Public trusts republicans more than democrats.

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by mgguy, Jul 12, 2009.

  1. mgguy macrumors 6502

    mgguy

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    #1
    Results of a new Rasmussen poll (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/mood_of_america/trust_on_issues/trust_on_issues) show the public trusts the GOP more than democrats on 8 out of 10 key issues, including who can best manage the economy. Respondents rate Obama's performance as more negative than positive. Are republicans staged for a comeback in 2012?

    Here is the lead-in to the article:

     
  2. obeygiant macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    Just goes to show you how fickle the public can be. I'd like to see the polls before the election.

    Maybe the honeymoon really is over.
     
  3. Sun Baked macrumors G5

    Sun Baked

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    need the Chainsaw Al political party, to do the painful cuts at some point and balance the budget.

    Can't really trust anyone that says the fix isn't going to be very very painful, and may include having to remove a festering gonad.

    Though a pat on the head, a smooth talking man, and a bigger bandaid will put it off to the next term.

    Edit: sort of scary to see how many government bodies in the US used the accounting tricks to do short term sleight of hand, and those things look like they will implode rather interestingly.
     
  4. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    We're not even six months into Obama's term, and the public wants miracle cures for the most severe recession in 80 years...a recession caused by primarily by Republican economic policies, and secondarily by wimpy blue-dog Democrats who go along with Republican economic policies.

    I find it stunning beyond belief that the voters would turn right back to the very people who've been screwing them for nearly 40 years and who are directly responsible for the horrendous mess we're in.

    And Republicans edging out Democrats on issues of ethics? *Gag!*

    I can't think of too many rational explanations for such results. The only ones that come to mind are:
    • the poll is seriously flawed;
    • the poll is jobbed;
    • the public has the common sense of a brain-damaged chimp.
     
  5. .Andy macrumors 68030

    .Andy

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    I'd agree with this. The less political power a party has the more trustworthy they are.
     
  6. LizKat macrumors 68040

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    Yah let's get to the 2010 polls first. 2012 is spicy fun for bloggers, but the meat and potatoes will be about the Congressional elections.

    People now have the attention span of a one-year-old and the expectations to match. Unfortunately the media outlets play to both of those qualities. What a poll asks may not be what the responder hears. What a responder says now may have little to do with how he or she votes in 2010, much less 2012.

    The GOP will try in 2010 to pick off what they can, running on tactics that are regional and have worked in the past. Whatever they say now about 2012 is to keep the base interested. What they will do now is work towards Congressional seat gains next year.

    Mainly, there is a tremendous amount of background noise right now from people whose professional behavior will be directly affected by impending banking and investment industry regulation changes.

    That noise is not being expressed as forthright, boring complaints about the esoterica of credit default swap clearance and systemic risk management. It's being expressed as "Obama will break your middle class piggy bank" --and that attempt to shift voter focus is entirely intentional.

    It's about trying to get the Congressional balance altered in 2010, to be able to head off or re-legislate some of the richly deserved regulation coming down the road.

    Six months ago people still remembered what a debacle these investment wizards had created, bringing their houses of cards down around us all as their trust in each other vanished, taking trillions of dollars of wealth down with it.

    Two months ago people were still incensed at credit rate hikes in advance of enforcement of newly passed legislation.

    Now it's summertime and the memories are fading and it's back to the usual drumbeats of the GOP being against "liberal tax and spend policies." I can go down to the general store and say "Look, Obama is not who cratered what was a big fat surplus in the budget." And nowadays all I will hear back is something like "yeah but Obama wants to take all my money to buy free healthcare for some bum who never had a job."

    Go figure. I'm not surprised, but I am disappointed at the willingness of people to be fleeced yet again by a party that has shown that it does not have the interests of ordinary working class Americans in mind. I'm thinking I need to keep paying attention myself this year and next, so to be able to take some better arguments down to that general store!
     
  7. paddy macrumors 6502a

    paddy

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  8. mgguy thread starter macrumors 6502

    mgguy

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    But Obama does want to take a large chunk of taxpayer money to buy healthcare coverage for many people who never had a job who are not currently covered. As I understand it, his plan would also cover illegal immigrants and their children, which is a large portion of the current population of those who are uninsured. This proposed spending, along with the large stimulus package and the cost of his proposed cap and trade program, may be what is causing the general public to take a second look at and begin to question his economic policies and spending proposals.

    Bush/republicans did go on a spending spree, but Obama is taking it to new heights. How is this good for "ordinary working class Americans" (whoever they are)?
     
  9. Prof. macrumors 601

    Prof.

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  10. mgguy thread starter macrumors 6502

    mgguy

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    Another possibility is that Obama is giving them more change than they wanted, and of the wrong kind. Many voters may have thought that he would be more moderate than he is, and now are surprised that he is going way beyond what they thought he was advocating during the campaign.
     
  11. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    Aren't you the guys that keep saying he's brought no change?

    So which one is it, none, too much, the wrong kind?
     
  12. Tomorrow macrumors 604

    Tomorrow

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    Where were all these people last November?

    I'm curious who is participating in these polls. The results are skewed just a little farther right than I would have expected.
     
  13. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #13
    I'd like to see an age breakdown as well as the % of cell phones that were called.

    I can't see in the polling data where they asked if the person was Dem, Rep or Ind. seems pointless if 75% of those polled were repubs.
     
  14. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #14
    well it could not be any cell that they called. Cells are off limits to anything like that still.
     
  15. LizKat macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    Where did you get your figures on the uninsured?

    According to the Kaiser Familiy Foundation on the subject of the uninsured, "79 percent are U.S. citizens, more than 80 percent are from families where at least one person holds a job, and two-thirds earn less than 200 percent of the federal poverty threshold – i.e., less than $42,406 for a family of four in 2007, the most recent year for which Census has figures for the uninsured."

    So that would leaves max 21% of the uninsured are immigrants, legal and illegal, but we don't know the breakout.

    Here's a link to some info as per above, plus a nice list of other resources at the bottom of the linked piece:


    I have read there and elsewhere that about six million of a total of 45 million uninsured are illegal immigrants. That would be 13% or so. What we do know for sure is that the illegal immigrants avail themselves of far less expensive medical treatment than do other immigrants and US citizens.

    So let's not get carried away with the immigration issue in health care reform. They are not the biggest concern in health care reform by any stretch of statistics.

    Reform will not be a picnic for anyone. Obama's plan and any other plans being discussed all take a bite out of all of us. We will have to pay for coverage if we can afford it. We will not think we can afford what the government thinks we can afford, so that will be a rude surprise to many of us. We may think we'd rather have another car than pay for health insurance. but as a taxpayer we'd rather everyone else certainly buy health insurance, eh?

    We will be asked to be responsible and buy coverage. Possibly we will be penalized for not doing it. So it will feel like a sacrifice, and not a joyfully made one.

    It's less of a sacrifice than a practical move, when you think of the fact that everyone is in that boat of not wanting to pay for it but not wanting to pay taxes for other people's coverage either. So it's time to grow up, pay for coverage like it's the same as a utility bill and move on. Reform may need further tweaks in the future. We have to work at it as we see how it unfolds.

    I am never impressed by us Americans when we scream as if some unwanted proposal is cast on our gravestones but we're still alive and kicking. It's so phoney and juvenile. As with anything in real life, you make a plan, you try it out, you adjust it, you try it again. We need decent health care in the USA and this is a fine time to make it happen. ANY TIME IN THE PAST TWENTY-FIVE YEARS WOULD HAVE BEEN FINE TOO :)

    Another painful reality is that coverage may not be what we would like it to be.. It may be difficult to get coverage of certain procedures, and there may be out of pocket costs there were not before, particularly for people now used to buying Medigap policies to pick up first dollar costs of stuff Medicare does not cover. More yelling and screaming ahead.

    But before people start screaming about rationing of health care, it's important to understand that it's already rationed by profit motives in health care right now. For instance, if it were not for foreign doctors and nurses, rural care in the USA would be almost nonexistent in many counties. It's at a bare minimum right now.

    The place to put the pressure now is on the drug and insurance companies, not on Obama or on the committees trying to get bipartisan support for their measures. The hospitals have sat down and come to agreements on cost reductions. The drug and insurance companies are still dragging their feet, even though some past insurance company heads have said that yes, they need to knock down cost increases related mostly to keeping profits rising!

    You asked who I think are ordinary working class Americans. People whose income is primarily from wages. Wage earners. Not people who mostly live off income from investments. And not earners whose wages are in the stratosphere.
     
  16. mgguy thread starter macrumors 6502

    mgguy

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    Too much (at least as proposed) and of the wrong kind.

    I didn't give any figures on the makeup of the uninsured population, and I really don't want to make this thread just about healthcare. I had heard in various news/talk venues that the uninsured make up 40% of the uninsured. However, even if it is just approaching 15%, that is a huge number of people that arguably shouldn't be covered. Even if you want to argue that it would be fair or more economical to cover them, I think this is one of the factors that turn many people off about universal coverage. In addition, while illegal immigrants may currently not draw the same level of health care services that legal residents do, that would change if they were offered health coverage. If it is available, they will use it more.

    Some people, myself included, also have a problem paying for coverage for others who are not working and would make no contribution to their coverage. This is just a further expansion of a welfare entitlement that we cannot afford right now. This may be one of the factors driving down Obama's poll numbers.

    Hence, the drop in Obama's approval ratings?
     
  17. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

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    uh oh...have the republicans already given up on 2010????? Another clobbering in store for them in 2010??? :eek::D

    Seriously though, the best thing the republicans have going for them in the near future is that they're the only opposition party we have......given recent history tho, it's possible they'll find a way to make a mess of that
     
  18. mgguy thread starter macrumors 6502

    mgguy

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    #18
    What recent history/events are you referring to that suggests to you that they may make a mess of being the opposition party? Based on the trend in the polls, they seem to be doing a pretty good job at shifting the public's trust in their favor.
     
  19. Macky-Mac macrumors 68030

    Macky-Mac

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    ensign? sanford? :eek: all they have to do to avoid messing up is keep their heads down and stop embarressing themselves.....but they haven't seemed to figure out how to do that yet

    still, I'm sure it's nice to have an opportunity to feel optimistic......for a change
     
  20. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    Funny how differently we think. I had considered a fourth possibility myself...that Obama hadn't changed enough in Washington, leaving people with the impression that he's just another politician. (Certainly that's the view of more than one person here.)

    Frankly, I don't put much stock in either idea as the answer to why the poll skews the way it does.

    I'm curious as to this pollster. I couldn't help notice the testimonials at the top of their page...almost all from people or sites who lean towards the right-wing and/or the business community.

    If there's any truth to that at all, it'd be like reading a poll from Fox News.
     
  21. Shivetya macrumors 65816

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    LOL - the majority of this was caused by Democrats meddling with lending laws, worse Barney Frank is at it again. The banking collapse is mostly if not all related to lending on homes. When the FED under the direction of Congress reduced the requirements to obtain loans it caused home prices to rise incredibly.

    Sorry, ain't going to accept it was just Republicans leading the charge to fiscal idiocy, the Democrats even now seem more than eager to prove they can be even dumber.
     
  22. opinioncircle macrumors 6502a

    opinioncircle

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    You do have a point. Republicans were not the only dumb dumbs in this story. However Dems are trying to apply what they think is the right method. It sure isn't lack of oversight over the financial world like the Republicans and the Bush administration rooted for...
     
  23. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

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    So little of this has to do with banking deregulation, huh, which just happens to be the Republicans' favorite topic (after tax breaks)?

    The lending laws you mention have been an RNC/Limbaugh talking point, one which they've been trying to gin up considerably to make themselves look less responsible. However, you might want to look up something about the Glass-Steagall act, particularly its repeal. The Democrats were partly responsible in that some of them went along with it, but look whose names are on the repeal bill: Gramm and Leach.
     
  24. GfPQqmcRKUvP macrumors 68040

    GfPQqmcRKUvP

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    There's more than enough blame to throw around. Often overlooked is the moral hazard the topic of bailouts created.


    Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_hazard

     
  25. Dont Hurt Me macrumors 603

    Dont Hurt Me

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    Both sides simply take turns screwing the U.S. worker/taxpayer. We shouldnt trust either party period.. I trust neither and find the party out of power allways seems more interested in representing the American worker.
     

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