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Powermac G5 liquid cooled service (possibility)

MAC MAN JW

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jul 12, 2011
320
16
Buffalo,Ny
Who here would be interested in a LCS service for G5's with leaking liquid cooling? I have a good background in cars and custom built PCS with modern-day liquid cooling combine those two together and you get pretty much a car cooling system in a G5 which is pretty much what the G5 has. I have at least 3 I will be doing myself replacing the o rings and rebuilding the LCS. If all goes well I'm considering starting a reasonable mail in LCS service as I see a lot of people don't want to try it themselves. Just putting that out there to see of interest I wouldn't be asking no eBay prices mostly just parts and a little bit of labor more of a hobby then anything to keep older liquid cooled macs alive I would have a machine to test in after rebuilt if so. Just trying to save the LC Macs out there where the owners don't want to take on the liquid cooling challenge. Would anybody be interested in something like this or is it a dead idea?.
 

timidpimpin

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Nov 10, 2018
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I think it makes a lot more sense for people to learn to fix it themselves. It makes no sense to buy a high maintenance machine like a G5 with a LCS and not be able to fix it yourself.

Also, it seems you're still figuring out things yourself, so how would that in any way qualify you to offer any type of service? People would be just as well off to figure it out themselves, just like you're still doing.
 

eyoungren

macrumors Core
Aug 31, 2011
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I've only really got two concerns…

1. Mail in LCS service. That means sending in either the G5 itself or the LCS. If you are sending in the G5 then there is the cost in shipping to and from and the possibility of damage each time. If the unit arrives damaged to you, how is that resolved? What about back to the customer? Can you guarantee a service that protects the Mac during shipping? Bent handles are a bitch.

2. The alternative is sending in the LCS itself. There's less risk in damage here, but if someone is going to go through all that trouble of getting the LCS system out, then I have to agree with @timidpimpin, they might as well learn to fix it themselves. Once you're that deep in cooling block, pump, hose and o-rings you might as well finish the job.
 

Tucom

Cancelled
Jul 29, 2006
1,252
304
I think it makes a lot more sense for people to learn to fix it themselves. It makes no sense to buy a high maintenance machine like a G5 with a LCS and not be able to fix it yourself.

Also, it seems you're still figuring out things yourself, so how would that in any way qualify you to offer any type of service? People would be just as well off to figure it out themselves, just like you're still doing.

What a snobby, pretentious reply lmao.. - he's offering a service he knows how to do and you try to speak some drivel with made up assumptions his about knowledge and expertise?! All to imply people would 'rather do it themselves'?

Wow. Did you make heaven and Earth too?

Don't come knocking at anyone else's door asking for help next time, lol.

I for one think this is a great idea, the REALITY of the situation ACTUALLY is people don't go through the trouble of fixing it themselves and thus throw these beautiful machines out, which is why they end up in the dump and whatnot. This is awesome, do it OP - I'm sure you'll find real people thankful for your outreach rather than the head in the sand comments aforementioned, which can happen from time to time.
 
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eyoungren

macrumors Core
Aug 31, 2011
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What a snobby, pretentious reply lmao.. - he's offering a service he knows how to do and you try to speak some drivel with made up assumptions his about knowledge and expertise?! All to imply people would 'rather do it themselves'?

Wow. Did you make heaven and Earth too?

Don't come knocking at anyone else's door asking for help next time, lol.

I for one think this is a great idea, the REALITY of the situation ACTUALLY is people don't go through the trouble of fixing it themselves and thus throw these beautiful machines out, which is why they end up in the dump and whatnot. This is awesome, do it OP - I'm sure you'll find real people thankful for your outreach rather than the head in the sand comments aforementioned, which can happen from time to time.
I didn't read his post that way.

A lot of people mistake being direct for being rude and pretentious (or arrogant). Having lived with my wife for 20+ years and dating her for three years before that I've learned the difference.

Reread his post. Everything he said was factual, but nowhere in there was an attack on OP's abilities. OP has admitted no experience with G5 cooling systems, only a background in a different industry.
 

timidpimpin

macrumors 65816
Nov 10, 2018
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I didn't read his post that way.

A lot of people mistake being direct for being rude and pretentious (or arrogant). Having lived with my wife for 20+ years and dating her for three years before that I've learned the difference.

Reread his post. Everything he said was factual, but nowhere in there was an attack on OP's abilities. OP has admitted no experience with G5 cooling systems, only a background in a different industry.
Exactly. A G5's LCS is very unique, and so unique that experience with other types is all but irrelevant. When I pay for any type of service I expect the one doing said service be an actual expert. Not still figuring things out.
 

Origin41

macrumors newbie
Oct 14, 2020
14
3
@Tucom & eyoungren

There was a aluminium case someone made I saw on eBay a few days back entitled mini Mac an in black, he'd built a custom case for his Mac Mini..

Trying to find it.. Unsuccessfully I might add.. I should bookmark more! 🤓

It looked like a mini G5
 
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CooperBox

macrumors 65816
Nov 28, 2010
1,353
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France - between Ricard & Absinthe
What a snobby, pretentious reply lmao.. - he's offering a service he knows how to do and you try to speak some drivel with made up assumptions his about knowledge and expertise?! All to imply people would 'rather do it themselves'?

Wow. Did you make heaven and Earth too?

Don't come knocking at anyone else's door asking for help next time, lol.

I for one think this is a great idea, the REALITY of the situation ACTUALLY is people don't go through the trouble of fixing it themselves and thus throw these beautiful machines out, which is why they end up in the dump and whatnot. This is awesome, do it OP - I'm sure you'll find real people thankful for your outreach rather than the head in the sand comments aforementioned, which can happen from time to time.
I think you must be reading timidpimpin's post in some other language. I read it in English and it makes perfect sense the way it's written. Certainly no snobby, pretentious reply.
You say, the OP is "offering a service he knows how to do." But that's not strictly true on an LCS G5, as the OP himself clearly states, "If all goes well I'm considering starting a reasonable mail in LCS service". So he's obviously not yet sucessfully completed an LCS rebuild, although I'm in no way questioning his ability to succeed.
Plus reading timidpimpin's post there's certainly no drivel there, just plain common sense - which you've clearly missed. Of course it makes a lot more sense for people to learn to fix it themselves! Only a short while ago I wouldn't have dared to even attempt upgrading RAM on an iMac or early iBook (a 3min task) but since having discovered iFixit, even the most difficult of laptops (G3 Clamshell and 12" PowerBook) I can now completely refurbish with ease. And I suggest to others: 'You never know what you're capable of doing and achieving - until you try!
Also ignore the sarcastic comment, "Don't come knocking at anyone else's door asking for help next time". If anyone has any repair/refurbishment queries, just post them on this forum. You'll always find someone helpful to offer positive advise.
 

Tucom

Cancelled
Jul 29, 2006
1,252
304
I think you must be reading timidpimpin's post in some other language. I read it in English and it makes perfect sense the way it's written. Certainly no snobby, pretentious reply.
You say, the OP is "offering a service he knows how to do." But that's not strictly true on an LCS G5, as the OP himself clearly states, "If all goes well I'm considering starting a reasonable mail in LCS service". So he's obviously not yet sucessfully completed an LCS rebuild, although I'm in no way questioning his ability to succeed.
Plus reading timidpimpin's post there's certainly no drivel there, just plain common sense - which you've clearly missed. Of course it makes a lot more sense for people to learn to fix it themselves! Only a short while ago I wouldn't have dared to even attempt upgrading RAM on an iMac or early iBook (a 3min task) but since having discovered iFixit, even the most difficult of laptops (G3 Clamshell and 12" PowerBook) I can now completely refurbish with ease. And I suggest to others: 'You never know what you're capable of doing and achieving - until you try!
Also ignore the sarcastic comment, "Don't come knocking at anyone else's door asking for help next time". If anyone has any repair/refurbishment queries, just post them on this forum. You'll always find someone helpful to offer positive advise.


Dude... it's over. Holy crap. Could care less, hope all goes all and the OP repairs some of these old beautiful machines.

Take care
 
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MAC MAN JW

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jul 12, 2011
320
16
Buffalo,Ny
I think it makes a lot more sense for people to learn to fix it themselves. It makes no sense to buy a high maintenance machine like a G5 with a LCS and not be able to fix it yourself.

Also, it seems you're still figuring out things yourself, so how would that in any way qualify you to offer any type of service? People would be just as well off to figure it out themselves, just like you're still doing.
This wouldn't be anytime soon it's a "future idea/possibility" was just seeing if there was any interest and I agree people should just do them themselves but some just don't want to dig into it. I have 5 LC Macs with the Delphi single pump and that's probably the only pump I would work on if so, for me to consider this even I would have to have 100% success rate of my own, and would have to go relatively smooth, if it's a huge hassle which from what I see can be I'm sure some worse than others then this idea will be scrapped. Would not be anytime soon not before the beginning/mid of 2021 at best. As I would want time to rebuild my own make sure they hold up good and then if it's something that seems feasible I would move forward in maybe trying to start something then.
 

MAC MAN JW

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jul 12, 2011
320
16
Buffalo,Ny
I've only really got two concerns…

1. Mail in LCS service. That means sending in either the G5 itself or the LCS. If you are sending in the G5 then there is the cost in shipping to and from and the possibility of damage each time. If the unit arrives damaged to you, how is that resolved? What about back to the customer? Can you guarantee a service that protects the Mac during shipping? Bent handles are a bitch.

2. The alternative is sending in the LCS itself. There's less risk in damage here, but if someone is going to go through all that trouble of getting the LCS system out, then I have to agree with @timidpimpin, they might as well learn to fix it themselves. Once you're that deep in cooling block, pump, hose and o-rings you might as well finish the job.
I do agree although the dead 2.7 I had removing the liquid cooler was not that hard but then again I'm somewhat used to ripping apart stuff and have tool kits some people might not so understandable. And would definitely just be the liquid cooler. There's no way g5s are getting shipped as it would be too much and I guarantee at least one would get damaged in shipping if not more.
 
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MAC MAN JW

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jul 12, 2011
320
16
Buffalo,Ny
What a snobby, pretentious reply lmao.. - he's offering a service he knows how to do and you try to speak some drivel with made up assumptions his about knowledge and expertise?! All to imply people would 'rather do it themselves'?

Wow. Did you make heaven and Earth too?

Don't come knocking at anyone else's door asking for help next time, lol.

I for one think this is a great idea, the REALITY of the situation ACTUALLY is people don't go through the trouble of fixing it themselves and thus throw these beautiful machines out, which is why they end up in the dump and whatnot. This is awesome, do it OP - I'm sure you'll find real people thankful for your outreach rather than the head in the sand comments aforementioned, which can happen from time to time.
I do plan to but I'm obviously doing mine first :) I have 5 LC Macs that all need redone, when it comes down to it to me it looks fairly easy, corrosion will be the biggest issue overall, this would not be before probably mid 2021 as I plan on doing all the macs I have first to obviously get everything down pat with my own stuff so if something were to go wrong or I make an error it's not on somebody else's cooler then I want to test it out for several months with at least a few times a week use and running CPU intensive tasks to make sure no overheating,leaks or anything else happens. If all goes well then I will consider doing this, I'll keep this thread alive and I'll post pictures of each rebuild I do, it's not going to be fast paced but it will give people a idea if they like how I do it that's great, if not hopefully it gives them some insight to do their own as the guide is good that I found but not very picture intensive. if I get a camera with a tripod I would also consider doing a YouTube video of a rebuild I think people could understand it a lot better if you see it and can follow it step by step but that's a discussion for another time.
 

MAC MAN JW

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jul 12, 2011
320
16
Buffalo,Ny
I didn't read his post that way.

A lot of people mistake being direct for being rude and pretentious (or arrogant). Having lived with my wife for 20+ years and dating her for three years before that I've learned the difference.

Reread his post. Everything he said was factual, but nowhere in there was an attack on OP's abilities. OP has admitted no experience with G5 cooling systems, only a background in a different industry.

I do agree with that although have a good background in doing liquid cooling in PC'S but I know this is completely different than what's in modern liquid cooling more or less. as I stated another posts it would not be to mid 2021 and after I get all 5 of mine done, with zero faults after months of running then I would consider it. The hardest part as I stated before in another reply will be if there is a lot of corrosion the rest looks fairly simple to me I've already had the liquid cooler out of my dead 2.7GHz and I ripped it all apart not that big of project other than the corrosion issue!.
 

MAC MAN JW

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jul 12, 2011
320
16
Buffalo,Ny
I will try to reply to Everyone you're all entitled to your opinions whether one agrees with it or not, but in this post I'll put the facts that I am working by whether anything comes out of it or not 🙂

#1 at best this would not be to mid 2021(more than likely), I have 5 liquid-cooled Mac's I have to start on, they will need to be all finished first, used regularly afterwords for at least 3 or 4 months with no issues with the LCS again (NO leaks, overheating, Ect.) Before I would even attempt repair on anyone else's LCS.

#2 I do agree and disagree people should try it on their own but everybody has their own skill level I do believe it would totally help with a very detailed guide with lots of pictures or better yet a YouTube video as a lot of people including myself from time to time like to follow things steps by step and actually see it, each one I do of my own I will be taking a lot of pictures and posting it on here if I can get a decent camera and a tripod I will also make a YouTube video but don't expect a YouTube video anytime soon to be totally honest.

#3 if this ends up being a total nightmare with the majority of the ones I have, which from the looks of the liquid cooling system I already ripped apart of my dead 2.7 G5 corrosion is going to be the biggest issue.

#4 although would be the easiest at the end to test afterwards to have the machine the LCS go's to. There is no way complete G5's are getting shipped back and forth, would be a lot of $ and from previous experience I can guarantee no matter how good you pack it there will be at least one that would get damaged in shipping.

#5 the machine would have to work beforehand completely fine just high temp issues, if there is any visible corrosion on the bottom of the case the CPUs are going to be all corroded to the point of I'm not touching them and it's more than likely too far gone, if there are no visible leaks or corrosion and the machine is still working fine it's more than likely just between the CPU and LCS and can be cleaned off the CPU card carefully after the LCS rebuild.

#6 would be more than likely only the one pump Delphi system as that's what the majority of mine have and most of the ones that leak seem to have those so I think that's fair.

#7 this is still just an idea even if all goes well there is a lot to work out still, ideally I would like to bench test the system before I return it with ASD and do a thermal calibration to make sure everything passes but obviously that is impossible without The machine. Ideally the best way would be removing the CPUs before it's sent and have just the liquid cooler to rebuild but as previous people have stated when you remove all that you're close to just rebuilding the whole thing already. The end idea is having a test rig that I can swap the whole CPU and cooler in do thermal calibration and make sure everything passes then send it back knowing it's 100% good. That's a possibility that could happen but I'll have to try to source some LC Macs in bad shape as I know constantly changing CPUs and liquid coolers will ultimately more than likely lead to a logic board issue with bad solder joints ect or CPU sockets from inserting and taking out CPUs. If you guys happen to find any beat up Macs for sale that would cover this "liquid cooling system" please send me the link I've been keeping an eye out but I can't look everywhere for stuff to "pop up".

#8 I will keep this thread updated eventually leading to hopefully step by step Hi Res. pictures and a video I think that would tremendously help people who want to give it a try them selfs.

#9 overall end goal if this does work out and go smoothly, is CPU and cooler sent in, cooling system redone, put it in a test rig G5 and run ASD on it and make sure there is no issues. As stated before if anybody sees any cheap Dual 2.7GHz's,2.5GHz's, ect with liquid cooling please send me the link and none in pristine shape "test rig condition"

#10 Just watch this post for updates hopefully this will work out, if not it will provide pictures for people to do it themselves and obstacles you may run into. This will be updated periodically once I start ripping into the cooling systems and redoing them which will more than likely be mid November. 🙂
 

timidpimpin

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Nov 10, 2018
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This wouldn't be anytime soon it's a "future idea/possibility" was just seeing if there was any interest and I agree people should just do them themselves but some just don't want to dig into it. I have 5 LC Macs with the Delphi single pump and that's probably the only pump I would work on if so, for me to consider this even I would have to have 100% success rate of my own, and would have to go relatively smooth, if it's a huge hassle which from what I see can be I'm sure some worse than others then this idea will be scrapped. Would not be anytime soon not before the beginning/mid of 2021 at best. As I would want time to rebuild my own make sure they hold up good and then if it's something that seems feasible I would move forward in maybe trying to start something then.

This certainly explains it a lot better. It seems you have a good plan in place to qualify yourself, which is great. I was thinking you were another one of those that learn a sliver of info, then get cocky and fail types that we have so many of in computer repair.

But having said all that... if someone doesn't have the ability to repair every aspect of a G5 with a LCS on their own, then they shouldn't buy one in the first place IMO. Because it will just become a money pit to ship it around and pay others to fix it. One direction shipping can easily exceed the value of the system.
 
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MrVitalic

macrumors member
Mar 16, 2020
72
107
I’l be the devil’s advocate. Sending this thru my space station com.

The G5 lcs is not special or alien tech either. Its just a lcs based off car design without a expansion tank. If you know how to bleed a car radiator you know how to bleed a G5 lcs.

Its just pump and hose. The liquid inside is not unicorn juice either, simply red dextron or wathever.
 
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NikolaPPC

macrumors member
Jan 14, 2020
48
37
What trending LCS coolants would you advise to use?
Some recommendations on the old threads or sites are no longer available. I also have a failing LCS Quad and would love to contribute to this thread with instructions!

Cheers, Nikola!
 

MrVitalic

macrumors member
Mar 16, 2020
72
107
What trending LCS coolants would you advise to use?
Some recommendations on the old threads or sites are no longer available. I also have a failing LCS Quad and would love to contribute to this thread with instructions!

Cheers, Nikola!
[automerge]1603148176[/automerge]
 

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RhianB

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I always like to approach "business-ish" concepts with a trip down worse-case-scenario avenue. How would you protect yourself from a "you broke my LCS" claim, lawsuit etc?

Either the money involved makes the risk worth it or it doesn't. If it doesn't make money sense, there usually are safer ways to employ your skill, keep it in the realm of hobbyist and still establish a modest revenue stream from it without the above risk.

Additionally, what if you did actually kill their LCS? How would you compensate your customer, recover from that and move forward? Again is it worth it?

All healthy questions to ask and flesh out when considering a new venture. I do think its a neat idea but I personally would be more inclined to use your skillset to build a self help model and ecommerce storefront ie: how to videos that are linked to refurb kits for the two models. Something like that. In this way, you are selling goods, and not a service beyond shipping bits and bobs to the customer. Your LLC is not responsible for the outcome. It's up to them to make it happen.

Best of luck to you.
 
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eyoungren

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Aug 31, 2011
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I always like to approach "business-ish" concepts with a trip down worse-case-scenario avenue.
This is what I was thinking in my first reply.

It's one thing when this is a hobby. We're all in this together and we do a lot for each other and eat the cost of a lot of stuff some times. If someone is sending me a free Mac or a part and it gets damaged then that is the risk and you move on as best you can. Most of the time it turns out just fine.

But when you get money involved - it's a whole other story. Money in exchange for services turns the hobby into employment and the expectation that the one performing the service is qualified. They may be, they may not be, but we expect it and when they aren't, because this was previously a hobby, then bad-will kicks in.

This is one of the primary reasons I don't involve myself in multi-member projects around here. I've seen that and money ruin too many relationships. Now, if you have the pro skills and the cash to back it up and make it right, that's great. But most of us here are hobbyists and not Apple Certified Technicians.

All of that said, I believe OP probably has a good shot at this.
 
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RhianB

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Assuming OP has the skill set which I do, it is important to drill down on risk vs reward . OP likes ppc, likes tinkering, and keeping these beasts out of landfill as a moral motivator is there so time as currency makes sense as he enjoys it & the mission drives social good.

So it really boils down to risk. Can he afford to absorb the financial risk should something go south. Only he can make that judgement and to your point, the second money changes hands, hobby becomes a business transaction and with it expectations and that’s when feelings get hurt, people get pissed off and bad things happen.

Again is it worth it? Stuff OP needs to really flesh out and think through before just jumping into the ocean. Plenty of sharks out there.
 
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