Screw the kids and their education, teachers come first

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Shivetya, Jun 23, 2010.

  1. Shivetya macrumors 65816

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    #1
    First the report, http://ies.ed.gov/ncee/pubs/20104018/pdf/20104018.pdf

    One story, there are many you can search from in case you do not like this provider http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/06/22/AR2010062204487.html or and older one http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2009/05/so_long_school_choice

    The final report on the D.C. Opportunity Scholarship Program was released Tuesday by the U.S. Department of Education's Institute for Education Sciences. Although there was no conclusive evidence that the program affected student test scores, researchers found important benefits in graduation rates and parental satisfaction. The graduation rate for students who were offered scholarships was 82 percent, compared with 70 percent for those not in the program.


    The average cost per student to this program is 6,620, the average expenditure per student in Washington DC is over 28,000. Yes, 28,000 because that covers the entire budget to the education department of which teachers are a small part. Many cities like to split off costs like admin and such but if its in the budget shouldn't that figure be divided by the number of students instead of some imaginary number?


    Vouchers need to be available in areas where its shown that children need the most help. Far too many schools are caught cheating on testing and that hurts the kids. Competition is a good thing and its been far too long missing in education. A monopoly hurts the consumer whether caused by private entities or government.
     
  2. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #2
    Costs less and graduation rates are higher, I don't really see the downside of this program.
     
  3. MattSepeta macrumors 65816

    MattSepeta

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    #3
    Who is surprised?

    Higher graduation rates from a private school? Who knew?

    Are you surprised by this?

    I wholeheartedly agree, we need more voucher programs and charter schools.

    The only proof we need are the high school (4 year) graduation rates. In many states less than half of the black population graduates in 4 years, with similar statistics for latinos. IIRC the average was only around 69%, across the board.

    Pathetic. We can do much better than that, and it looks like throwing money at a bureaucracy may not be the answer.
     
  4. patrick0brien macrumors 68040

    patrick0brien

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    Teaching needs to be run with a competitive spirit, rewarding good performance, and punishing bad. And I would like to see tenure eliminated.

    I firmly believe that since teachers's purpose is to prepare their students for living in the real world, they need to live in it themselves.
     
  5. iSaint macrumors 603

    iSaint

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    Why don't we?

    Students also need to be prepared according to their goal in life, whether it's based on college prep or career prep. We're forcing too much on the kids that don't want to go to college. In turn, they get frustrated and lose confidence. If they were in a program that prepared them based on their abilities they would be more productive citizens.

    So, yes, taking kids with ability and desire to learn out of an non-supportive atmosphere and placing them in a private or charter school will increase their chances of success.
     
  6. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #6
    $6,620 is pretty damn cheap actually, cheaper than the £5k/pupil in the UK - and its probably a good amount to spend (as the UK have doubled their spend which is probably excessive).

    $28k per pupil is ridiculous (I presume its a per-year cost)
     
  7. patrick0brien macrumors 68040

    patrick0brien

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    #7
    -iSaint

    Also, the children would benefit from the effect of teachers being as motivated as they are. They would see it, feel it.

    For those that doubt the value of this effect, or want to see it illustrated, just see "From The Earth to The Moon" episode "Galileo Was Right" - true story...
     
  8. Rt&Dzine macrumors 6502a

    Rt&Dzine

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    I disagree. I think that's the parent's job.
     
  9. patrick0brien macrumors 68040

    patrick0brien

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    -Rt&Dzine

    Interesting point. However, I believe preparing students for the rest of their lives in the real world is not mutually exclusive to a single group of people.

    In the spirit of this thread, I was indeed containing my point to a single group: teachers.

    I feel if we expand the scope of the conversation to include the groups: parents, community, friends, employers, etc. This conversation might become untenable, and run off-topic.
     
  10. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #10
    I'm so glad I didn't chose a career in teaching.

    That is one underappreciated profession.
     
  11. Rt&Dzine macrumors 6502a

    Rt&Dzine

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    #11
    I was questioning your premise that it is the teacher's purpose to prepare students for the real world. The parents part isn't important. I'll reword my comment for clarity . . .

    I don't think it is the teacher's purpose to prepare their students for living in the real world.​
     
  12. patrick0brien macrumors 68040

    patrick0brien

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    #12
    -Rt&Dzine

    I see, why not?
     

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