Ramifications of the MBP's very high temps (or, a means to this topics end)

LurkinTuff

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 1, 2011
17
0
Ojai
Hi,

I own a 2011 MBP (2.2 quad-core) which, of course, gets really hot. I also have about 2.5 years of applecare coverage left.

We all know the machines get very hot, with the CPU consistently reaching 95% of its rated temperature. We also know that Apple could apply the TIM in a more effective way.

My concern is this: If my "logic board" is going to fail, I hope it does so within the next 2.5 years.

I'd like to reapply the TIM, but I dont want to void my applecare. Ive read of several people reapplying the TIM without any geniuses noticing. So Im tempted to do the same. Im confident in my ability to not mess anything up in the process, but the chance of an apple tech noticing if/when I have to bring my machine in for service makes me very hesitant.

So, what are your thoughts on the longevity of the 2011 MBP's that are routinely reaching 96* celsius? I know this is highly dependent on individual chip, as well as many other factors, but in general, what are the chances of it lasting 3 years, 5 years, 1 year, etc...

Ive done a lot of searching, but I have seen nothing that addresses this issue in these regard. I simply want to know whether its likely for us to see an abundance of 2011 MBP logic boards failing in two or three years, or not.

Thanks
 

dolphindolphin

macrumors regular
May 29, 2008
219
4
New York
Unless it's shutting down it's not an issue. 99% of the heat complaints on this forum are not actually problems, just perceived problems.
Agreed. My MBP has always ran hot; I just got used to it. If your logic board gives out because of high temperatures, it will happen well within the first three years, so there is nothing to worry about!
 

GGJstudios

macrumors Westmere
May 16, 2008
44,427
786
I own a 2011 MBP (2.2 quad-core) which, of course, gets really hot.
Your Mac is not overheating. The Intel processors used in Macs are designed to automatically shut down to prevent damage if they truly overheat (around 100C/212F - 105C/221F, depending on your processor). iStat Pro will give you accurate readings of your temps, among other things.

Unless there is a rare defect in your Mac, your temps are well within the normal operating range, considering the workload you're putting on it. Websites with Flash content, games and other multimedia apps will put higher demand on the CPU/GPU, generating more heat. This is normal. If you're constantly putting high demands on your system, such as gaming or other multimedia tasks, expect temps to rise and fans to spin up accordingly. It's just your Mac doing its job to maintain temps within the normal range.

Your fans are always on when your Mac is on, spinning at a minimum of 2000 rpm (for MBPs) or 1800 rpm (for MBAs, MBs and minis). They will spin faster as needed to keep temps at a safe level. If they're spinning up without increased heat, try resetting the SMC. PRAM/NVRAM has nothing to do with these issues, so resetting it will not help. Also, make sure you don't block the vents, which are located at the rear, near the hinge.

Learn about the fans in your Mac
Apple Portables: Operating temperature

Launch Activity Monitor and change "My Processes" at the top to "All Processes". Then look to see what apps may be placing high demands on your CPU/GPU.

There is not an overheating problem with Mac portables. There is only a perceived overheating problem. That's partly due to the fact that the aluminum casing transfers heat better than some other notebook materials, so they may feel hotter to the touch than notebooks made of other materials. It may even become hot enough to be uncomfortable to rest on your lap. This, too, is normal. Because a user is unfamiliar with the heat normally generated by a Mac portable doesn't mean there's a problem with the Mac. Only on rare occasions is there a defect that causes true overheating.

You should also know that there are dozens, if not hundreds of existing threads on this topic, easily found by a simple search of the forum. You'll learn more by reading a few of those than you will by starting a new thread and waiting for people to post the same responses they've posted many times before.
 

vitzr

macrumors 68030
Jul 28, 2011
2,766
3
California
Heat is the enemy of any electronic product. Apple wants to sell you a new one on a regular frequent basis. What better way than to let heat take it's toll.
 

Ant.honey

macrumors regular
Oct 14, 2008
190
1
New York City
Seriously? How many of these threads are there?

If your laptop is not shutting down all the time, you're fine. Sure, excessive heat is bad for your electronics. But as said a million times already: " The Intel processors used in Macs are designed to automatically shut down to prevent damage if they truly overheat." That's it. End if story.

What Apple laptop has NOT run hot? Are there still many, many Apple laptops older than 3 years in service? YUP.
 

shardey

macrumors 6502a
Jan 28, 2010
666
30
Colorado
People make threads about this because they care about their laptops. I do as well, but not in the sense like this. Heat is the biggest problem for electronics.

I too would like to reapply the thermal paste to cut down on my heat.
 

LurkinTuff

macrumors newbie
Original poster
May 1, 2011
17
0
Ojai
To me, this is more an issue of money.

I do not plan on buying a new computer in the next 5 years.

If my logic board gives out after 2.5 years, Ill have to.
 

RedReplicant

macrumors 6502a
Mar 31, 2010
693
5
Your Mac is not overheating.
I appreciate where you are coming from but then why do people using throttle stopping programs have such significant gains? The MBPs throttle heavily when the cpu and gpu are both loaded. There is a problem with the MBP and other laptops being unable to handle the amount of heat put off by current CPUs and videocards.
 

GGJstudios

macrumors Westmere
May 16, 2008
44,427
786
I appreciate where you are coming from but then why do people using throttle stopping programs have such significant gains? The MBPs throttle heavily when the cpu and gpu are both loaded. There is a problem with the MBP and other laptops being unable to handle the amount of heat put off by current CPUs and videocards.
No, there isn't a problem. Apple notebooks do handle such temps while continuing to operate quite well. People use such apps because they perceive there's a problem. They think if CPU/GPU temps rise into the 90C+ range during heavy workloads such as gaming that there's a problem. There isn't. Unless the processor is shutting down, it's not overheating, even if it's 96C. The fact that Macs operate normally at temps that may be higher than a user expects does not mean that those temps are problematic.
 

Heebeejeebies

macrumors regular
Nov 9, 2011
242
10
New Jersey
I had similar concerns, but after reading numerous threads where people were ridiculed for thinking their computers were going to die, I decided to take a look at my fans. I opened up my computer and found a coating of dust all over the insides. I took a vacuum with a hose and vacuumed around the back of the MBP where the vents are and directly on the fans, and got a lot of dust out of them. Since then I've noticed that my temperatures have never gotten high enough for the fans to have to spin at high RPMs, even when the MBP is running laborious programs for a long time.

While that may not answer your questions about logic boards, I do believe that regular maintenance may increase the longevity of your MBP's internal components.
 

matthewscott661

macrumors 6502
Jun 27, 2009
327
4
Chicago
My first gen MBP is still alive and heat has never been an issue other than comfort.

It spends about one week at the end of every semester the past three years rendering, 24 hours a day for 5-7 days at 100% CPU usage, and it's done fine every time.
 

cirus

macrumors 6502a
Mar 15, 2011
582
0
I'm sorry, heat will shorten the life of almost any device.

Manufacturer specifications are to be taken with a grain of salt. Many times you buy something labeled "premium" and it breaks as soon as you get home. Many manufacturers make invalid claims.

To say nothing is wrong with temperatures of 90 degrees Celsius is wrong. Sure the chip can withstand temperatures of up to 105 degrees without breaking (shuts off automatically) but can the chip withstand sustained temperatures near that? Heat kills almost everything inside a computer and a computer that runs 10 degrees warmer than another computer will have a statistically greater chance of breaking.

Take a car for example. The speedometer says it can run at a maximum of 220 km/h at 7,000 rpm but put the car on blocks and run it at 170 km/h (5000rpm) and see what it does to the engine. The car will not last as long, neither will an overheated computer.
 

RedReplicant

macrumors 6502a
Mar 31, 2010
693
5
No, there isn't a problem. Apple notebooks do handle such temps while continuing to operate quite well. People use such apps because they perceive there's a problem. They think if CPU/GPU temps rise into the 90C+ range during heavy workloads such as gaming that there's a problem. There isn't. Unless the processor is shutting down, it's not overheating, even if it's 96C. The fact that Macs operate normally at temps that may be higher than a user expects does not mean that those temps are problematic.
I think you are either confused or ignorant of the benchmarks that have been done to prove that these machines throttle.
 

GuitarG20

macrumors 65816
Jun 3, 2011
1,020
1
okay, let's say that your CPU's theoretical max temp is 105C, which is around correct. 95% of that is 99.75C. My MBP has never gotten hotter than 88C, even when running handbrake (which runs all cores and all virtual cores basically at 100%.) So is your MBP actually getting that hot, or are you just saying that?
 

RedReplicant

macrumors 6502a
Mar 31, 2010
693
5
okay, let's say that your CPU's theoretical max temp is 105C, which is around correct. 95% of that is 99.75C. My MBP has never gotten hotter than 88C, even when running handbrake (which runs all cores and all virtual cores basically at 100%.) So is your MBP actually getting that hot, or are you just saying that?
Thermal shutdown is actually at 130c, and yes, I have seen my CPU at 99c before.

How about this: Go start a game up and watch your CPU speed, play for a little bit until it starts lagging and go look at your CPU speed. It will probably have dropped to 800mhz.
 
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GuitarG20

macrumors 65816
Jun 3, 2011
1,020
1
Thermal shutdown is actually at 130c, and yes, I have seen my CPU at 99c before.

How about this: Go start a game up and watch your CPU speed, play for a little bit until it starts lagging and go look at your CPU speed. It will probably have dropped to 800mhz.
i play sc2 on high all the time, and it never lags.

what program can you use to actively check your cpu throttle?
 

Ant.honey

macrumors regular
Oct 14, 2008
190
1
New York City
I'm sorry, heat will shorten the life of almost any device.

Manufacturer specifications are to be taken with a grain of salt. Many times you buy something labeled "premium" and it breaks as soon as you get home. Many manufacturers make invalid claims.

To say nothing is wrong with temperatures of 90 degrees Celsius is wrong. Sure the chip can withstand temperatures of up to 105 degrees without breaking (shuts off automatically) but can the chip withstand sustained temperatures near that? Heat kills almost everything inside a computer and a computer that runs 10 degrees warmer than another computer will have a statistically greater chance of breaking.

Take a car for example. The speedometer says it can run at a maximum of 220 km/h at 7,000 rpm but put the car on blocks and run it at 170 km/h (5000rpm) and see what it does to the engine. The car will not last as long, neither will an overheated computer.
Actually, when it comes to Apple products they are quite conservative with their claims. Same goes for Intel. Any high performance machine or machine run at it's maximum for long periods will last less long than one that is babied, what is your point? You want a Ferrari that goes 180 all the time, but you don't want it to ever break? Sorry. Stop looking at the temperature gauges all the time.

iStat Pro has made hypochondriacs of you all.
 

GuitarG20

macrumors 65816
Jun 3, 2011
1,020
1
Take a car for example. The speedometer says it can run at a maximum of 220 km/h at 7,000 rpm but put the car on blocks and run it at 170 km/h (5000rpm) and see what it does to the engine. The car will not last as long, neither will an overheated computer.
since i am a mechanical engineering student, i must contradict this. I can run my car at 5000 RPM for about 5 hours (i've done it) without doing any damage to the engine. the factor for engine damage depends on the engine that the car has, what kind of oil is in it, and about 50 other factors.
 
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wgr73

macrumors 6502a
Oct 31, 2005
709
31
New Mexico
since i am a mechanical engineering student, i must contradict this. I can run my car at 5000 RPM for about 5 hours (i've done it) without doing any damage to the engine. the factor for engine damage depends on the engine that the car has, what kind of oil is in it, and about 50 other factors.
I agree with Guitar. Just the simple fact that there is 0 airflow to your radiator if you put the car on blocks. That's equivalent to throttling up your mac without a fan, only ambient air...and in that case your right, it wouldn't last long.
 

GuitarG20

macrumors 65816
Jun 3, 2011
1,020
1
I agree with Guitar. Just the simple fact that there is 0 airflow to your radiator if you put the car on blocks. That's equivalent to throttling up your mac without a fan, only ambient air...and in that case your right, it wouldn't last long.
right, but your forgot about the radiator fans (which probably wouldn't work very well if you had your engine running at 5k, but I was driving so i had plenty of airflow)
 

newbiemacguy128

macrumors regular
Jul 8, 2009
162
0
Thermal shutdown is actually at 130c, and yes, I have seen my CPU at 99c before.

How about this: Go start a game up and watch your CPU speed, play for a little bit until it starts lagging and go look at your CPU speed. It will probably have dropped to 800mhz.
I have this problem on my 2010 15in MBP. My computer gets so hot Heroes of Newerth starts to slow down (not a graphically stressful game). Took it to the genius bar and they took me for an idiot and refused to repair it. Anyways, still experiencing heat related problems till this day...and Its definitely not iStat making me paranoid, I'm taking performance hits every day.
 
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