Then here's some more statistics out of NYC regarding spray and pray.

Targets fired at by New York City police officers:

......Target.............................No. of Shots Fired.....No. of Hits

1....Perpetrators..............................928......................173
2....Dogs..........................................155......................111
3....Accidental discharge....................43........................17
4....Protecting other officer................18........................10
5....Officer intoxicated........................10..........................0
6....Suicide...........................................8..........................8
7....Into locker.....................................6..........................0
8....Vehicle...........................................5..........................0
9....Girlfriend........................................3..........................3
10..Attempted suicide..........................3..........................2

Source: Firearms Discharge Assault Report for 1993, as reported in Police magazine, March 1995.
 
Last edited:

Southern Dad

macrumors 68000
May 23, 2010
1,532
547
Shady Dale, Georgia
One of the guys committed no crime.

Sounds like Corsini may have been picked up by a friend not knowing he was wanted by police. They were both unarmed at the time.

Spray and prey nearly got their own comrades killed as well as jeopardized the lives of innocent people living in the neighborhood. Jesus.
Two important lessons here…

(1) Know who you are getting in a car with…

(2) When you kill a cop, they get a bit excited...
 

benthewraith

macrumors 68040
May 27, 2006
3,073
80
Miami, FL
Two important lessons here…

(1) Know who you are getting in a car with…

(2) When you kill a cop, they get a bit excited...
That in no way whatsoever justifies the situation. I completely understand they're upset about the loss of a brother/friend so to speak, but getting emotional or careless isn't going to help the situation. It will only make things worse. Like it did here.
 

Huntn

macrumors demi-god
May 5, 2008
17,089
16,624
The Misty Mountains
What happened to come out with your hands up? Or was that tried? I guess they were not worried about collateral damage. Was this in a minority neighborhood? -_-
 

Southern Dad

macrumors 68000
May 23, 2010
1,532
547
Shady Dale, Georgia
That in no way whatsoever justifies the situation. I completely understand they're upset about the loss of a brother/friend so to speak, but getting emotional or careless isn't going to help the situation. It will only make things worse. Like it did here.
I didn't say it justified it. I just stated the facts. You shoot a cop, they get excited and you get dead.

On the chart above, I notice suicide was the only one 100%. Shooting at vehicles was 0%.
 

jkcerda

macrumors 6502a
Jun 10, 2013
682
39,048
Criminal Mexi Midget
That sounds like a really bad idea to disarm Police Officers.
awww come'on, at least those involved in this shooting should not be wearing a badge, the car was wedge & had no where to go, there were no guns present & the cops STILL shot the people inside.

just like the uniformed morons in L.A. I bet they get to keep their jobs :mad:
 

benthewraith

macrumors 68040
May 27, 2006
3,073
80
Miami, FL
I didn't say it justified it. I just stated the facts. You shoot a cop, they get excited and you get dead.

On the chart above, I notice suicide was the only one 100%. Shooting at vehicles was 0%.
Nope, one person failed to hit their intended target while committing suicide (attempted suicide).
 

chown33

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 9, 2009
8,380
4,367
Pumpkindale
It isn't just Florida. This is done everywhere, including NYC and Las Vegas.

Then here's some more statistics out of NYC regarding spray and pray.
One of the surprising things about that table is that Accidental Discharges (17/43 = 39.5%) had twice the hit rate of Perpetrators (173/928 m= 18.6%). That means marksmanship, in the sense of hitting a target, is actually better when accidental than when intentional.
 

benthewraith

macrumors 68040
May 27, 2006
3,073
80
Miami, FL
One of the surprising things about that table is that Accidental Discharges (17/43 = 39.5%) had twice the hit rate of Perpetrators (173/928 m= 18.6%). That means marksmanship, in the sense of hitting a target, is actually better when accidental than when intentional.
Probably not so much to do with marksmanship as it has to do with the proximity of the target during the accidental discharge.
 

Bug-Creator

macrumors 6502a
May 30, 2011
552
2,132
Germany
What is the lessen to be learned out of this ?

If your chased by an angry mob with flashing party lights, guilty or not, and just can't get away your best chances are with trying a "Butch Cassidy and Sundance Kid"........