Religious "Freedom" — Bon Appétit, America

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by citizenzen, Oct 6, 2017.

  1. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #1
  2. GermanSuplex macrumors 6502a

    GermanSuplex

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    All men are created equal
    Freedom of speech
    Freedom of religion

    It has always meant “all white Christian men are created equal and have freedom of speech”.

    These guys aren’t even hiding their agenda. At least past admins would call it lemonade while they pissed on you.
     
  3. fitshaced macrumors 68000

    fitshaced

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    Pretend freedom. Freedom for those who can’t live morally without religious rules.
     
  4. jerwin, Oct 6, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 12, 2017

    jerwin macrumors 68020

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    Corporate religious freedom should be an entertaining **** show
     
  5. DearthnVader macrumors 6502a

    DearthnVader

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    A lot to read, but I got the gist of it, Religious people should be able to deny service to people for religious reasons.

    So a Jewish baker can refuse to make a bacon cake, a Christian baker can refuse to make a cake for a gay wedding or event, the owner of a bar can refuse admittance to anyone that isn't Islamic.

    This is America people, if your money is green, then you get service.
     
  6. citizenzen, Oct 6, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2017

    citizenzen thread starter macrumors 65816

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    Ideally, business is as blind as justice. But what we’re seeing is that some businesspeople won’t sacrifice their values for the money. Despite having the green, some people will be denied service.

    What I’m afraid of is seeing the nation pockmarked with “we don’t serve ‘X’, we don’t serve ‘Y’ signs. That feels like Jim Crow taken to a whole new level. It feels like a giant step backward to my squishy, progressive mind.

    But this is America. And we are deplorable. So what else should I expect?
     
  7. DearthnVader macrumors 6502a

    DearthnVader

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    I think the Supreme Court understands what type of quagmire this would be.
     
  8. HEK, Oct 7, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2017

    HEK macrumors 68040

    HEK

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    And non religious people should deny service to religious people.
    Religious freedom includes freedom from religion.

    Could be time to deny service to anyone with a Jeff Session’s accent. If we gonna go divisive partisan religious warfare, might as well go whole hog nuts.

    Here is a solution. Make it mandatory for everyone 12 and up to carry a firearm at all times. I take a three month vacation to Europe and when I come back, traffic will be way down, Congress will have three quarter vacant seats, immigration will no longer be a problem legal or illegal as no one will want to come here. Plenty of vacant housing. No crowds at national parks. All kinds of benefits. Might have to turn Trump golf courses into cemeteries though.
     
  9. PracticalMac macrumors 68030

    PracticalMac

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    Pastafarianism, especially Pastafarianism!!

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Spaghetti_Monster
     
  10. duffman9000 macrumors 68000

    duffman9000

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    #10
    I thought it meant “all white, Christian, land owning men, are created equal and have freedom of speech”.
     
  11. obeygiant macrumors 68040

    obeygiant

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    I don't get the connection between religious freedom and taking birth control away. Freedom for companies to have religious freedom?

    this issue and keeping transgender people from serving should have been left untouched.
     
  12. HEK macrumors 68040

    HEK

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    #12
    You reading between the lines again. Stop looking at intent.
     
  13. yaxomoxay macrumors 68040

    yaxomoxay

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    To be honest with you - and I say this a religious, devout Catholic - I agree with you. Now, I truly can’t say about all the legal connections etc, but as I don’t believe that an individual is responsible of corporate actions (that’s why I never support the anti-Starbucks/anti-Walmart/anti-ChickFilA boycotts), I also don’t think that a company should have anything to do with the actions of the individual outside of work. Now, I can accept giving the choice to refuse the coverage. The employee is the one that signs, not the company. The company merely offers a pre-packaged product from another company, nothing else. I don’t think that the CEO is even remotely responsible of someone who seeks abortion options. This is when the concept of “ethics in business” goes too far (both ways). If the CEO’s really want to do something they can always give a $5000 bonus to every mom who has a child, as a token of goodwill, especially considering that most abortions happen not because the mom is a bloodthirsty murder (as sadly many of my Catholic friends believe) but due to economical factors that cause fear in the pregnant woman.
     
  14. LordVic macrumors 603

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    Any corporation that openly declares themselves a christian organization is the ones that I actively boycott.
    --- Post Merged, Oct 7, 2017 ---
    This is stupid and aNO not what this means and you should feel bad for the bad logic.

    THis means that if I, as a baker, make Cake A. I make cake A and sell it 100 times. But then a gay person comes into my store, i say no. You can't have cake A, you're gay. Sessions memo says now that it's ok to do that.

    your above example is asking for people to make things that wouldn't otherwise be on "the menu". A jewish baker will have never ever created bacon cake. It's not on the menu. he's not refusing something because of the customers religion or background, he's not making something because it's NOT ON HIS MENU.

    would you go into McDonalds and ask for filet mignon? no, because it's not on the menu.

    what Jeff Sessions is essentially doing is telling any company they are free to discriminate against their clients. that is a dangerous position to take as once you make discrimination legal, there will almost always be a power base that abuses it.
     
  15. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #15
    There was a section in there that said all religions must be treated equally.
     
  16. MacNut macrumors Core

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    So wouldn’t that cancel out the others. The key word is equal.
     
  17. edk99 macrumors 6502a

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    I will happily take my money elsewhere if not welcome at a business.
     
  18. HEK, Oct 7, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2017

    HEK macrumors 68040

    HEK

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    How about non religions. You know there are a lot of us that don’t subscribe to any brand of that nonsense. And before you get on high horse. I really don’t care if others do or not. Last time I checked, I was free to “believe” that religion is nonsense. Bunch of holier than though tribe leaders telling illiterate goat herders not to fornicate with their goats. Yeah treat em equally, keep em in their places of worship and home. Not out in public.

    Sessions, a rebranded racist hypocrit with dillusions of grandeur. I’m tired of being politically correct. These demegods in their own minds, need to be removed.

    I’m so gonna rip into the next ass hat that knocks on my door to convert me.

    And don’t even get me started on those Indian call center clowns calling me to tell me they want to help with my computer that’s been sending messages to them how it’s infected with virus. Been telling them all kinds of racist stuff and that Trump gonna bomb em back into Stone Age. Love it when they start swearing at me. You called me buddy, don’t like it, don’t call me.

    Thanks, feel better now. I needed to vent.
     
  19. gkarris macrumors 604

    gkarris

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    It goes for everybody. I've been a victim of not being served because I am not Muslim (was in a Muslim owned store).
     
  20. citizenzen thread starter macrumors 65816

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    I agree, the logic is so weak. The Jewish baker doesn't even keep bacon in stock. So can the hypothetical customer walk in and demand the baker to sell something he doesn't even carry?

    In what world does that make sense?

    Why stop with bacon? Can a customer walk into a Jewish bakery and demand they sell water skis? Can I walk into a Christian bakery and demand a test drive in a Mercedes Benz?

    It is a ridiculous hypothetical when one takes more than 10 seconds to think about it.
     
  21. Peace macrumors Core

    Peace

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    #21
    I think Sessions forgot about the separation of church and state.
     
  22. fitshaced macrumors 68000

    fitshaced

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    Would the jewish bakery accept the request to make a bacon cake for a fellow jew?

    This whole thing is beyond ridiculous anyway. I would wager that a small percentage of people who are religious do not actually follow their religion ..er religiously. This is purely for the self entitled ignorant dinosaurs in politics.
     
  23. villicodelirant Suspended

    villicodelirant

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    Hey, at least you're aware.
     
  24. LordVic macrumors 603

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    no. Nor would it be a question of discrimination. again. The Jewish baker, if it's a kosher shop, would not offer anyone, no matter what bacon. therefore it's not discrimination.

    and if you went into a jewish bakery and asked for a bacon sandwich, it would be no different than walking in and asking for some lumber. it's not something the store sells, so it' can't be descrimination to refuse to make it.

    if we want to apply this to the old "Christian Bakery not serving gays". if the Gay couple asked the bake shop for a motorcycle for their wedding, and the store refused because again, the motorcycle isn't on the menu, than that's not discrimination.

    it only becomes discrimination when you actively refuse to serve one of your products that you do make to someone based on who they are.
     
  25. edk99 macrumors 6502a

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    Ah it has to be on the menu. So all the Christian baker needs to do is label all his cakes on the menu as heterosexual cakes. Therefore when a homosexual walks in there will be no homosexual cakes on the menu that the baker can make.

    Isn’t this the same thing as a men’s barber shop only having men’s haircuts on the menu?
     

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