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Safari 1.0 Rushed?

MacRumors

macrumors bot
Original poster
Apr 12, 2001
51,584
13,214
A MacUser.co.uk article on Web Developers and Safari notes a few ongoing issues with Apple's browser.

Of particular note is Safari's "over-ambitious caching" -- which may inadvertantly display pages with inconsistent results. One developer notes:

It's one thing to cache pages, but when it uses old versions of buttons and scripts it's anyone's guess what the results will be for users.

MacUser.co.uk also reveals that Apple may have rushed Safari to a 1.0 released after Microsoft's announcement that Internet Explorer would no longer be developed for the Macintosh:

Even Apple insiders have admitted privately that Safari was too buggy for it to have been given a finished release status
 

Jerry Spoon

macrumors 6502a
Jan 8, 2002
624
0
Historic St. Charles
I'll agree from a personal view that Safari 1.0 was rushed. I've had more trouble with this version than any of the beta versions I've used.
It's still a great browser, but I'm a little disappointed w/ apple for jumping the gun a bit.
 
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dricci

macrumors 6502a
Dec 15, 2001
537
0
It's a great browser, but it's just not ready to be a 1.0 release. I'd say it'd classify more as a 1.0 Public Beta.

It's pretty crashy and still doesn't load some obvious things correctly (like secure sites for many people, and the animated weather.com maps which have been reported by many since the first beta release) and the caching problems, etc just make it not ready.

Hopefully we'll see 1.1 soon!
 
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Goekeli

macrumors newbie
Jul 17, 2002
17
0
I have to agree. I still can't use it. Camino is my #1. Safari is also slow for me compared to camino. I really look forward to the fruit getting it together with this browser. The integration factor can only add to the MAC persons life. Thanks for the report!

Joe:)
 
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funkywhat2

macrumors 6502a
Jul 14, 2002
669
0
You're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't...

If Apple hadn't of released it, then not only would the current crop of users been let down (even if only slightly) but it would look as if they couldn't handle M$ dropping IE for the Mac. C|Net would've been all over it (or be all over it, if it still wouldn't of had been released) and bad press would've come to pass then instead of now. The last thing they needed was (more) bad press, with the G5 launch and all.
 
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avus

macrumors regular
Nov 4, 2002
196
0
Safari Version 1.0 is not trouble free for me either, but it is still my primary browser. Apple's criteria for being "buggy" is too stringent compared to, say, Microsoft, IMO.
 
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MrMacMan

macrumors 604
Jul 4, 2001
7,002
11
1 Block away from NYC.
I find it great, I don't know what everyone is humbugging about.

I find it wonderful, almost bug free, execpt for some site specific things.

I don't see any security problems, I don't need to update every 10 seconds, therefore it is better then the competition.
 
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punter

macrumors 6502
Feb 22, 2003
265
0
Australia
i know other final releases which contain many more bugs then safari, even when it was a beta.

it works fine for me.
 
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simX

macrumors 6502a
May 28, 2002
757
0
Bay Area, CA
Other than the annoying caching problem (which usually doesn't really make much of a difference unless you doing a lot of web design and updating frequently), Safari 1.0 seems to be pretty much bug-free for me. I don't think it was rushed that much -- it WAS in a 6 month public beta period, after all.

While there may be sites that don't work, that's to be expected in any browser, and it's up there with the Gecko engine.

Oh, and Safari is definitely faster than Camino, at least for me.
 
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Snowy_River

macrumors 68030
Jul 17, 2002
2,519
0
Corvallis, OR
I didn't use Safari much before the final release. I used Camino (formerly Chimera, a name which I liked much better...). When Safari 1.0 was released, I decided to try it, and have, for the most part, had little trouble with it. It seems no better or worse than Camino, on the whole. If anything, I've found that it doesn't crash quite as often as Camino, but then, Camino is still only at a 0.7 release. (Part of my chioce to switch to Safari as my main browser was the fact that Camino seemed to be languishing at 0.7 status. It's been almost five months with no significant report of improvement.... That, and the fact that there were some things about the interface on Camino that bugged me. In that sense I like Safari better, but I'd still like to be able to rearrange the order of the tabs...)
 
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Flowbee

macrumors 68030
Dec 27, 2002
2,944
0
Alameda, CA
Originally posted by Jerry Spoon
I'll agree from a personal view that Safari 1.0 was rushed. I've had more trouble with this version than any of the beta versions I've used.

Exactly my opinion. That being said, it's still my primary browser.
 
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Puppies

macrumors member
Jul 1, 2003
56
0
Right now I'm not using a Mac as my main machine (not until the PowerBooks get updated in a month or two), but I use Safari whenever I'm working on an iMac I've got access to. I'm sure I don't use it enough to run across all the bugs it might have, but from relativly limited use, it seems very stable, very fast, and all around more advanced than Internet Explorer (Mac AND Windows versions).

This seems like a non-issue to me. I mean Safari is FREE. If they were charging for it, then yeah, be ticked off. But it seems to work pretty great, and it dosen't cost anything to try out.

And I agree that it may have been important for Apple to get it out for "political" reasons. In which case I don't have the slightest problem with Apple releasing a beta as final software; not if it helps deflate that Micosoft IE garbage.

To an extent I feel like Safari is redundant-I normally use Mozilla on both Windows and OS X, and it's simply the best browser on Earth...but Safari's got a ton of clever ideas, runs well, is totally standards based (and is even partially open source). So good job Apple!
 
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MacSlut

macrumors 6502
Aug 12, 2002
250
3
Bar
Are you using Safari 1.0 or are you using Netscape 7 or Explorer 5.2?

If Safari wasn't deserving a "1.0" wouldn't it have much less acceptance than it has?

The real funny thing is that this article picks one of the main reasons why I use Safari instead of Explorer...cache errors with Explorer!
 
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Sol

macrumors 68000
Jan 14, 2003
1,564
6
Australia
Safari 1.0 buggy indeed

Safari 1.0 is the buggiest of all the Safaris so far. So buggy in fact that it will not load any pages on my Mac. The problem is that the first time I tried to launch it there was an older Safari on my hard drive and this created some kind of conflict. I uninstalled both versions and then re-installed the latest but the application continues to get stuck when I try to access a web page. This is too bad for me because I liked the older version of Safari and used it as my main browser since its release.

It is not all bad news though. Because of the Safari issues I started using Mozilla and other than the slow start-up time and having to re-create my bookmarks this browser is good enough for me.

Get your finger out Apple, we need a Safari that lives up to expectations.
 
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leenoble

macrumors member
Jul 3, 2003
77
0
Caching

On the subject of caching. I've always felt like taking IE by the scruff of the neck and wringing every drop of life out of it for it's appalling caching. That's on both PC and Mac. Not so much for what it does cache but for losing it when you want it to. In IE you have to go to another page you're not working on. Empty the cache. Quit explorer. Launch explorer. Empty the cache again just to be sure and then reload the page you're interested in. And emptying the cache can't even be done with a keyboard shortcut.
On safari I can be certain that Cmd-Opt-E will do exactly what I want it to in seconds. I do develop websites. And I use Safari all the time.
Another thing with IE on my computer at least, is the damned subsriptions. I haven't used IE for over a year on a regular basis but I need to have it for development purposes. Problem is, once I launch it I get that incessant subscription monitor window obnoxiously pushing it's way on top of anything I'm working on at the time and have to wait for it to go away. I've turned monitoring off: didn't work. I got clever and set it to check manually every 500 days so at least I'd get over a year's peace: didn't work either.
Jeezus I hate explorer!

And I hate WMP too, why the hell does it close down when you close the open movie window. Means you have to remember to leave the-movie-you-are-no-longer-interested-in-watching open while you go get the next one.

[/rant]

still at least IE would handle my non-standard tagging procedures :)
 
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crassusad44

macrumors 6502a
Nov 30, 2001
546
0
Scandinavia
It's only a version number

If it had been Microsoft who made Safari, we would be at 1.0 at the first Public Beta. Safari 1.0 would be SP1 or something.
I've been using Safari as my primary browser since Public Beta 2. Maybe 1.0 can be a bit buggy, but what 1.0 software is not buggy?
1.0 is only a version number, why even bother too write a long article about it?
 
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herocero

macrumors regular
Jan 23, 2003
127
34
down on the upside
a trend with apple x.0 releases?

i would have assumed after os X 10.0 that everyone would wait for apple to release x.1 (or even x.2) . . . not like M$ is any better, i just see an interesting trend.

on a kind of related note, someone mentioned the open source aspect of safari (and a lot of their projects of late). does apple get a lot of user feedback at the developer level as a result of their committment to the open source mantra?
 
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nagromme

macrumors G5
May 2, 2002
12,546
1,196
Rushed? Yes. Unlike the crash-proof betas, 1.0 is the second most unstable app on my Mac: it kills itself (not the system) about twice week of heavy use. (The worst is IE: twice a day of the same.)

But it's still my browser of choice, so I could care less whether they call it 1.0, Beta II, or Millicent.

I look forward to 1.1 though.
 
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redAPPLE

macrumors 68030
May 7, 2002
2,626
2
2 Much Infinite Loops
my take:

Safari is not perfect. It crashes when i encounter a website with some form of javascript in the source code.

unfortunately, to send a bug report, i have to copy the URL, but then Safari crashes...

another problem is "private" sites. they do not work. but i cannot send a bug report with the URL, because i want it to stay private.

i just wish we guys should keep on sending those bug reports and feedbacks so Apple can fix these bugs.

despite these annoying problems, it is still my primary browser.
 
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marijne

macrumors newbie
Jul 25, 2003
3
0
Belfast
The cache issue doesn't only affect web developers. Since Safari 1.0 caches even CGI output, and provides no method of manually refreshing individual frames, a frame based forum becomes pretty much unusable.

I really wish I'd kept a copy of the previous beta, because it was perfect for my usage and easily my primary browser. With 1.0, I find myself switching over to Camino far more often.
 
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Nermal

Moderator
Staff member
Dec 7, 2002
19,027
1,488
New Zealand
Re: Caching

Originally posted by leenoble
And I hate WMP too, why the hell does it close down when you close the open movie window. Means you have to remember to leave the-movie-you-are-no-longer-interested-in-watching open while you go get the next one.

I agree. I hate it how WiMP and RealOne both do that.
 
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vrapan

macrumors regular
Jul 16, 2003
175
0
UK
Safari buggy

Have been using it as the main browser all the way, while relying on IE for some sites that dont play very well. The only main problem I got is that it doesnt load many images and I get this stupid questionmark. And I do prefer Mozilla's way of blocking only the pop ups you dont want. However I had many more bugs when I first instlled it and didnt pay attention to Apple's suggestiong that I should remove my older Safari in order for Safari 1.0 to be ok after I removed both and then reinstalled Safari 1.0 everything seems to be working much better but yes it needs a bit of polishin up I will agree
 
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vancenase

macrumors member
Jun 23, 2003
34
0
ya just have to hit the refresh button ....

BUT ... most of the games at yahoo.com are not compatible! :( anyone find any other sites? :)
 
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DeadlyBreakfast

macrumors regular
Its my primary browser now also. IE has found its way off of my dock. I dont have any problems with it at all with one exception of not being able to name pictures when you save them. It just uses the name it receives. Not really a bug, more of an opportunity for improvement. I love it.
 
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