Separate and unequal

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by jnpy!$4g3cwk, Aug 2, 2014.

  1. jnpy!$4g3cwk, Aug 2, 2014
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014

    jnpy!$4g3cwk macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

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    #1
    The latest Frontline on PBS has an eye-opening section on Baton Rouge, LA, schools. The most wealthy, suburban and white parts of Baton Rouge are trying to split into a separate city/school district (to be named "St. George").

    http://video.pbs.org/viralplayer/2365289176?chapter=1

    It seems like virtually everyone filmed and quoted was extremely careful to state up front that it isn't about race. And, who knows, perhaps it isn't? But, at the same time, people are very open about the pocketbook issue: that they, the wealthier residents of suburban Baton Rouge, don't want half their taxes to go towards paying for the poor half of Baton Rouge and its schools. In fact, the group involved even located a black minister with Tea Party ties who told them explicitly that this desire was perfectly OK.

    I can't help see this as the further erosion of the social fabric in the U.S. that gained such momentum under Reagan, and, what is surprising about it, is how open everybody is about it-- racism, they understand, is morally repugnant to many people, but, economic discrimination is just fine and dandy.

    (Edit: I'm having a little trouble with the PBS links myself: try going to Frontline and then selecting the video at there:)

    http://video.pbs.org/program/frontline/
     
  2. Ledgem macrumors 65816

    Ledgem

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    #2
    The link doesn't work - can't watch the video.
     
  3. samiwas macrumors 65816

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    #3
    Didn't have time to watch now, but the link worked for me.
     
  4. colourfastt macrumors 6502a

    colourfastt

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    #4
    It's the same as the creation of Central in EBR Parish in the 90s. People are tired of wealth redistribution.
     
  5. Michael Goff macrumors G3

    Michael Goff

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    #5
    Words like that illustrates why our society is going downhill. It isn't about helping your fellow American, it's just about your money ....
     
  6. stroked Suspended

    stroked

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    #6
    After living in Memphis, Tn. for 21 years, I can empathize why they want to split. Bussing, just brings down the good schools. Another reason, is politics. The voters in Memphis, elected the most incompetent people possible, as long as they were black. As a result, the Memphis city school system no longer exist.
     
  7. Ugg macrumors 68000

    Ugg

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    #7
    Absolutely. The rig are getting richer at the expense of the poorest Americans. It realLy needs to stop.
     
  8. MrWillie macrumors 65816

    MrWillie

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    #8
    It wasn't just that, it was the paying of a higher property tax rate, then someone in their infinite wisdom decided that bussing students was a good idea. So a family is paying high property taxes, and then their kids are being bussed to a broke school district. You pay for someone else's kid to get a better education than yours.
     
  9. shinji macrumors 65816

    shinji

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    #9
    According to the video (which does work in Firefox), the school system failed so badly the state had to intervene, and even after that, it's only a C-rated district. There were 61 arrests in 2013, and it's at the point students post videos of the fights on Youtube.

    Middle class families are already leaving to get away from it. You can't make only marginal changes that ultimately do little to change the status quo, and then complain when people want out.

    This isn't about racism. It's about wanting to give your children a better, safer education.

    And I'm disappointed in Frontline for choosing such a racially charged title, "Separate and Unequal."
     
  10. jnpy!$4g3cwk thread starter macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

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    #10
    It is difficult to prove or disprove racism. But, if I take it at face value, it is still about class, and some of the speakers were very explicit about that. The middle and upper middle classes taking exception to paying taxes to educate the poor. Well, guess what-- that is what taxes are all about-- better off people paying for things that are considered public goods-- such as universal education.
     
  11. thehustleman macrumors 65816

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    #11
    Keep it, don't separate them.

    Why should someone go to a lesser public school just because they are broke?


    That's why people aren't improving, they have a cycle of bad schooling going on
     
  12. colourfastt macrumors 6502a

    colourfastt

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    #12
    In this world you get what you pay for. And as a side note, I don't own any of those little abominations, why should a big portion of my income be taken as taxes to pay for someone else's snot-nosed brats?
     
  13. Sydde macrumors 68020

    Sydde

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    #13
    Because those snot-nosed little brats will become cashiers and stock traders and auto mechanics and DMV clerks and various other people you will have to deal with, confront, or be affected by in some way. If we churn out a nation of ignoranuses, the country will soon be foundering in a raw sewage defile of idiocracy. That is not good for you, for me, or for the idiots, so we pursue instilling them will understanding and logic and stuff.

    You did not build that.
     
  14. jkcerda Suspended

    jkcerda

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    #14
    how many of you put YOUR kids in the worst schools? how many of you bought houses in the ghetto areas? or the "poor"? why is it that wanting YOUR kids to attend a nice school is somehow "racist" "separate" blah blah blah. by all means put YOUR kids where your feeling lie, see how great they turn out :rolleyes:
     
  15. lannister80 macrumors 6502

    lannister80

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    #15
    If EVERYONE was forced to, those schools would get funding and improve.

    This is the standard "well why don't YOU do it, it's a free country" argument. It doesn't work unless EVERYONE does it.

    And really, think about all the people with NO CHOICE but to send their kid to a crappy school (which is crappy because everyone else abandoned it). How do you think THEY feel?
     
  16. barkomatic macrumors 68040

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    #16
    This isn't about rich and poor kids being forced together--its about money. The rich half doesn't want to pay for the poor half. Typical libertarian viewpoint. If you don't have the money, then you might as well lie on the railroad tracks and we'll pay someone minimum wage to put your body in a garbage bag.

    They already attend separate schools from what I understand.
     
  17. jkcerda Suspended

    jkcerda

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    #17
    1. is the funding that makes the school better? students don't count?

    2 does what exactly? your kids are limited to your district & your means.

    3 WHY are the schools "crappy"? is it the kids in it or the funding? teachers?
    if they "feel" strongly about it, move their kids as they can.
     
  18. VulchR macrumors 68020

    VulchR

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    #18
    I'd gladly vote to pay more taxes to support the 'poor' schools so that all the schools are excellent. You'd support more taxes to improve public schools, right? And if that meant taxing people much more in richer neighbourhoods you'd be OK with that, right?

    FWIW - I sent one kid to a state-funded school (for which I was a member of the equivalent of the School Board) and one to a private one. The latter was a matter of life and death, and cost more than university tuition per year. Frankly, I would have much preferred to keep my second in the state school system and worked from within to make the system better, but the system is limited by the whims of politicians who do nothing but bemoan the decline of the schools while cutting their budgets and scapegoating teachers.
     
  19. jkcerda Suspended

    jkcerda

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    #19
    so how much should the rich pay?
     
  20. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #20
    I'm really tired of this reasoning, how exactly does a brain drain of a school of the best off students and teachers fix the problem? All that does it let the well off move on and the rest to rot.

    "Just move" isn't an answer to any of our societies problems, it is simply running away from them and saying "screw em, I got mine."
     
  21. jkcerda Suspended

    jkcerda

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    #21
    1.I dont support more taxes because simply throwing money at the issue is pretty stupid. people pay property taxes, so in essence the "rich" with their nice houses are already paying a substantial amount .

    2. http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1743679

    ----------

    how the hell does watering down the school with tons of kids who DONT give a flying fig about education help those who want to learn?
    do YOU have kids? where are they going to school? put them in the worst school by all means, go ahead.
     
  22. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

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    #22
    Source for your ******** assertion?

    You use nothing but words that intentionally create a sense of "otherness", completely dismissing a subset of the population that YOU assign a mentality to without any sources or evidence to back up that these children don't care.

    Are you aware of how far behind a poor child is by the time they get to high school? Try reading some of the studies, it's shocking, and it has nothing to do with the child's attitude toward school.

    "A lot of kids like Jim fall behind their classmates even before the first bus-ride to kindergarten. Recent studies have found that a child's chances of succeeding in school are damaged most profoundly by deep poverty in early childhood. And it's precisely the children at that vulnerable pre-school age who are most likely to be poor – and to be extremely poor. The percentage of young children living in deep poverty – that is, with a household income below half the poverty line – has doubled since the 1970's."

    http://americanradioworks.publicradio.org/features/14_million/poor1.shtml

    People in this country need to stop acting like poverty is simply not having much money. It impacts every aspect of life being poor: health, mental health, substance abuse, upward mobility, food security, reading comprehension, decision making, etc.


    This country needs to wake the hell up and look at itself. We've stagnated because of a decades' long mentality of only giving to the wealthy and elite while telling the rest of us to **** off. We don't invest in our future and the results are blatantly obvious to anyone that isn't worshipping the almighty dollar or participating in the extreme narcissism of self preservation. To look down on our poor with contempt is ignore that we as a society have given actually trying to be an advanced civilization.
     
  23. FreemanW macrumors 6502

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    #23
    These threads, in these forums, they all share one common denominator . . . . .

    There are not enough people demonstrating what it takes to be a great nation and far too many people with an attitude demonstrating everything that is wrong with homo sapiens, small minded, petty, selfish, mean-spirited, hooray for me-screw everyone else, . . . . . . you get the idea.

    It won't be long, we are all going to get to enjoy the fruits of our failed society.

    Ignoranuses incapable of functional behavior (see greedy Congress) running our institutions while greedy capitalists pick the meat off the bones of our infrastructure.

    It is not likely to be a soft landing.

    /carry on
     
  24. lannister80 macrumors 6502

    lannister80

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    #24
    It doesn't. It helps the kids who don't give a flying fig to GIVE a flying fig!
     
  25. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

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    #25
    Does it though? I have never seen it work that way.

    I would love to do a social experiment where you ship all of the rich kids into the inner city school system, and take the inner city kids and ship them to the suburbs. Would the results improve for the inner city kids at the better school system? And would the rich kids education fall in the inner city schools?
     

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