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Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by vega07, Oct 24, 2012.
From Greg Palast's report in The Nation:
You know, if edk99's so concerned about cover-ups, why isn't he shouting this from the rooftops?
For those that want to read the story instead of watch the video, here is the summary, and here is the lengthy version.
From the summary:
Romney was the one making decisions at Delphi now? Strange...
Seriously talking about electronics manufacturing needing to be US based on an Apple forum seems a bit dim.
Either dim or incredibly appropriate. There is no reason (cough cough GOP cough cough) we can't fix our tax codes, enforce trade regulations, improve education opportunities, encourage states to work together instead of competing against each other, and figure out a way to make owners see the value of paying their workers living wages instead of buying another 30 million dollar mansion.
That doesn't solve the problem as we live in a global society with a large gap between what we consider living wage vs what someone in china who is just happy to feed their family does.
Canada is much more unionized than America and its pretty sickening what some of these union employees are pulling down. The guys who pretend to clean the subways/buses between stops are making 28 dollars an hour + benefits and they wonder why people are trying to contract their jobs out.
People are trying to decouple supply and demand when it comes to wages and that doesn't work.
I see no reason why 28/hr is a bad thing. You might be able to contract it out, but the net savings are minimal, and what you end up with is a group of untrained minimum wage employees who don't care about their jobs, have no benefits, and are temporary employees at best. The remainder of the money goes to some corporate CEO and shareholders wallets. I'd rather pay the employees 28/hr so they can have a fighting chance at having a family, home, car, etc...
Its a bad thing when the government (ie. the taxpayer) is funding their business, I go to work on the subway and pay twice (once through taxes and another time through fares) for some employee to jerk off and pretend they are cleaning. The thing most people don't get is that 28 hour employee is still the untrained minimum wage employee who doesn't care about his job, he just gets paid more to do the same thing.
You are trying to make a dead end job into a livelihood. Someone shouldn't be content with cleaning buses their entire life, there are teenagers looking for their first job who can do that for cheaper (they might even have the energy to actually clean instead of stand around and talk).
You have to admit, this takes chutzpah:
With Romney, it is a real challenge to figure out if he actually believes this garbage, or, is lying when he says that he actually believes it.
In other Delphi news...
I'm glad the Republicans are so concerned about the 20,000 workers deprived of their retirement benefits under the deal. Hopefully they can get together in the lame duck session and work out how to restore those benefits.
Much more concerned with the government's involvement in forging this deal and why unions were given preference. Not that it is a surprise.
Not only were they given preference they were first in line before secured creditors. That is certainly not how bankruptcy works. The left is so worried about Romney making money off the bailout but are not concerned that the tax payers are going to be out 35-50 Billion on the deal.
Wow- you guys sure know how to deflect, don't you? What Romney did here is absolutely vile. More evidence that there is NOTHING this guy could do to lose your vote. How sad.
Are you worried about corruption? Or are you worried about unions being given a seat at the table with fund managers and creditors? You do realize that unions are there for precisely the purpose of representing the interests of their members, especially when it comes to protecting pension and health benefits that companies are contractually obligated to provide, but, might not be able to due to bankruptcy? Why would representatives of creditors and investors be given a voice but unions not given a voice?
You do realize that the union employees have contracts with the employer, and the pension and benefit agreements are binding? Not only that, if these are unfunded obligations, the monies held by the corporation are arguably held in trust for the benefit of the employees, and thus, the employees are in a higher position than unsecured, and even some secured, creditors.
Under a chapter 7 bankruptcy all of these employees would have said bye bye to their pensions. The government stepped in and so they should have made it an equitable settlement, not hand the unions the football.
There are much better corporations than Delphi that can provide electronics. The two decks that I have owned by them have both been pieces of ****.
Romney is a Fraud...
Sounds like bad management.
In the UK the trains have much worse staffing than the tube, guess which of them is private.
Far from it.
He's the real deal, and you better well realize it.
So, what you are saying is that you are pissed off that the workers got to keep the pensions they were contractually obligated to get, instead of having them taken away? Or are you pissed that union workers got their pensions but not non-union workers? But at the same time, you are NOT pissed that Romney made millions on the deal?
Romney making millions is a completely separate topic. That is what happens when you have government intervention in a publicly traded company. When businesses know they are too big to fail there is complete recklessness in the market.