Shattered is now available (on HRC campaign)

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by yaxomoxay, Apr 18, 2017.

  1. oneMadRssn macrumors 68040

    oneMadRssn

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    #2
    Uuuuughggghghghgghghghhhhhhhhh. You couldn't pay me to read it.

    I'm sure there is insight in the book and lessons that can be learned from it, but I cannot suffer through more Clinton-ism.

    If you would be so kind, give us the cliff notes of the lessons learned when you're done.
     
  2. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #3
    Cliff notes:

    Clinton is a liar.
    Clinton was a terrible candidate.
    Clinton lost the campaign.
     
  3. oneMadRssn macrumors 68040

    oneMadRssn

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    #4
    Sorry, I should have specified intelligent cliff notes.
     
  4. vrDrew, Apr 18, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2017

    vrDrew macrumors 65816

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    #5
    The Clinton campaign was dogged by an almost perfect storm of bad luck, malicious dirty tricks, and bad decisions, which let an imperfect but otherwise highly qualified candidate lose an otherwise very winnable election.

    It's no good simply saying that the Clinton campaign made mistakes. All candidates make mistakes. But, as this book apparently points out, HRC failed to learn from lessons she could have learned from her loss to Obama in 2008, and her struggles against Sanders in the Primary. As someone who volunteered for Clinton in 2016, I felt that national campaign all-but ignored Wisconsin. We didn't see a TV ad, didn't see a mailer, didn't see bumper stickers or yard signs. There wasn't the sort of automated phone-bank system that Obama had. And we saw next to nothing of the candidate in the last six weeks.

    Hopefully, the Democrats will learn from this tragic loss, and not repeat it in my lifetime.

    That said: People need to keep this foremost in their minds. Democrats and Hillary Clinton are not ever going to be responsible for Donald Trump, and the unfolding ethical, financial, political, ecological, and social disaster Trump and the Republicans are foisting on our country and the world. People who believed Trump's lies about opening coal mines and building walls are slowly coming around to the realization that they've been duped. But that's on them. They were told, in no uncertain terms, that they were being lied to for well over a year. There was ample evidence to prove that most of what Trump said was patently untrue or impossible.

    But they went ahead and voted for a thrice-bankrupt reality TV star, a sexual predator, an oaf and a buffoon anyway. The blame for the ills that are about to fall upon our great country lies with them.
     
  5. Chew Toy McCoy macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

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    #6
    The DNC brain trust will read it and conclude the best way to counter the issues with Clinton is more Clinton.
     
  6. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #7
    Lol. The RNC tricked Hillary into putting an illegal server in her house, cheating by taking debate questions early, and conspiring to rig the primary. Those darn republicans. Hillary was robbed. :rolleyes:
     
  7. zin macrumors 6502

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    #8
    One excerpt I have read relates to Hillary's loss to Barack Obama in 2008. It notes that after defeat, Hillary scooped up the campaign emails of all of her senior aides in order to find out what they did wrong and who leaked information to who.

    The same woman who would later lose a presidential election partly because she concealed her own emails and had them destroyed whilst they were under subpoena.

    It's almost poetic. It's as if she cannot conceive a situation in which the reason Hillary loses is because of Hillary.
     
  8. unlinked macrumors 6502a

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    #9
    How did people on the ground feel at the time? Were you sure she would win or were there signs she wouldn't/it was close? It isn't like her campaign lacked for money. She was outspending Trump 2:1 or something silly like that.
     
  9. vrDrew macrumors 65816

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    #10
    Increasingly unsettled as the summer turned to fall.

    There was never a sense of panic. And maybe things would have been better if there had been. But we really felt that we were getting all-but ignored by the National Party. We got very little in terms of resources.

    My personal situation was a little odd. I live in one of the Deep Red wealthier counties that surround Milwaukee. And the Democratic candidate for Congress in our district was all-but invisible. But the campaign made very little effort to reach out to independent and persuadable Republican voters. Our call-lists and canvassing logs were all focused on solid-Democratic voters. I remember seeing Trump bumper stickers on cars in the grocery-store parking lot (invariably on the junkier vehicles in a sea of late-model BMWs and Mercedes). At first I shook my head at the chumps. But by October I was getting concerned at the lack of enthusiasm for Clinton.

    A small, anecdotal observation: A small town near me is politically almost always 50%-50% blue/red. Driving through the "main drag" in 2008 and 2012, Obama signs clearly outnumbered McCain and Romney ones. In 2016 - Clinton barely had a sign to be seen, and was clearly outnumbered by Trump. Not that Trump had a lot. It's just that Clinton had barely bothered.
     
  10. TonyC28 macrumors 65816

    TonyC28

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    #11
    I don't mean this to be condescending or argumentative, so please don't take it that way...
    Your party HAS TO look in the mirror at some point and stop making excuses for her.
    Again, not being mean, just trying to offer advice even though I'm just some dude from Illinois.
     
  11. oneMadRssn macrumors 68040

    oneMadRssn

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    #12
    From all I have read and heard, my take is that issues with the Clinton campaign were well about Clinton and more about the DNC.

    First, regardless of what you think politically, the public let it be known loud and clear over the past many years that populism was in. Palin, Obama's "yes we can," Trump's political rise in 2012 to his election, Sanders' popularity. The signs were clear that this is the era of populism. Yet against all signs saying the winning candidate needs to be at least somewhat populist, the DNC decides to heavily favor probably the most establishment candidate imaginable. Not only was Clinton a flawed candidate, she was the wrong type of candidate for the time.

    Second, Clinton's campaign and the DNC both had huge messaging issues. While it's true that Clinton put out numerous policy papers and gave hundreds of speeches on substantive issues, nobody paid attention. There were no pithy one-lingers that grabbed attention and steered the conversation. Everyone remembers "yes we can," "change you can believe in," build a wall," lock her up," and "read my lips, no new taxes." It takes more than just the campaign to do that though, and the DNC should have done more to help. What did Clinton and the DNC have? Nothing.

    Third, the campaign misplayed the Trump effect. They spent way too much time reacting to Trump's shenanigans and calling him names. Yes, he's a sexual predator with the intelligence of a stump. It may have seemed impossible under the media climate, but I think a better strategy would have been to just ignore his lunatic comments and instead focus on his policies or lack thereof.
     
  12. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #13
    I lived it ... I don't need to read it.
     
  13. Chew Toy McCoy macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

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    #14
    Democrats have formed there first new era platform and it shows they have clearly been listening. Everybody gets 1 vote per dollar they have in savings. It’s great because it will, like, inspire people to save and stuff! You’re welcome!
     
  14. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    #15
    Here is the Washington Post's review.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...a1fb24d4671_story.html?utm_term=.2ae683e528bd
     
  15. chown33 macrumors 604

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    #16
    Here's a somewhat different POV:

    ... Nearly 20 percent of voters in the 2016 presidential election had an unfavorable view of both Trump and Hillary Clinton, according to exit polls, and Trump won that group 47 percent to 30 percent. That made the difference.
    As in many projects with even the most insightful post mortems, there may not be a single decisive factor, but a collection of small ones, that ultimately decides the outcome.
     
  16. DrewDaHilp1 macrumors 6502a

    DrewDaHilp1

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    #17
    Didn't 538 claim she was going to win?
     
  17. chown33 macrumors 604

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    #18
    It gave Trump a 1 in 3 chance of winning. Not great odds, but not impossible. I've won money on horses with longer odds than that.

    Prediction is difficult, especially when it involves the future.

    Speculating after the fact about what might have changed the outcome is just as "predictive". Even if particular mistakes are obvious in retrospect, the amount they contribute to the outcome is always going to be debatable.
     
  18. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #19
    Rude
    --- Post Merged, Apr 18, 2017 ---
    IMG_0026.JPG
     
  19. PracticalMac macrumors 68030

    PracticalMac

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    #20
    LOL

    TL;DR
    Clinton lied, terrible, lost.
     
  20. unlinked macrumors 6502a

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  21. MadeTheSwitch macrumors 6502a

    MadeTheSwitch

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    #22
    I'd give that same advice to the Republican party for Trump. Stop making excuses.
     
  22. TonyC28 macrumors 65816

    TonyC28

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    #23
    Agree 100%
     
  23. Herdfan macrumors 6502

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    #24
    In all fairness, the Dems have ruled the get-out-the-vote game for many election cycles, and it has worked.

    The only difference here was that Trump, as you noted about the signs and bumper stickers, was his own GOTV game. He got people excited and they showed up.
    --- Post Merged, Apr 20, 2017 ---
    Only a 1-2 month wait at Amazon. Ordered the Kindle version.
     
  24. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #25
    Shattered? Is this book about her hips after all those falls during the campaign?
     

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