She's an Iraq War veteran promising to end "regime-change wars"

jkcerda

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Jun 10, 2013
681
38,907
Criminal Mexi Midget
Rep. Tulsi Gabbard of Hawaii said she would end the United States’ “regime-change wars” in countries like Syria, and prevent the US from intervening in Venezuela and Iran.

“I will end these regime-change wars. I will work to end this new Cold War and this nuclear arms race that is costing us trillions, and again take those resources … and use them to serve the needs of people here,” she told CNN Sunday.
https://www.cnn.com/politics/live-news/sxsw-town-hall-delaney-gabbard-buttigieg/h_e5f7dac1e0fa2673644190e90ec5e324
The only democrat I would consider voting for
 

decafjava

macrumors 68040
Feb 7, 2011
3,146
2,568
Geneva
Again, agree with both of you (even if I am planning to watch Captain Marvel this week :p). For example, forgive an outsider (Canadian) chiming in but we also spent over 10 years in Astan looking for OBL and wasted money and lives. All in the meanwhile the US ally Pakistan was protecting him.

I am pretty upset not more identifying as leftist step up to support candidates like her.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jkcerda

jkcerda

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Jun 10, 2013
681
38,907
Criminal Mexi Midget
Again, agree with both of you (even if I am planning to watch Captain Marvel this week :p). For example, forgive an outsider (Canadian) chiming in but we also spent over 10 years in Astan looking for OBL and wasted money and lives. All in the meanwhile the US ally Pakistan was protecting him.

I am pretty upset not more identifying as leftist step up to support candidates like her.
Obama turned plenty of democrats into neocons :(
 

ThisBougieLife

macrumors 68010
Jan 21, 2016
2,004
6,332
SF Bay Area, California
But I thought it was "unpatriotic" not to support the military industrial complex :eek:

I don't agree with Gabbard on everything, but I certainly support an end to our interventionist "regime change" aggression. We have no business getting involved in other countries' civil conflicts. It never works out well and yet we seem to be incapable of learning from history.
 

NT1440

macrumors G5
May 18, 2008
12,140
13,982
But I thought it was "unpatriotic" not to support the military industrial complex :eek:

I don't agree with Gabbard on everything, but I certainly support an end to our interventionist "regime change" aggression. We have no business getting involved in other countries' civil conflicts. It never works out well and yet we seem to be incapable of learning from history.
Hell beyond that, we have no right to arm and train rebel groups, send them in to make trouble in a country, then have the gall to call it a “civil war” when we’re behind it the whole time.

It’s a coup, and it’s our SOP.
 

VulchR

macrumors 68020
Jun 8, 2009
2,327
10,226
Scotland
Disarm, but only insofar as the world situation allows it. I personally don't want Russia or the PRC gaining any more power than they already have, for I do not trust the governments of those countries. Are we supposed to sit back and shrug off or treaty obligations to the Ukraine (both the US and Russia agreed to respect the territorial integrity of the country in exchange for it giving up the nukes it inherited from the USSR) and let Putin nibble way at the country like he is doing in Georgia? Are we supposed to allow the PRC to control international sea lanes in spite of the fact that their artificial land features have been declared to be illegal and their claims to the South China Sea denied?

As for wars about regime change, so far they haven't worked. Yet what are we supposed to do when some crackpot despot starts committing genocide? Sit back, plug our ears and go la-la-la?
 

Solomani

macrumors 68040
Sep 25, 2012
3,701
6,173
Alberto, Canado
Your Favorite Orange President just proposed the largest US budget bill in history, mostly for a huge increase in military spending. Guess what he wants to do with that HUGE historical-record increase in military budget? Oh right. He wants to start wars. Or prolong existing wars. Regime-changing wars. What? You think he wants a huge boost to military spending so he can host parades? LOL

Trump Proposes a Record $4.75 Trillion Budget

WASHINGTON — President Trump sent Congress on Monday a record $4.75 trillion budget request that proposes an increase in military spending and sharp cuts to domestic programs like education and environmental protection for the 2020 fiscal year.

Mr. Trump’s budget, the largest in federal history, includes a nearly 5 percent increase in military spending — which is more than the Pentagon had asked for — and an additional $8.6 billion for construction of a border wall with Mexico.
 

yaxomoxay

macrumors 68040
Mar 3, 2010
3,584
24,447
Texas
Your Favorite Orange President just proposed the largest US budget bill in history, mostly for a huge increase in military spending. Guess what he wants to do with that HUGE historical-record increase in military budget? Oh right. He wants to start wars. Or prolong existing wars. Regime-changing wars. What? You think he wants a huge boost to military spending so he can host parades? LOL

Trump Proposes a Record $4.75 Trillion Budget
Let me put my conspiracy theory hat on for a second.

I'd argue that the best way to prevent American wars in the awful military-industrial complex that is in place and that no POTUS seems to be able to beat is to hand out more contracts and $$$. The moment the gov't stops increasing military funding, suddenly new needs for wars will begin under one form (civil war) or another (terrorist attack).
 

NT1440

macrumors G5
May 18, 2008
12,140
13,982
Disarm, but only insofar as the world situation allows it. I personally don't want Russia or the PRC gaining any more power than they already have, for I do not trust the governments of those countries. Are we supposed to sit back and shrug off or treaty obligations to the Ukraine (both the US and Russia agreed to respect the territorial integrity of the country in exchange for it giving up the nukes it inherited from the USSR) and let Putin nibble way at the country like he is doing in Georgia? Are we supposed to allow the PRC to control international sea lanes in spite of the fact that their artificial land features have been declared to be illegal and their claims to the South China Sea denied?

As for wars about regime change, so far they haven't worked. Yet what are we supposed to do when some crackpot despot starts committing genocide? Sit back, plug our ears and go la-la-la?
The flip side of that is who stops the US from nibbling away at the only thing we care about, the economics of other countries?

We’re either going to have to accept a multipolar world or we’re going to go out with a bang.
 

jkcerda

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Jun 10, 2013
681
38,907
Criminal Mexi Midget
Your Favorite Orange President just proposed the largest US budget bill in history, mostly for a huge increase in military spending. Guess what he wants to do with that HUGE historical-record increase in military budget? Oh right. He wants to start wars. Or prolong existing wars. Regime-changing wars. What? You think he wants a huge boost to military spending so he can host parades? LOL

Trump Proposes a Record $4.75 Trillion Budget
the last clown bombed more countries than Bush, he is the reason why the U.S is in Syria in the first place and debt under him increased to 18 trillion. but by all means complain about the mango messiah for wanting to have talks with NK and wanting to withdraw from Syria.....
 
  • Like
Reactions: Solver

Rhonindk

macrumors 68040
Oct 3, 2014
3,751
7,328
watching the birth of the Dem WTH Party
I am going to have to ... wait on this. Couple of things I would like to know her definition of:
1. What does she define as Regime Change wars?
2. Is this playing "World Policeman" or ... ?
3. Where does she draw the line? Turn a blind eye or ... ?
4. Is her target the military industrial complex or ... ?

I kind of, sort of like the concept. It is far to nebulous for me at this point to call either yeah or neigh. ;)
 

hulugu

macrumors 68000
Aug 13, 2003
1,819
10,173
quae tangit perit Trump
I am going to have to ... wait on this. Couple of things I would like to know her definition of:
1. What does she define as Regime Change wars?
2. Is this playing "World Policeman" or ... ?
3. Where does she draw the line? Turn a blind eye or ... ?
4. Is her target the military industrial complex or ... ?

I kind of, sort of like the concept. It is far to nebulous for me at this point to call either yeah or neigh. ;)
These are good questions. It's not enough to say, "I will end these regime-change wars. I will work to end this new Cold War and this nuclear arms race that is costing us trillions, and again take those resources … and use them to serve the needs of people here."

We need a real plan that describes what we're going to do about the roughly 800 U.S. bases and support units deployed all around the world. And, we need to draw out how we're going to withdraw from Afghanistan and Syria and what this means going forward.

And, yes, we can "end this new Cold War" only if we can keep Russia negotiating, and what happens if the Russians decide to get back into the business of empire building. We can't just withdraw from the world stage, without that vacuum being filled by someone else.

So, Gabbard is making the right noises, but simply pressing for disengagement, and even isolation, won't actually come with much benefit.
 

Raid

macrumors 68020
Feb 18, 2003
2,143
3,907
Toronto
As for wars about regime change, so far they haven't worked. Yet what are we supposed to do when some crackpot despot starts committing genocide? Sit back, plug our ears and go la-la-la?
We should give the UN some balls, and some teeth by taking away veto power from all countries.

But yeah I'm glad at least one politician is openly questioning the long, and poor track record of the American foreign policy playbook.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rhonindk and hulugu

jkcerda

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Jun 10, 2013
681
38,907
Criminal Mexi Midget
We should give the UN some balls, and some teeth by taking away veto power from all countries.

But yeah I'm glad at least one politician is openly questioning the long, and poor track record of the American foreign policy playbook.
the U.N is basically the U.S.................o_Oo_Oo_O
 
Last edited:

hulugu

macrumors 68000
Aug 13, 2003
1,819
10,173
quae tangit perit Trump
Let me put my conspiracy theory hat on for a second.

I'd argue that the best way to prevent American wars in the awful military-industrial complex that is in place and that no POTUS seems to be able to beat is to hand out more contracts and $$$. The moment the gov't stops increasing military funding, suddenly new needs for wars will begin under one form (civil war) or another (terrorist attack).
There's always some bored Saudi prince who can hire Triple Canopy or Blackwater (or whatever their nome du guerre is now) to go shoot at nomads, and I'm sure we can sell MRAPs to some post-Soviet army that needs to replace their BMPs.
 

Raid

macrumors 68020
Feb 18, 2003
2,143
3,907
Toronto
the U.S is basically the U.S.................o_Oo_Oo_O
I assume you meant the "U.S is basically the UN" I know the US loves to think of it's self as such but then they always go and do their own thing whether the UN approves or not.

It's like those '80s cop movies... the UN is the Captian trying to keep the good, but wild US cop in check. But unlike a movie somebody's got to clean up the mess left behind.
 
  • Like
Reactions: hulugu

kobalap

macrumors 6502
Nov 30, 2009
348
2,147
I’m all for ending our forever wars...as a first stop.

What I really want is for someone with the courage to call our empire for what it is, I don’t see that anywhere in sight.
Why? What does that buy you?
 

NT1440

macrumors G5
May 18, 2008
12,140
13,982
Why? What does that buy you?
The beginnings of actually discussing the root causes of our problems at home. From collapsing infrastructure to “diseases of despair” (which just hit a new all time high in the US) we’re following the decline path of every empire before us.

Can’t fix the problem without getting at its root cause.
 

VulchR

macrumors 68020
Jun 8, 2009
2,327
10,226
Scotland
The flip side of that is who stops the US from nibbling away at the only thing we care about, the economics of other countries?

We’re either going to have to accept a multipolar world or we’re going to go out with a bang.
I remember a game from the 1980's called Balance of Power. Unlike most games, the game wasn't about world domination, but simply preventing the world from blowing itself up. It started out as a bipolar game (NATO versus Warsaw pact), which was playable and winnable, but then the developers investigated adding other powers. The end result was the the multi-power world always blew itself up. The more strategic powers there are, the greater the combinatorial explosion of potential pairwise conflicts. We've just had nuclear-armed India bombing nuclear-armed Pakistan... I don't think a multipolar world is necessarily safer, or more just.
[doublepost=1552339720][/doublepost]
We should give the UN some balls, and some teeth by taking away veto power from all countries.
Agreed. Get rid of the 'Security Council' and make global policing a truly international effort..
 
  • Like
Reactions: Night Spring

s2mikey

macrumors 68020
Sep 23, 2013
2,462
2,520
Upstate, NY
But I thought it was "unpatriotic" not to support the military industrial complex :eek:

I don't agree with Gabbard on everything, but I certainly support an end to our interventionist "regime change" aggression. We have no business getting involved in other countries' civil conflicts. It never works out well and yet we seem to be incapable of learning from history.
No, IMO its very patriotic to support our military men and women WHEN our safety is at stake and we need them to do their jobs and protect us! I see nothing patriotic about unlimted funding of regime-change machines that make Haliburton or Lockheed-Martin rich when costing the lives of peoples sons and daughters. Its sick.

Wow - Im gonna break my record for upvotes even from our left-leaning friends if I keep this up! :D