The Coming Sectarian War in the United States

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by vrDrew, Nov 11, 2016.

  1. vrDrew macrumors 65816

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    #1
    When you look at the chaos and horrific bloodshed in the Middle East, much of it is the result of a fundamental sectarian divide between Sunnis and Shias.

    To the outsider this seems absurd. They are all Muslims, followers of the Prophet Mohammed. Their differences are over historical trivilities that seem irrelevant in the 21st century.

    But then we should consider the 600 years of sectarian strife that bedeviled Europe. The horrors of the 30 Years War. The massacres and purges that led French Huguenots to flee. The bloody battles between Protestant and Catholic in the Elizabethan Era - which led, by the way, to the emigration of the Pilgrims and the ancestors of the Founding Fathers to this country.

    In the past fifteen to twenty years I have seen this country descend into a split that is beyond simple partisanship, and into something much deeper and darker. We no longer think of ourselves as Americans first, who might have different opinions on things like taxes or trade policy. We now think of ourselves as being fundamentally Republican or Democrat. Conservative or Liberal. Red or Blue. In the words of James Fallows:

    President Obama made a concerted effort to include Republicans in his Cabinet appointments. Ray LaHood at Transportation, Robert Gates and later Chuck Hegel at Defense. And many more in lesser roles. In perhaps the bitterest irony, Obama appointed James Comey to head up the FBI.

    Do we see any hints of bipartisanship from President-Elect Trump? Nothing official, but rumors about putting a climate-change denier in charge of the EPA, and considering Sarah Palin for anything speak otherwise. It's certainly not too late, but a Cabinet made up of 100% right-wing zealots is going to send a very dark message indeed. Making things even worse (if that were possible) is Representative Trey Gowdy's vow to continue the investigation of Hillary Clinton.

    If Hillary Clinton is prosecuted, it will be the first shot in the Second American Civil War. One this country may not survive.
     
  2. smallcoffee macrumors 6502a

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    #2
    There won't be a civil war or anything like it. Stop the hyperbole.
     
  3. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #3
    there's already rioting. And there will be violence when the trump fans realise he's betrayed them.

    That is unless Trump is really going to start fixing the rust belt. Which I doubt.
     
  4. vrDrew thread starter macrumors 65816

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    Do you deny the absurd partisanship of the Republicans in Congress over the past eight years? The unprecedented refusal of the Senate to even hold hearings on Obama's Supreme Court appointment? The vow to prosecute a losing Presidential candidate?

    That has simply never before happened in American politics.

    I read some of the revolting comments on this forum and elsewhere. The spiteful, hateful, rhetoric. The demonizations immigrants, of Muslims, of liberals.

    Where do you think that is going to end up? Especially if we do not have a President who feels any obligation whatsoever to reach out to the half of the country that did not vote for him?
     
  5. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #5
    To be fair I'm not sure how much better a weak Hilary victory would be.
     
  6. smallcoffee macrumors 6502a

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    Well I don't have a problem with the senate choice. Why would they let Obama appoint somebody that would be idiotic for them.

    I can't believe you people fall for this kind of stuff.

    The same people who are much more likely to revolt, ya know, those with guns or whatever who hated Obama didn't do crap about it. Nobody else will. Calm down.
     
  7. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #7
    This sums up the problem.
     
  8. smallcoffee macrumors 6502a

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    #8
    Uh what problem? Democrats would have did the exact same thing.
     
  9. aaronvan Suspended

    aaronvan

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    #9
    Sensitive snowflakes who need therapy because somebody chalked the word "Trump" on the sidewalk -vs- rugged Americans who know how to use an AR-15.

    Shortest civil war in history.
     
  10. tunerX Suspended

    tunerX

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    #10
    Everything you just said applies to democrats and president obama for the last 8 years.

    Kind of like the absurd partisanship when the democrats passed the ACA without any republican support.

    What about that time when Obama said if you want to change policies win some elections? I believe that after that statement was made the republicans took back the senate and controlled the majority of the government. What did he say after that, I think it was that he had a pen and a phone.
     
  11. smallcoffee macrumors 6502a

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    #11
    I can't believe the same people who argue that those republicans or whatever that wanted to rebel against the US would be destroyed by the US military then turn around and act like they would somehow rebel against the US and not also be destroyed.

    I'm seriously in awe at the nonsense, the rhetoric, and the mindlessness of so many people. It's just crazy.
     
  12. aaronvan Suspended

    aaronvan

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  13. vrDrew thread starter macrumors 65816

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    #13
    If you think the Second American Civil War will be fought with AR-15s you are clearly missing the point. And stop referring to people who disagree with you as "Snowflakes" - OK?

    I can't believe I'm saying this, but Glenn Beck wrote an editorial in today's New York Times, a lot of which I applaud him for saying:

    Trump, as our next President has an obligation to prove that he is capable of bringing some measure of unity and reconciliation to the United States. I'm willing to give him a chance. But if he stands by as Congress or the FBI continue the persecution of Hillary Clinton it's going to be a unprecedently bad sign. And if he selects a Cabinet made of up right-wing extremists dedicated to destroying both the environment and the social safety net, its going to make the situation worse.
     
  14. CE3 macrumors 6502a

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    #14
    Civil war or not, the fact that we're so divided will be our undoing. Life in America is already like life in a third world country for many of the poor in this nation. Empires rise and fall, and the makings of our demise are already in place.
     
  15. ForkHandles macrumors regular

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    #15
    I spotted this essay on Facebook, written by a U.K. Historian who argues that the human race have a habit of destroying themselves every 70 years.

    It makes for a very interesting read and tries to suggest that recent political decisions Russia, Brexit and Trump have led to a culture of hatred and unrest. I'm not too sure that I want to accept the conclusions he comes to but it does sound plausible.

    Link is attached as it is relevant to this thread.

    http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/11179774?
     
  16. smallcoffee macrumors 6502a

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    If he does, I'll be the first person in line to vote D or G. But until the world is ending I'm going to relax, and try to enjoy Veteran's Day.
    --- Post Merged, Nov 11, 2016 ---
    The riots are no worse than any other riots.
     
  17. vrDrew thread starter macrumors 65816

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    #17
    During the debates, Donald Trump told Hillary Clinton that "if he were President you would be in jail." Today, Representative Trey Gowdy vowed to continue the Congressional persecution of Hillary Clinton.

    Maybe Donald Trump didn't mean what he said at the debate. Maybe he said it to gin up support for himself. We all say things in the heat of the moment.

    But as the leader of our country he needs to say: The election is over. The persecution of the former Democratic candidate will serve no purpose for the Nation nor the American people. I will do everything legally in my power to make sure that does not come to pass.

    He can say it publicly if he wishes. Or he can get on the phone with Trey Gowdy today, and tell him privately to knock it off.

    If Donald Trump wishes to be a statesman, he had better start acting like one.
     
  18. zioxide macrumors 603

    zioxide

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    #18
    I wouldn't be so sure about that. If trump signs into law bills that take away people's civil rights and implements clear racist policies, you think people will just roll over and take it?
     
  19. smallcoffee macrumors 6502a

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    #19
    Actually I do, but I don't think that will happen.
     
  20. CE3 macrumors 6502a

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    #20
    Yeah, people need to stop hoping that Hillary going to jail is going to happen. Obama can pardon her, but if I were Hillary I'd tell him not to issue a pardon, just to see if the new administration wants to be stupid enough to pursue prosecution. I guarantee you Trump still has his share of skeletons in the closet and we haven't seen the last of 'em. Better play nice.
     
  21. shyam09 macrumors 68000

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    #21
    So if she committed a crime and she's getting charged legally .. that'll start a Civil War.

    *whistle*

    (Unless you're suggesting that Clinton will be charged with a false crime... in which case, I'll see it as an abuse of power and I'll be against it, even though I don't like Clinton).
     
  22. Wild-Bill macrumors 68030

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    #22
    Putting a climate change denier as head of the EPA would be a disaster. Back in February, Congress confirmed Robert Califf as head of the FDA. Califf was a big pharma lobbyist. Only five senators raised any sort of objection.

    If Trump truly wants to "drain the swamp" he needs to pick people who are not only effective at the job they are being considered for, but also who are not insiders, shills, or people who idealize and represent the opposite for which they are being considered.

    And he needs to jettison Chris Christie as soon as possible.
     
  23. CE3 macrumors 6502a

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    #23
    One things for sure, the "special snowflake" "pansies" will continue to provide a solid source of entertainment for some around here as our rights continue to be whittled away. Won't be so funny when it's time for them to get out and fight for something they believe in, though.
     
  24. vrDrew thread starter macrumors 65816

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    #24
    The worst thing that has been alleged against Hillary Clinton is that she may have allowed classified information to be sent over potentially insecure -email systems.

    Not that she deliberately passed classified information to people without security clearances (which is what got David Petraeus in trouble).

    So, yes: I am definitely saying that both Donald Trump and Trey Gowdy have actively suggested prosecuting Hillary Clinton over something that is not actually a crime.
     
  25. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #25
    Not if we exercise patience and restraint. Don't be so quick to give those up.
     

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