Racist Trump helped Houston but not PR

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by koulmj, Dec 30, 2017.

  1. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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    The Misty Mountains
    #51
    Just waiting for the proposed GOP law that limits immigration from our territories to the continental US... :oops:
     
  2. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

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    Jun 16, 2008
    #52
    And the moment that happens, DPRK will be bombing Guam.

    BL.
     
  3. daflake macrumors 6502a

    daflake

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    Apr 8, 2008
    #53
    While I don't think that we have done enough to help them, I certainly don't think their own government has done a dame thing either except yell that the mainland hasn't helped them. They are a USA territory and should get federal assistance but all of that should be governed and handled by the local government just as a state would handle federal assistance.
     
  4. USAFA2008 Suspended

    USAFA2008

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2017
    #54
    Exactly don't blame Trump when Puerto Rico did nothing to upgrade their infrastructure before the hurricane and now they want it rebuilt for them.
    When Puerto Rico helps themselves then we can help them. Their infrastructure was **** before the hurricane and they expect it to be fixed for them at no cost to PR.
    When Puerto Rico pays federal personal income tax then they can be compared to Texas and Florida.
    Which makes PR smart because they are not paying taxes yet they get the same benefits as taxpayers.
    There is a difference Arkansas pays federal personal income tax whereas Puerto Rico does not.
    While they don't pay federal personal income tax they still get the same benefits. It is in their best interest to not become a state.
    I would support that deal.
    They are not a state and shouldn't get the same benefits as a state.
    Well written. Puerto Rico wants the benefits of being a state without the taxation that comes with it.
    Puerto Rico is corrupt and that probably explains a lot of it.
    Perhaps FEMA was low on resources after Texas and Florida.
     
  5. VulchR macrumors 68020

    VulchR

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    Scotland
    #55
    Just curious - are you a US citizen? If so, stop using 'they' and start using 'we'. The people of PR are US citizens.
     
  6. JayMysterio macrumors 6502

    JayMysterio

    Joined:
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    Rock Ridge
    #56
    Perhaps you could research, source, & quote that without a presumption. It's easy just to quote others, ignore posted facts, just to make a great big thumb up post and zero to the discussion.

    Statehood is not relevant to the discussion. US citizenry is.
    --- Post Merged, Jan 2, 2018 ---
    I was wondering if anyone else would see the apparent silliness of someone living in another country telling others to stop supporting citizens of their own country.
     
  7. Rhonindk macrumors 68030

    Rhonindk

    #57
    Your asking Trump, because of a hurricane, to make up for all the years of graft and willful infrastructure neglect that PR has been executing. Having visited there often, having lots of friends there, having lots of business associates there, and they all agree; this is PR's fault and it has come home to roost with a vengeance.
    They should have become a state a while back. That would have reduced the mess they implemented upon themselves.
    --- Post Merged, Jan 2, 2018 ---
    Many do not realize the amount of medical items; RX, devices, OTC, etc... that are manufactured in PR.
    It has been a tax benefit for the Mfr.
    --- Post Merged, Jan 2, 2018 ---
    Viva ;)
     
  8. GermanSuplex macrumors 6502a

    GermanSuplex

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2009
    #58
    Race to the bottom argument. We can argue what went wrong here and what we can do to prevent it from happening again, but sometimes we need to act now, and discuss later.

    We used to say it would take another terrorist attack to join the country. I don’t think that was a good thing then, and now it looks like even that may not be true.
     
  9. Rhonindk macrumors 68030

    Rhonindk

    #59
    A manufacturing facility I support down there will be on generators till Feb-Mar or longer. Mind you, this a generator system that was never designed for long term.
    Folks tend to not realize the infrastructure you need for a supply chain, especially emergency supply chain, to an island like PR. It is going to take them awhile to get back to "normal".
     
  10. USAFA2008 Suspended

    USAFA2008

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2017
    #60
    Since the hurricanes that struck Texas and Florida happened before the one that struck Puerto Rico and did massive amounts of damage it is reasonable to assume that FEMA was low on resources after those 2 hurricanes. I never saw anything posted but if it is then post a source and back up what you claim assuming you can produce evidence.
    Also statehood is relevant to this discussion since Puerto Rico pays nothing in federal taxes but expects us to rebuild their infrastructure that was **** before the hurricane hit. Puerto Rico is negligent because they let their infrastructure go to **** years ago.
    I am still waiting on that source I asked for since you believe that FEMA wasn't low on resources.
    I agree with you but Puerto Rico doesn't want to be a state because then they will have to pay federal taxes instead of being able to get the same benefits without paying taxes.
     
  11. Rhonindk macrumors 68030

    Rhonindk

    #61
    Go down and take a good long look at the local political infrastructure. A loy of the "money" doesn't end up where iit should. That is all local graft.
    Older (ARTICLE) that hits the nail on the head.
    Sadly.
    --- Post Merged, Jan 2, 2018 ---
    PR People: No
    PR Government: Yes

    Incompetent
    Corrupt
    PR and most Local levels.
    --- Post Merged, Jan 2, 2018 ---
    @JayMysterio
    Having been down there a few times since the hurricanes, having been down there for business frequently, I can tell either you are just being persnickety for the heck of it or you have no real clue what PR is like.

    Hope it is just persnickety ... :cool:

    You can always camp out and listen to the coquis :D
    --- Post Merged, Jan 2, 2018 ---
    Want to stop it?
    Get rid of the local government from country, to city, to towns, and bring in some competent people who know what they are doing.
    This is not an overnight fix. PR wants the Feds to fix it so they can continue the corruption for another few decades.
     
  12. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    #62
    PR is a net drain on the US, there is no getting around that. It would be like paying your lunch off while you buy me a new car and then bitching about the cost of lunch I'm buying you. Get real.

    You still can't answer the original post you deflected from. I'll answer it for you, PR citizens pay NO FEDERAL INCOME TAX. They pay into programs that give them benefits and cost taxpayers money like SSN and Medicare.
     
  13. USAFA2008 Suspended

    USAFA2008

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2017
    #63
    As you said Puerto Rico is a drain on the US so we should either force them to pay federal income tax or get rid of them.
     
  14. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    UK
    #64
    If they were a state they'd pay income taxes.
     
  15. USAFA2008 Suspended

    USAFA2008

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2017
    #65
    In theory if they earned enough they would. We should really redo federal income tax before we let Puerto Rico become a state because they will keep draining the money.
     
  16. Gutwrench macrumors 68000

    Gutwrench

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2011
    #66
    Did you notice that 2017 was the safest year in commercial aviation history? In 2017 Chicago had a 16% decline in murders over 2016.

    Since Trump is responsible for everything, you must be giving him credit for these positive trends, right? :)
     
  17. GermanSuplex macrumors 6502a

    GermanSuplex

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2009
    #67
    We knew this before the hurricanes, debating policy can wait. We should just ration all help across the country with who pays the most taxes and where. There used to be a time where we’d help people, then fix the issue that caused the problem.

    Trump’s America though, wouldn’t want to be helping out those brown folks, goes against what he ran on.
     
  18. bradl, Jan 2, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2018

    bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    #68
    You would be quite incorrect here, as you are being too general.

    From Wiki:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_in_Puerto_Rico

    1. In general, United States citizens AND resident aliens who are bona fide residents of Puerto Rico during the entire tax year, which for most individuals is January 1 to December 31, are only required to file a U.S. federal income tax return if they have income sources outside of Puerto Rico or if they are employees of the U.S. government.

      Bona fide residents of Puerto Rico generally do not report income received from sources within Puerto Rico on their U.S. income tax return.

      However, they should report all income received from sources outside Puerto Rico on their U.S. income tax return.

      Residents of Puerto Rico who are employed by the government of the United States or who are members of the armed forces of the United States also should report all income received for their services to the government of the United States on their U. S. income tax return.
    2. United States citizens or resident aliens who are not bona fide residents of Puerto Rico during the entire tax year are required to report all income from whatever source derived on their U.S. income tax return. However, a U.S. citizen who changes residence from Puerto Rico to the United States and who was a bona fide resident of Puerto Rico at least two years before changing residence can exclude from U.S. taxable income the Puerto Rican source income received while residing in Puerto Rico during the taxable year of such change of residence. [15]
    In short, ALL RESIDENTS OF PUERTO RICO are required to file a federal income tax return, meaning, THEY PAY FEDERAL INCOME TAX. They are only required to report certain things on their tax return. If they are not required to report those certain things, they do not have to. That does not mitigate the fact that they STILL HAVE TO FILE A US TAX RETURN.

    You got caught up in your generalizations of what you are reading, and are not seeing the fact that while they are not required to report certain things on a tax return and pay federal income tax, they are STILL REQUIRED to file a US Tax Return and pay FEDERAL INCOME TAX.

    Again, you're wrong; Puerto Ricans do pay US Federal Income Tax.

    BL.
     
  19. alex2792 macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2009
    #69
    Would be Russia be interested in purchasing PR? They gave us a pretty good deal on Alaska back in the day.
     
  20. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    #70
    Why would they be interested? They already purchased the White House. Plus, they got the White House for cheaper than they sold us Alaska. ;)

    BL.
     
  21. JayMysterio macrumors 6502

    JayMysterio

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Rock Ridge
    #71
    The part where I mentioned how you ignore any posts that you don't care for? I did answer your question, despite it being a deflection and your avoidance of answering others...

    Pssst... It's in the spoiler part, where the title says "Does Puerto Rico pay Federal Income tax? Yes & No."

    I think you're misunderstanding how this debate & discussion thing works here. If YOU make a statement and someone asks for proofing and/or sourcing, it isn't incumbent on others to prove your statement right. Otherwise people can say anything they want to pull out of their rear end, just because it feels good. If you read statements I made earlier I do provide sourcing so anyone can refute them. I don't go with "I never saw anything". If you make a statement and can't back it up, it's pulling something out of your end and is crap. So if FEMA did claim it couldn't help Puerto Rico because it was low on resources due to Florida & Texas as you said, it shouldn't be hard to find.

    You can make up all the reasons for YOU think why Puerto Rico doesn't want statehood, despite as others posted they actually did vote for it, but forgive me for not taking your word for it. At least not until YOU can back it up.

    Actually I used to work for a ink manufacturing company and our plant would 'elect' one person to go and help a local affiliate. Being 'low man on the totem pole' at the time, I won the election a few times. Granted this was before the hurricanes. But my time there I never mistook it from some African nation being run by a completely corrupt government. Yes the government has had it's issues, but it's also hasn't been helped by Congress or Wall Street.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...ebt-crisis-bankruptcy-donald-trump/731091001/

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/busi...b37ee8eaa61_story.html?utm_term=.950fb3e68e07

    https://www.cnbc.com/2017/09/26/heres-how-an-obscure-tax-change-sank-puerto-ricos-economy.html

    There's more but we've already covered this in other threads.

    Bottomline is that this has turned into victim blaming as a reason to rationalize the administration's slack response. Just because the government has it's problems you DON'T punish it's people. Especially if those people are US citizens. Puerto Rico suffered a disaster and it's this country's job to help. Unless I've missed of course where the US has helped out foreign nations in their time of need, after we saw their financials first.

    Puerto Rico wants first the help to get back to a semblance of stability. The same anyone asks.

    Afterward it's asking for money to fix it's crumbling infrastructure, that's a separate discussion Puerto Rico has with Congress. Right now, it has lingering current needs that need to be addressed. Don't confuse or tie the two together. That becomes cruel, partisan, and petty.

    Which sadly, sounds about right now for the US these days it seems.

    If I do sound 'persnickety', it's because I can't believe people are treating aid to US citizens this way.
     
  22. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #72
    By your logic I'm paying federal income tax as well because all US citizens have to file taxes with the federal government. You guys are ridiculous.
     
  23. Rhonindk macrumors 68030

    Rhonindk

    #73
    I still work for companies there and have been supporting them for the last decade. If you are looking at PR in the view of an African nation ... wow. Seriously off base. What you don’t realize is that any infrastructure rebuild (monies) would pass through PR Government hands and some would be redirected. Any rebuild would allow the current corruption to continue unchecked ignoring the infrastructure upkeep. This is the negative impact on the people.
    Apparently you don’t get the true issue. Want to help PR? Get the government replaced with something even moderately competent. This includes some of the local politicos also (like San Juan for example). Say and play what you want. The factual truth is a cesspool at best. PR needs help. Just having us replace the infrastructure and pour money into the country isn’t it. That perpetuates the problems.
     
  24. JayMysterio, Jan 2, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2018

    JayMysterio macrumors 6502

    JayMysterio

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    #74
    No. You're seeing & taking what I said off base intentionally. Your presentation of the Puerto Rican government was this graft filled cesspool that is willingly exploiting it's populace. That's the exaggerated example I used.

    You don't get the true issue. What you're talking about is something that has to be fixed across YEARS. Which means absolutely noting for those suffering NOW. Right NOW isn't about replacing the infrastructure, it's about making it usable for people to survive, get back to work, contribute to an already stalled economy, ...and continue living. That's the false argument/deflection those of you are making. The discussion has been about the crap response & the suffering resulting from it.

    No one's argued about Puerto Rico's issues. It's blaming that their issues are solely on them when they aren't the only ones to blame, just to justify not providing proper aid to US citizens, ...is crap.

    Carrying on about fixing a long term problem now, instead of taking care of short term problems now, doesn't do Puerto Rico any good.
     
  25. bradl macrumors 68040

    bradl

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    #75
    Straw man.

    You assume that since they are not require to report certain income to the federal government, they are not paying all income taxes to the federal government. That is an incorrect assumption. If they make money and the source of that money is outside Puerto Rico, they are paying income taxes to the US Government. You blatantly tried to paint a broad brush over who pays what in Puerto Rico, without even checking the qualifications of who has to pay what.

    • You never checked on the residential requirements.
    • You never checked on the source of the income.
    • You never checked on if the resident is required to file a US income tax return (hint: US Citizens and residents of Puerto Rico ARE REQUIRED to file a US Federal Income Tax return.)
    • You never checked on the employer of the resident. If the employer is the US Government, they are required to file a US Federal income tax return.

    If they are US Citizens or resident aliens who are not bona fide residents of Puerto Rico, they are required to file a US Federal Income Tax return, regardless of the source of that income.

    If they are required to do so, they are paying US Federal Income Tax. But hey, don't blame us or call us ridiculous for the lack of oversight on your part. It is that same oversight that has PR in the situation they are in with Maria, because your incorrect assumptions are exactly that; partisan and incorrect.

    BL.
     

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