Sanyo CRD-DV1

Discussion in 'MacRumors News Discussion (archive)' started by arn, May 29, 2002.

  1. arn macrumors god


    Staff Member

    Apr 9, 2001
    CDRinfo reports on an upcoming "Super Combo Drive" from Sanyo Japan this summer:

    The drive will support both CD and DVD formats, becoming an alternative solution to existing DVD writers. In addition would offer the faster DVD recording speed (4x) among with a new technology that adds 650MB to normal CD-R media reaching 1.3GB with 650MB and 1.4GB with 700MB discs!

    This drive will reportedly support the DVD-R/RW standard which Apple has adopted. The non-standard 1.3-1.4GB formats are not readable in standard CD drives without firmware updates.
  2. Royal Pineapple macrumors 65816

    Royal Pineapple

    Will this drive be cheeper than Apple's existing superdrive?
  3. Backtothemac macrumors 601


    Jan 3, 2002
    San Destin Florida
    OMG. I don't care how much it costs, I have to have one of those. That would be just unreal if they have really found a way to get that much data onto a normal CDR.

    Unreal, oh, and to answer your question, no they will not be cheaper than the current drives. That will probably take a while, but this may bring the current SuperDrive to the massess :)
  4. sedarby macrumors regular

    May 29, 2002
    Dallas, TX
    Slim Line?

    What would really be interesting would be if they can get this in a slim form factor for laptops. :)
  5. TyleRomeo macrumors 6502a

    Mar 22, 2002
    New York
    i hope we see this as the "new super drive for this summer's powermacs
  6. Royal Pineapple macrumors 65816

    Royal Pineapple

    oh darn

    thats too bad, for a guy on a summer salary of $2000 theres no way i can get one of these as well as the other things i have planed:( :( :(
  7. s10 macrumors regular

    Apr 8, 2002
    Los Angeles
  8. Matt_d macrumors newbie

    May 19, 2002
  9. barkmonster macrumors 68020


    Dec 3, 2001
    I'd guess it uses some kind of compression.

    To double the amount of data storage on something with a fixed number of recordable sectors is impossible physically, If it was audio data it was compressing, maybe it might have an onboard DSP to turn it into a shorten document while burning.

    Shorten is great, it's free and you can squeeze a 60 minute sample CD down to about 200Mb, plus it restores the files back to the original and even verifies them. It's true lossless compression. Unfortunately it only works with audio.

    I also think it could be some kind of common compression scheme, huffman, LZH, LZW, TAR, ZIP, ICE! or any of the other one's that appear to be open source or at least free to use.

    Whatever it uses, it does pose an instant problem in that only people with the same drive could read the CD, unless of course it puts an auto running application on it so you can browse the CD and copy files from it. That being the case, I'd bet the windows users are cattered for first.

    lets face it, it's a mystery. I'd love to get one when they're out though, it'd be great for backing up large projects onto 1 CD instead of spanning them over several.
  10. kenkooler macrumors regular

    Jan 2, 2002
    Mexico City
    Re: I'd guess it uses some kind of compression.

    Sony has been creating CD-R drives that support the 1.3 Gb standard but they use special cds. I wonder if it has something to do with this...
  11. firewire2001 macrumors 6502a

    Apr 2, 2002
    Hong Kong
    i believe that its possible because it puts more data onto a given sector..

    it does this using a more precise laser.
  12. SPG macrumors 65816


    Jul 24, 2001
    In the shadow of the Space Needle.
    I wonder if 1.3gb will become the standard for CDR in the near future? There wa a note that other drives would be able to read these 1.3 gb Cd's with a firmware
  13. idkew macrumors 68020


    Sep 26, 2001
    where the concrete to dirt ratio is better
    no compression

    this wold NOT use compression. It would just pack more info into the same space; smaller laser as someone just said.

    My guess is that IF it does work on other CD-ROMs, it will be dog slow and that chances are even in the sony cd/dvd-rw it will be slower than a regular cd-rom.
  14. britboy macrumors 68030


    Nov 4, 2001
    Kent, UK
    My guess is that there is more to it than simply using a smaller laser. Could current cd drives meet the standard, just with a new firmware update? I doubt it. It's probably got more to do with changes to the address format and error-correction scheme.
  15. Choppaface macrumors 65816

    Jan 22, 2002
    so exactly what kinds of older drives can read these things? like old DVD-ROMs? cuz ya it would seem that older CD-ROMs would need more than a firmware update
  16. AnarchistMan macrumors newbie

    Apr 22, 2002
    New Superdrive Laser...

    Well if this drive can do this its because of the laser. It must be a shorter wavelength to get all that data in a normal cd-r which seems pretty likely. What im waiting for is the new blue laser cds which hold up to 40 gb per side! Oh yeah and the little thing being developed right now called holographic cubes or discs which can hold terabytes of date in a few inches of disk and has transfer rates up to 1gb/sec! This will make dvds, cds, and any other data storing device obsolete when it comes into production in a few years. :cool:
  17. teabgs macrumors 68030


    Jan 18, 2002
    behind you
    Re: New Superdrive Laser...

    nice first post. Gotta give credit where credit's due
  18. macfreek57 macrumors 6502

    Jan 1, 2002
    Baton Rouge, Louisiana
    yeah if it has to do with the laser presicion then you need a new drive: i.e. not an old firware-updated drive. it's not physically possible to change the way the laser mechanism works (in the ways this technology needs).
    either this article is a load of BS, or it uses compression.
  19. macfreek57 macrumors 6502

    Jan 1, 2002
    Baton Rouge, Louisiana
    nice second post
  20. AmbitiousLemon Moderator emeritus


    Nov 28, 2001
    down in Fraggle Rock
    since you guys dont seem to be capable of clicking the link i thought id quote it for you.

  21. britboy macrumors 68030


    Nov 4, 2001
    Kent, UK

    You don't really expect people to be able to use their brains and check out a link when one's provided now, do you? I thought you were a realist!

    As it says clearly in the link Current readers wouldn't be able to recognize Sanyo's 1.3GB format without a firmware upgrade, but Sanyo says its would easy to accomplish. Which is why i believe it has more to with the CIRC and ATIP than a more precise laser.
  22. SPG macrumors 65816


    Jul 24, 2001
    In the shadow of the Space Needle.
    4x DVD burn speed. That's nice. I have to get off the boards and start burning 30 DVDR's today for a client...damn, why couldn't they have strted shipping these last week!

    Hey Lemon, I thought the isle of Waponi Woo sank when the volcano erupted. How can you still be there? Enjoy your orange soda!
  23. SPG macrumors 65816


    Jul 24, 2001
    In the shadow of the Space Needle.
    Perhaps similar technology to this...

    DVD-compatible optical disk hits 100 Gbytes

    By Mike Clendenin

    EE Times
    May 24, 2002 (12:30 p.m. EST)

    TAIPEI, Taiwan ˜ Forget about 100-gigabyte portable hard drives ˜ too bulky.
    A physics professor at a leading Taiwanese university has led a group of
    researchers in developing a recordable optical disk capable of packing in
    100 Gbytes of data and slipping into a pants pocket.

    That's about 30,000 of your favorite songs, or enough tunes to toe-tap to
    for a few months.

    The disk is compatible with today's CD and DVD technology, running off the
    same red laser pick-up heads used in a typical disk player. "That's the most
    attractive part of this technology," said Wang Shyh-Yeu, director of
    research at Ritek Corp., a disk maker that co-funded the study and will
    likely commercialize the disk in 2005 or 2006.

    To achieve the 100-Gbyte density target, the research team at National
    Taiwan University, led by professor Tsai Din Ping, used near-field optics ˜
    where the distance used for the interaction of the laser and media is
    shorter than the wavelength of light used to make the recording marks on the

    Two layers were added to the disk to achieve the near-field effect. The
    first is a transparent dielectric spacing layer, about 20 nanometers to 40
    nanometers thick, which keeps the distance constant in the near field. The
    other layer is an active layer, which will interact with the focus point of
    the laser beam, generate the near-field effect and then transfer the mark to
    the recording layer.

    Smaller mark

    Using a standard sized disk, 12 centimeters in diameter, the researchers
    drew down the mark size to about 100 nm, less than about 400 nm for today's
    DVDs and 900 nm for CDs. "Even with such a small mark size, we can still
    have about 35 dB on the readout signal," Tsai said. "If you check your DVD
    disk today, the readout range is about the same, from 30 dB to 40 dB. So
    that's a very good result because the mark size is much smaller than 400 nm
    but the carrier-to-noise ratio is still very good. That's not easy."

    Japanese companies and university researchers have also been developing
    high-density prototypes. Matsu****a Electric Industrial Co. Ltd. developed a
    dual-layer rewritable optical disk last year that could store 50 Gbytes per
    side, enough for four hours of high-definition movies. It used violet
    lasers, however, not red lasers.

    Tsai said his prototype is ready to hit the market today, but Wang doubts
    the market is ready. The disk may be capable of recording dozens of Star
    Trek episodes, but there aren't any drives available to utilize it and no
    one is working on one. Such systems would also require a new chip set.
    "Today's technology still has a ways to go before this is needed," Wang

    In the meantime, Wang said Ritek should work on polishing the
    signal-to-noise characteristics on disks in the 40-Gbyte to 60-Gbyte range,
    which would still far outstrip today's 9.4-Gbyte maximum capacity for a
    dual-sided, dual-layer DVDs. Even next-generation proposals, such as Blu-ray
    DVDs, top out at about 27 Gbytes. Besides, they use pricier technology ˜
    they are based on blue lasers ˜ that is not backward compatible with today's
    red laser standard. "The next two years will be very important for this
    technology," Wang said. "If we can get through the big breakthroughs we
    need, this will be a threat to Blu-ray."

    During that time, however, Tsai will be prodding his team to push the limits
    of density even further. Ritek and Taiwan's National Science Council are
    funding the research until February 2003 with $660,000 ˜ the project started
    in March 2000. "Our goal is to make an even smaller mark size that will
    still be stable within the near field. To do this, we will have to find a
    nanostructure to make this happen in a much easier way," Tsai said.

    "One hundred gigabytes is not the limit; it is just the beginning. Our goal
    is terabit," he said.

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