Revolution graphics on par with 360???

d_saum

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jun 14, 2005
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0
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I dont know if any of you have seen this before (Im sure someone in here has), but I just came across this site and apparently the Rev could have some amazing graphics:::

Nintendo has filed patents for a technology called displacement mapping, which is a technique that is used to render detailed surfaces while successfully simultaneously keeping polygon count low.

Nintendo has filed two patents regarding the technology. One of them refers to a specialized hardware for vector operations, optimising the graphics hardware so that the displacement mapping is computed efficiently. The other one reduces the strain put on the CPU that is caused by rendering a 3d world in 2d.

The technology is not new but Nintendo is patenting its particular usage in Nintendo projects.

It is very likely that the technology be used in Nintendo upcoming game console, the Nintendo revolution.

It is believed that, with the power of displacement mapping Nintendo can achieve better graphics than the XBox 360 with much less power.
 

TheMonarch

macrumors 65816
May 6, 2005
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Bay Area
Not to sound negative [Since this is good news], but how can Nintendo get a patent on technology that already exists? :confused:

I've played a bit with displacement mapping before myself... Seems standard on pretty much any 3D App...
 

Josh396

macrumors 65816
Oct 16, 2004
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greatdevourer said:
281 polygons vs 5000 polygons = pwnd
While that may be true, I remember the NFL 2k series had an insane amount of polygons per player and their graphics weren't even that much better than anything else. I'm not saying that a higher polygon count isn't better because it is, I'm just saying I'm not sure if it's everything.
 

GFLPraxis

macrumors 604
Mar 17, 2004
7,091
404
I'm too tired to post in detail tonight. I ripped this to shreds on another forum already. It's just some idiot that reads a patent, doesn't understand the tech talk, misunderstands it and thinks its something else, makes a forum post proclaiming its some secret Nintendo is keeping, and then rumor sites and blogs like that one pick it up.
 

TheMonarch

macrumors 65816
May 6, 2005
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Josh396 said:
...I'm not saying that a higher polygon count isn't better because it is, I'm just saying I'm not sure if it's everything.

They're not ;)
...Rule of thumb "A good texture speaks a thousand polygons".

Translation: A good texture can save a crappy mesh, but a good mesh can't save those crappy textures.
 

greatdevourer

macrumors 68000
Aug 5, 2005
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Josh396 said:
While that may be true, I remember the NFL 2k series had an insane amount of polygons per player and their graphics weren't even that much better than anything else. I'm not saying that a higher polygon count isn't better because it is, I'm just saying I'm not sure if it's everything.
Sorry, looking back it would have made more sense had I said it rather than typed. I meant 281 with equal graphics as 5000 = Ninty pwning M$.
 

takao

macrumors 68040
Dec 25, 2003
3,825
432
Dornbirn (Austria)
because i'm in a hurry:

_old_ tech -> nintendo patent new perhaps more efficent way to implent it -> not sure if it's getting used at all in Revolution -> still not as powerfull as xbox360/ps3

at least i would be rather surprised

edit: positivly surprised ;)
after all i'm pretty sure Nintendo will pull off quite a few improvements with the GPU.. especially i nterms of compressions or optimisations
 

greatdevourer

macrumors 68000
Aug 5, 2005
1,996
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takao said:
because i'm in a hurry:

_old_ tech -> nintendo patent new perhaps more efficent way to implent it -> not sure if it's getting used at all in Revolution -> still not as powerfull as xbox360/ps3

at least i would be rather surprised

edit: positivly surprised ;)
after all i'm pretty sure Nintendo will pull off quite a few improvements with the GPU.. especially i nterms of compressions or optimisations
Who said it isn't as good as the 360? They just proved that it does better in a minute fraction of the power
 

Mavimao

macrumors 6502a
Feb 16, 2005
854
5
Lyon, France
greatdevourer said:
Who said it isn't as good as the 360? They just proved that it does better in a minute fraction of the power
Well, Nintendo said themselves the processing power will not be as powerful as the 360. In terms of sheer numbers, the Revolution will be pounced upon; however if this article is a look into what we should expect from Nintendo, then we can see that they are going the economical route. Less gigaflops, less RAM, but awesome implimentation of state of the art 3D technology.

I'm all for it!
 

buryyourbrideau

macrumors 65816
Mar 1, 2005
1,212
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Chicago
Everyone should just chill out until E3.

Then we will all see the real deal, no need for anyone to fanboy it up or whatnot.

There is going to be hardcore speculation on everything on PS3 and Revolution.

Most will be purely speculation.
 

0098386

Suspended
Jan 18, 2005
21,552
2,886
quick reply (tea's ready)... in SD mode they are probably identical. A developer said that in SD mode all the next gen consoles look the same. doesn't surprise me. anyone remember Nintendo's 'saturation point' speech?
 

Mavimao

macrumors 6502a
Feb 16, 2005
854
5
Lyon, France
raggedjimmi said:
quick reply (tea's ready)... in SD mode they are probably identical. A developer said that in SD mode all the next gen consoles look the same. doesn't surprise me. anyone remember Nintendo's 'saturation point' speech?
Yeah, that is Nintendo's whole philosophy on their new Revolution console. However, what's being said is that the Revolution will not look as detailed on an HD monitor than a 360 or a PS3.

We will just have to see and wait.
 

srobert

macrumors 68020
Jan 7, 2002
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buryyourbrideau said:
no need for anyone to fanboy it up or whatnot.
I hate the word fanboy ^_^

By the way, nice XBox 360 avatar, XBox 360 Profile, XBox 360 sig, XBox 360 post history mr. pointing out fanboys. ;) Just kidding.

I myself went tri-consolexual and wouldn't go back.
 

0098386

Suspended
Jan 18, 2005
21,552
2,886
Mavimao said:
Yeah, that is Nintendo's whole philosophy on their new Revolution console. However, what's being said is that the Revolution will not look as detailed on an HD monitor than a 360 or a PS3.

We will just have to see and wait.
oh god no its impossible. the Rev max's out (as far as we know) at 480p. that alone will be very much welcomed for me. get myself the obligatory VGA cable and it can say hello to my 2005FPW monitor no probs. the other machines hit 1080p. or if you believe the Sony hyperbole; DUAL 1080p graphics at 60fps :rolleyes:

of course the other systems will look better in HD resolutions though.

or so we think... who knows what Nintendo are up too... we can all speculate on rumours and the mini amount of real info announced but until we actually know then speculation is all we have. I speculated the PSP would fail to sell one machine, but a market was invented full of people who don't mind playing games, but want to watch films on the go. nobody can say how the Rev will look, or what they really mean when they speak about amazing hidden features, who knows? perhaps them features alone will render no (at this time) HD-output feature as trivial.
 

greatdevourer

macrumors 68000
Aug 5, 2005
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raggedjimmi said:
oh god no its impossible. the Rev max's out (as far as we know) at 480p. that alone will be very much welcomed for me. get myself the obligatory VGA cable and it can say hello to my 2005FPW monitor no probs. the other machines hit 1080p. or if you believe the Sony hyperbole; DUAL 1080p graphics at 60fps :rolleyes:

of course the other systems will look better in HD resolutions though.

or so we think... who knows what Nintendo are up too...
Once again, they said it has monitor out, which implies that they're just waiting for a proper HDTV standard to happen. It will do 480p minimum, probably higher
 

Chaszmyr

macrumors 601
Aug 9, 2002
4,265
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What Nintendo is doing here is very smart. They know that Revolution will likely have the same small marketshare as Gamecube, but if they have much higher profit margins than Microsoft (which they will, as they also did with Gamecube) they can stay afloat.
 

katchow

macrumors 6502
Feb 14, 2002
457
0
Dayton, Ohio
Chaszmyr said:
What Nintendo is doing here is very smart. They know that Revolution will likely have the same small marketshare as Gamecube, but if they have much higher profit margins than Microsoft (which they will, as they also did with Gamecube) they can stay afloat.
if i were a third party publisher, that strategy wouldn't exactly woo me to cross platforms.
 

greatdevourer

macrumors 68000
Aug 5, 2005
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Chaszmyr said:
What Nintendo is doing here is very smart. They know that Revolution will likely have the same small marketshare as Gamecube, but if they have much higher profit margins than Microsoft (which they will, as they also did with Gamecube) they can stay afloat.
Far as I remember, that "small market share" is the exact same "small market share" as M$ :rolleyes:
 

GFLPraxis

macrumors 604
Mar 17, 2004
7,091
404
ARGH! I hate these stupid conspiracy theorists that make up junk and get people to believe it, then blogs and unofficial news sites repost it like its real, causing a stir over nothing.




This whole rumor originated from a stupid blog.

These patents will not automatically make the Revolution more powerful.

The XBox 360 and PS3 are already using displacement mapping.



This is where it originated from.

http://nintendo-revolution.blogspot.com/


Actually read the stuff! They have no understanding of the patents. They think the cube-mapping patent is "pre-rendered images in real-time". Anyone remember that patent? It's talking about a panoramic image with depth added in, a more advanced version of the Zelda 64 Marketplace and stuff like that.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=138726


Nintendo is not the kind of company that is going to magically discover a ten-times-more-efficient way of rendering images than the entire-freaking-industry.

Sorry, sites publishing speculation as fact is one of my pet peeves, I'm not directing my frustration towards anyone on this board. I'm sorry if I appear rude, I just really, really hate blogs that misinform people.
 

LethalWolfe

macrumors G3
Jan 11, 2002
9,366
119
Los Angeles
greatdevourer said:
Once again, they said it has monitor out, which implies that they're just waiting for a proper HDTV standard to happen. It will do 480p minimum, probably higher
Proper HDTV standard? There are proper HDTV standards. Do you mean waiting until HDTVs have more consumer penetration?


Lethal
 

kuyu

macrumors 6502a
Sep 16, 2003
694
0
Louisville
Sounds cool, but I'm inclined to believe GFL that PS3 and 360 are using this tech already.

On a side note, how long until MS and Sony come out with a Rev clone controller? I'd say we might see a 360 version of this idea before the Rev launches stateside.