Ten years Apple user. Now it is time to say goodbye (at least for now)

Discussion in 'Community Discussion' started by petvas, Oct 31, 2016.

  1. petvas macrumors 601

    petvas

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2006
    Location:
    Mannheim, Germany
    #1
    I am not sure this is the right forum to post this, so Mods, if there is a better place for this, just feel free to move it.

    The title of the article says it all, but I would like to post why I am leaving the Apple ecosystem. Please note that this is not a rant and it is not supposed to be provocative in any way. It just describes my personal situation and views regarding technology. It might reflect on others too, but it might also not. Everybody is different and has different views and opinions, which are of course respected.
    Please excuse the length of this post, but since this is going to be my (for the time being at least) last thread I create on this forum, please bare with me. Thank you.

    First, some things about my background. My first computer was an Amstrad 6128, but I quickly moved to the Amiga platform. I was in love with the Amiga, and its capabilities. After the death of the Amiga it was a sad time for me in technology, but I ended up going to Microsoft.
    I also started working as an IT Professional, specializing in Security, Identity Management, Collaboration and Messaging, with a deep focus in Microsoft products and technologies. In those years I didn't have any connection to Apple and the Apple ecosystem. I was also working for Microsoft as a Technology Specialist..

    Around 2006 I was worried about the direction that Microsoft was taking under Steve Ballmer. Windows Vista was a major misstep and it made me look for the first time to Apple.
    I was impressed by Steve Jobs and its convincing, charismatic personality. I was impressed and convinced by his vision of computing. Designing high quality products that just work, that are easily accesible by everyone, but also satisfy the demands of power users and professionals.

    I bought into the Apple ecosystem. I bought Macbooks, iMacs, Macbook Airs, Mac Pros. I think that the only thing I didn't buy was a Mac Mini.
    in 2007 the iPhone came and I was ecstatic. I was very deep into the ecosystem, buying everything I could.
    On a professional level I had to work with Microsoft products, but privately I was full Apple.

    When Steve died, I cried like a baby. I felt that a part of me was gone. He was a great personality and he is still greatly missed. Despite Steve's death I continued using Apple products. I believed that Tim Cook was doing everything right. I knew that Tim will never replace Steve completely. Noone can!

    The last years a feeling started growing in me, that Apple is complacent.
    I also saw a clear direction towards consumer products only and I did not like that. Aperture was discontinued (which I really loved), and the worst for me was that OS X (or macOS) got worse over time. I had the feeling that Apple is not focusing on its roots. Apple was focusing on areas where the most money are, something that I understand but do not like.
    On the other side, iOS became stale, or to put it differently, it didn't develop like I would like. I felt that Android (not all incarnations of Android though), were better suited for me. iOS became boring (for me). Especially I was disappointed to see other OEMs making better hardware than Apple. HTC and even Samsung (which I really do not like) caught up. Apple was not alone.

    Microsoft changed too. Windows 7 was a very good OS, followed by the disaster of Windows 8. Windows 10 is a great OS and I am sure that the next versions will be even better. Why I am so sure? Because Microsoft has changed its leadership, and it shows in its products. The Surface, the Surface Book and the Surface Studio are great products at least on par with Apple's offerings. Add to that my affinity to Microsoft in the enterprise field, and the feeling that I should return to Microsoft grew even more stronger.

    Going back to Apple, I see a lot of missteps that make me think that the direction Apple is taking is not what I want from technology.

    Apple is not innovating as fast as other companies do. Google is (for me) better in cloud services. Microsoft has a more versatile OS and ecosystem. Both Google and Microsoft are creating premium products and are of course asking a premium price for them (which I do not mind - I am used from Apple...)

    What are the major missteps that made me decide to leave Apple?
    • Apple is increasingly ignoring power users. Look at Aperture, look at how Final Cut Pro developed. macOS has become almost like iOS..The Mac Pro hasn't been updated for three years!
    • Apple is showing little innovation. I am sorry Apple Watch users. I understand you might like the Apple Watch, but for me this is not innovation.. It is a products that answers problems that do not exist. Apart from that I do not see what Apple is doing that is so innovative. I doubt that Apple has the right people to continue innovating. I lost faith.
    • The last Macbook Pro refresh. I believe that the Touch Bar is nice, but it would be better to have laptops with touch screens. The argument that it is not productive to work with touch screens on a Mac because of the verticality of the display, is for me not valid. There are many examples that show that it can work very well. My wife every time she uses my Macbook Pro, tries to scroll by touching the screen :) This shows how people that are not technology experts think about simple things. Microsoft was right. The Windows 8 implementation was a disaster, but with Windows 10 they corrected a lot of their missteps. I believe that Microsoft is on the right track here (but not 100% there yet).
    • The latest Macbook Pro (take 2): Why no SD card? Why the need for so many dongles? I understand forward thinking and I am all for it, but why on earth not at least include some of the most important dongles in the Macbook Pro package?
    • The last iPhones: Design wise no changes (still a great phone), but without a headphone jack (yes, I know it had to go and eventually it will go). I believe it should be replaced by a better technology. Apple didn't present a better technology (yet). If they did that, then I would be all for it. In the meantime I enjoy high res sound on my HTC 10. If Apple was serious about it, they would get rid of the headphone jack from all new products.
    • macOS Sierra: I see zero differences to the previous version. Zero.
    • macOS Apps: For years I have experience how bad the underpinnings of some apps are (especially Mail, iCal and contacts). Apple has changed nothing in the last ten years in the way these apps work (in the background, not end user features). I see no improvements whatsoever.

    Now, add my affinity to Microsoft on top of that and the direction Microsoft has taken in the last 2-3 years, and you might understand why I feel like that.
    Today I placed an order for a Surface Book i7 512GB SSD and 16GB RAM. An expensive laptop, maybe more expensive than a Macbook Pro.
    It is not about the price.

    I just have the strong feeling that it is time to go back to my roots, to Microsoft. Microsoft has corrected its big missteps and has brought great products on the market.

    I wish Apple a lot of success. I wish they prove me wrong. I hope they change their direction and correct their missteps too. When they do that, then I might come back. In the meantime I will give Microsoft another chance. They deserve it.
    On the services front I am using Google and I am impressed by them.

    I have been a member of this site for many years, and I have spent many hours here in the forums. I am a bit sad that I am leaving the Apple ecosystem. Who knows, maybe sometime in the future I will be back.

    Please do not start insulting posts. I would like to have a good discussion about the points I mentioned. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. Please do that respectfully. Thank you.
     
  2. BasicGreatGuy Contributor

    BasicGreatGuy

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2012
    Location:
    In the middle of several books.
    #2
    If you are leaving Apple, there really is no need to discuss it, especially when you said it would be your last post. If you didn't want to be dramatic, you wouldn't have posted this dramatic post in the first place. Getting so emotional over computers is rather illogical and unproductive, in my opinion.
     
  3. petvas thread starter macrumors 601

    petvas

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2006
    Location:
    Mannheim, Germany
    #3
    I said it would be my last thread. I was curious if others are like me in a similar position. I don't see where the drama is :)
     
  4. Medusa3 macrumors 6502

    Medusa3

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    Washington State
  5. Spink10 Suspended

    Spink10

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    Nov 3, 2011
    Location:
    Oklahoma
    #5
    lol...I didn't read the 1st post...too long.

    But after reading this I scrolled up real quick and first thing I read...

    Drama :)
     
  6. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    Colorado
    #6
    Get whatever best fits your needs. If that is now Windows machines, so be it.
     
  7. A.Goldberg macrumors 68020

    A.Goldberg

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2015
    Location:
    Boston
    #7
    I do think the post is a bit over dramatic, but not necessarily wrong. I do think it means something to have many customers disappointed with the small details Apple has put into their devices over the years now belong lost. The thread about the lack of chime on the new MBP's- just look at that. Personally I always thought the iPhone should have a startup chime :p

    To be fair though Apple has been alienating their prosumers for years. Frankly the tides have changed many times in the history of Apple. Remember when people freaked out during the PPC to Intel transition? The blasphemy of dropping the PowerBook and PowerMac names?

    Apple is focusing less on their computers, but it's because what the market is driving. Desktop/Laptops have kind of plateaued in the past number of years. People are keeping their computers longer and longer now that mobile technology has taken over. Not surprisingly computer prices have increased.

    I do feel Apple isn't as innovative as they once were. They're not really conceiving any new products, rather than just repacking the same old things over and over.

    I'd love to see a true MS Surface line competitor, though it should have been Apple on the forefront of this. I don't think they have the creative edge they once had, but that doesn't mean they won't release something new and noteworthy.

    I'm still sticking with Apple because of their smart integration, stability, and quality hardware. But I've considered other options over the past couple years.
     
  8. AustinIllini macrumors demi-god

    AustinIllini

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  9. ETechMaster2002 macrumors member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2016
    #9
    I'm kind of agreeing with you sort of. Apple should've included important dongles with the Macbook Pro packaging. Seriously, I have to waste $19 - $25 just so I can connect my new iPhone 7 to my Macbook Pro - give me break Apple. If it was the same price ($1299) then yeah, I won't be complaining, but asking me to pay more for dongles along with the (increased) $1499, $1799 and $2399 prices - come on, get real.

    I had an Apple Watch - it's nice to have. Not a must have. Nothing really innovative. I can live without it if I had to. In fact, I'm close to selling it... but I'll see where the Apple Watch Series 3 goes. I see no differences between Apple Watch Series 1 and Apple Watch Series 2 other than speed. And it's not like the Series 1 is slow. Even with watchOS 3.

    Siri was the only thing I was excited about for macOS Sierra. It is better than Cortana in my opinion as well. Universal Keyboard? Yeah, it's a nice addition, but it is not worthy as being one of the major features showcased at WWDC. I feel like it should've been one of those side things instead of being showcased as a main feature. In fact, besides Siri, all of the macOS Sierra "MAJOR" features showcased at WWDC were minor and should've been a side thing - like a "nice little touch" sort of thing. I do like Apple Pay for Mac, however...

    Job's Macbook = A great have for mostly anyone.
    Cook's Retina Macbook = Meh. It's okay.
    Not saying Cook is not doing a great job - he is! But, I don't really see that same kind of "Apple Magic" in him as I did with Steve Jobs - you know what I'm saying?

    Oh and all of Steve's Visions. Gone.
    • Glowing Apple Logo (fun fact, watch the 2016 Macbook Pro Reveal Video, you will see that glowing Apple Logo showcased during that clip. Then they remove it... ha ha).
    • (2007) iPhone 2G, (2010) iPhone 4, (2013) iPhone 5c and 5s, (2014), iPhone 6 and 6 Plus, (2017) iPhone SE, iPhone 7, iPhone 7 Plus. The 7 Plus has a dual camera system. iPhone SE does not 3D Touch - but the other phones do. iPhone SE has a Retina Display, the iPhone 7 and 7 Plus has Retina HD Display's- iPhone 7 and 7 Plus Jet Black is only available in 128 and 256 GB. ARE YOU SEE WHERE I AM GOING WITH THIS???? It's no longer that simple vision Steve Jobs visioned. Sad.
    • Dong! Mac Chime gone from the new Macbook Pro - this should've been an option you can toggle in settings.
    • This is the biggest one to me. They removed actual people talking in their introduction videos. I liked to see Jony Ive face, I liked to see Phil Schiller and that guy from the iPhone 4 and 4s videos, and their hand gestures, it felt so welcoming. Now we just have narration. Sad. This has to be the biggest one to me. :(
    Got an iPhone 7 - it's nice and all but I really don't see any major differences. Other than better camera and home button. Oh and something about this headphone jack... ;)

    But yeah - I really hope Apple improves. Yes, they are most likely the biggest tech company in the World - but that can change in an instant... btw, the Surface Studio is a beast! But it looks so damn ugly though! But it is still a power house. I buy for performance, not design. Just had to get that out. :)
     
  10. puma1552 macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2008
    #10
    I'm so old I remember when everyone complained about the PCIE/Compact Flash slot giving way to the "useless" SD card slot. My how our gripes change over time.
     
  11. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

    Staff Member

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    May 3, 2009
    Location:
    Boston
    #11
    I'm still of the opinion that I pick the right tool for the job.

    I'll be the first to admit that I'm not happy with Apple's offerings lately, but I do love my iMac, its a great piece of technology and does everything I ask of it. I also rock with a Surface Book because I found that to be better at meeting my needs.

    I don't see myself walking away from Apple, though I've said this elsewhere, I do feel that apple has left me, (at least in terms of the laptop market).

    One size doesn't fit all, and Windows/PCs are a great choice.

    Good luck on the other side, OP.
     
  12. TheDoubler55 macrumors 6502

    TheDoubler55

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2011
    #12
    Saying you cried like a baby for a man that has never been a part of your life is a little over dramatic, but to each their own. I was definitely a little sad that SJ died, but I would never cry over an individual that I've never even spoken to. (SIRI doesnt count). I do think Apple has made some bad decisions in regards to tech the last 2 years, but I still love their products and have no issues with them. No I will not buy the new overpriced MacBook Pro because I can wait for the price to drop like it has in past years.
    Good Luck with Microsoft, google and Android-OP. :cool:
     
  13. BernyMac macrumors regular

    BernyMac

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    USA
    #13
    Buy the tool that fits your need. Devotion to a brand is not logical.
     
  14. Kurfer macrumors regular

    Kurfer

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2008
    #14
    I never understood why people campaign for apple or Microsoft. It's like hey dummy you're paying them, they are not paying you. Stop acting like you're part of a team, you're just another no name consumer. Just use what works for you...
     
  15. ucfgrad93 macrumors P6

    ucfgrad93

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    Colorado
    #15
    Agreed. Use what works for you and let others do the same.
     
  16. bbrks macrumors 65816

    bbrks

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2013
    #16
    huuuuuhhhhh, just to long that first post, no time to read it, sorry :)
     
  17. Scepticalscribe, Nov 2, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2016

    Scepticalscribe Contributor

    Scepticalscribe

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2008
    Location:
    The Far Horizon
    #17
    I read the OP's original post.

    Yes, I think it is "dramatic", and "emotional", although it makes a number of salient points once you filter through the fog of emotion and identification.

    I can honestly say that the character of a CEO of a company is something I never take into account as a positive reason for purchasing a product - although, granted, it might influence me not to purchase a specific product if the CEO held - or holds - positions I consider economically exploitative and morally repellant (such as the use of child labour or coerced labour, for example).

    Ah, now, this explains the source of the excessive (to my mind) emotion. And no, it is not an emotion I share, as I do not believe that human beings ought to be the recipient of the sort of emotional fervour more usually directed at divinities.

    I fear that the OP - @petvas - bought into something resembling an esoteric cult, where the worship of The Founder, - in essence a sort of Cult Of The Personality - was encouraged.

    There was a time when Apple - through slick advertising and superb marketing and public relations - encouraged those who bought their products to see themselves as a sort of esoteric elite, whose currency was technological innovation and that attractive fusion of form and function that Apple at its best represented in design terms.

    Indeed, there was a time when - especially for quite a few guys - Apple and tech became fused with what they thought of as they own identity, thus anything which served to undermine this was perceived as an assault or an attack on their very sense of self.

    This, I think, is what lies behind some of the tone of shocked outrage - and an almost personal disappointment, posts tinged with a tone of appalled disbelief at what they view as this fundamental betrayal - we see in some posts on this forum and elsewhere.

    At the end of the day, Apple is not a cult, or a pseudo-religion, or an esoteric elite where The Elect Greet One Another. It is a commercial company, which exists to make a profit, which has made a fortune and a reputation on technological innovation - initially - in the area of computers, and, subsequently, in how music is marketed and consumed, and latterly, in how entertainment is consumed, along with an utter transformation in how phones are imagined and used.

    All of this has made the company far greater wealth - and profit - and market share - than computers ever did, and commercial imperatives decree that this is where their focus will - most likely - remain for the foreseeable future.

    In fact, Apple can afford to run their computing arm as a luxury, or niche, or - even - loss leading - extra. They don't need it, but it is nice to have for reasons of reputation.
     
  18. petvas thread starter macrumors 601

    petvas

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2006
    Location:
    Mannheim, Germany
    #18
    You are over analyzing my post. I was impressed by Steve Jobs and his vision. Apple is a company that wants to make money, as every other company. I am disappointed by their change in direction and I have stopped seeing any vision. I see a lot of differences compared to the Steve Jobs' Apple. On the other side I feel that going back to Microsoft is the right thing for me to do. Microsoft has corrected a lot of its mistakes and has shown to everybody that it can learn. Apple is on a decent and is moving away from its core beliefs.
     
  19. Scepticalscribe Contributor

    Scepticalscribe

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    #19
    Um, @petvas, I don't believe that I am 'over-analysing' your post at all.

    Your post was unusually long, and - to my mind - unusually emotionally invested in a form of identity where one of the signifiers of that selfsame identity is (or was) your attachment to Apple - the company, the Founder, the products, signalled by your ownership of those products.

    My sense is that some of the males who make such lengthy and, um, heartfelt - posts do so in the expectation of receiving approval and approbation - this is a site dedicated to the discussion of things Apple after all - and react with annoyance when their display of devotion and emotion for a gifted, brilliant, if quite horrible human being is called into question.

    Actually, I will question the capacity for impartial judgement in any one who describes the late Mr Jobs - a man who was genius and jerk both - as "Steve"; and yes, weeping at the death of such a man.....well, it does strike me as an excessive display of emotion.

    Now, I joined this site because I had bought an Apple computer; I still like the products it makes - quite a bit - but am supremely indifferent to the company and am completely agnostic about its founder.
     
  20. petvas thread starter macrumors 601

    petvas

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2006
    Location:
    Mannheim, Germany
    #20
    You are certainly right that I am emotional. I love computers. They are my hobby and profession at the same time. I bought into the vision of a charismatic personality and I am disappointed by the new Apple. I want to be using technologies that I believe them to have a good future, or/and the company that creates these technologies shows a vision I can understand and like at the same time. I am not an average user, and I understand that normal consumers do not have (or shouldn't have) any emotions whatsoever towards technology companies. I am different. I am at least a power user and I also work in technology as a Microsoft professional. I abandoned Microsoft when I saw that their direction was not the correct one.
    I am now doing the same because of the same reasons.

    Yes, when Steve Jobs died I was deeply sad and cried. I have no problem admitting that. That does not mean that my decision to join Apple at the first place was an emotional one. It was based on my view on technology at that time.
    Now I believe that Apple is on a path I cannot identify with, so I am leaving Apple.

    Many people do not need to identify with a computer company. I understand that. For me, as someone that is using technology not only as a tool, but sees it as a hobby, it is different.
     
  21. yaxomoxay macrumors 68020

    yaxomoxay

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    Location:
    Texas
    #21
    I was sad when Jobs died. It was not personal, I simply think that the world has lost a great innovator and technology is going to feel it. But as he himself said, life moves on.
    You quote the 'new Apple', of which I am highly critical, in a way that leads to believe that you forgot Jobs' failures. Have you read, for example, "Becoming Steve Jobs"? (@Scepticalscribe have you read it by any chance?). While everyone points the fingers at Sculley and Markkula, the 1980's Apple failed also because of Steve Jobs. And NeXT? What a miserable failure. Yet, the genius of Mr. Jobs is in his relentless quest for the perfect product. Curiously enough - even for himself - he found it not in computing but in Pixar.
    I am too considering switching back to Microsoft (and consider that my first Mac was in 1984 when I was 4, and an Apple II and Apple III also came by my house), mainly because Apple's future in the desktop/laptop market doesn't seem too bright. I would never write a 200 line long post. It's a one liner at most: "Apple sucks right now, switching to Win/Linux/Commodore/Whatever".
     
  22. Scepticalscribe Contributor

    Scepticalscribe

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    #22
    No, I haven't, read "Becoming Steve Jobs", @yaxomoxay; the only biography of Steve Jobs I have read is the one written by Walter Isaacson.
     
  23. yaxomoxay macrumors 68020

    yaxomoxay

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    Texas
    #23
    Isaacson's was fine, but it shed no light on Jobs. Becoming Steve Jobs is a great bio, I strongly suggest that you read it. It is "endorsed" by most of Apple exec which is strange because it's absolutely not apologetic. Actually at times it's quite the opposite; it does not hide all of Jobs' failures which are more than I thought.
    (it is focused mostly on the time between his departure and his return to Apple.)
     
  24. Scepticalscribe Contributor

    Scepticalscribe

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    #24
    Thanks for the recommendation, and I'll note it.

    However, this will not be a priority unless I happen to trip over the book somewhere. In other words, it will not be a book I plan to order anytime in the near future, because I have quite a number of other books I want to read first.
     
  25. yaxomoxay macrumors 68020

    yaxomoxay

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    Texas
    #25
    Trust me, I know this kind of problems...

    (any good book on the cold war?)
     

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