The Decline and Fall of the American Empire

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Merkava_4, May 1, 2011.

  1. Merkava_4, May 1, 2011
    Last edited: May 1, 2011

    Merkava_4 macrumors 6502a

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    #1
    The Decline and Fall of the American Empire - by Alfred W. McCoy


    I've read the entire article twice and found the various scenarios put forth by the author disturbing.

    I'd be interested in hearing everyone's comments on the matter. ;)
     
  2. torbjoern, May 1, 2011
    Last edited: May 1, 2011

    torbjoern macrumors 65816

    torbjoern

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    #2
    Each civilization in history usually goes through the following 4 phases:

    1. A great war
    2. A period of economic growth
    3. Decadence
    4. Fall

    The entire Western civilization has been in the 3rd phase for quite a while, don't you think?

    EDIT: Oh, and by the way - there is no reason to be disturbed by this. In the end, we are all going to die anyway, aren't we? Fix the problems you can solve and let the rest go to hell if it wishes to do so! Memento mori - and be happy! :cool:
     
  3. Merkava_4, May 1, 2011
    Last edited: May 1, 2011

    Merkava_4 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #3
    Yes I agree. What do you think the decline has been attributed to?

    EDIT: Perhaps the author has already answered my question -

     
  4. WillEH macrumors 6502a

    WillEH

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    #4
    Look at the British empire, once the most powerful empire in the world. Now I'm a second class citizen in my own country, where my government doesn't care about us, and we are laughed at by the rest of the world. Welcome to England your royal highness.
     
  5. torbjoern macrumors 65816

    torbjoern

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    #5
    1: The Big Club. You know - the big corporations and the politicians they have in their pockets, lobbying to get more for themselves and less for everybody else. They do whatever they want because people are ignorant or they don' t care (see below). I'm talking about the bank managers who pay their executives million-dollar bonuses and get the politicians to cover the red numbers with the taxpayer's money.

    2: The masses. They don't care about the Big Club because they are too busy watching cheap TV-entertainment while consuming their microwaved dinners - just a modern version of the classical "bread and circus".
     
  6. torbjoern macrumors 65816

    torbjoern

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    #6
    It's no longer your country. :(
     
  7. WillEH macrumors 6502a

    WillEH

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    #7
    Illegal immigrants are so fantastic! :mad:
     
  8. torbjoern macrumors 65816

    torbjoern

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    #8
    Innit? ;-) And the political elite is 10x worse. Stuck-up, politically correct w@nkers who only care about their future careers in international politics.
     
  9. SactoGuy18 macrumors 68020

    SactoGuy18

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    #9
    However, the USA has one gigantic advantage that other countries don't have: an unprecedented ground transportation infrastructure to move goods around on both rail and paved roads.

    This is a problem that in many ways still plague India and China--they don't have enough ground transportation infrastructure to handle large-scale economic growth, especially factories well inland unless they're right next to a major rail line. That's why in China, most of their big factories are either close to the coastline (Shenzhen, Guangzhou, Xiamen, Shanghai, Tianjin, and Dalian) or at major crossroads of rail lines (Wuhan and Chengdu).
     
  10. satcomer macrumors 603

    satcomer

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    #10
    I guess you don't live in the USA. Every thing is failing apart and the roads are WAY OVER neglected! Don't even get me started on rail systems!
     
  11. Fubar1977 macrumors 6502a

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  12. InsanelyApple macrumors 6502

    InsanelyApple

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    #12
    Here is Princeton's definition of an empire.
    [​IMG]

    Kind of looks like America is an empire, doesn't it? America has a military presence all around the world. That's like Rome who had a military presence all around the then known world. At the beginning of 2000, America was so powerful and had so much money under Bill Clinton's control, that if it wanted to, they could have taken over the whole world.
     
  13. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #13
    What on earth are you two on about? :confused:
     
  14. rdowns macrumors Penryn

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    #14
    I think they're birthers.
     
  15. skunk macrumors G4

    skunk

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    #15
    You may be right. :D
     
  16. torbjoern macrumors 65816

    torbjoern

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    #16
    It's the EU's country now. When Brussels says "jump", his government will jump.
     
  17. entatlrg macrumors 68040

    entatlrg

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    #17
    BUSH and his team of CROOKS got the ball rolling ... he blew it big time and still not enough people get that.
     
  18. SuperCachetes macrumors 6502a

    SuperCachetes

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    #18
    If your point is that the US is overdeployed and has a military presence in countries it certainly has no place being, that is well-taken.

    That said, there is a difference in "ruling" a territory (as I take the definition you quoted to mean) and simply having boots on the ground.
     
  19. takao macrumors 68040

    takao

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    #19
    that map very likely includes embassy guards as military troops ... as austria is colored and apart of getting skiing instructions US forces aren't present
     
  20. torbjoern, May 1, 2011
    Last edited: May 1, 2011

    torbjoern macrumors 65816

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    #20
    "Empire" is nothing but an ancient notion for a federation with a relatively large territory governed by a president (instead of emperor/empress). The Russian Empire is now called Russian Federation. The German Empire is called Federal Republic of Germany.

    The United States government rules at least 50 countries, so it's certainly an empire. I'm obviously talking about Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California... and another 45 countries from sea to shining sea.
     
  21. Peterkro macrumors 68020

    Peterkro

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    #21
    Austria
    1 installation, no further details

    http://www.kelebekler.com/occ/bas_gb.htm
     
  22. CalBoy macrumors 604

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    #22
    Well it's a little (dis)comforting to know that xenophobes and racists can be found anywhere...

    I find it fascinating that a lot of Europeans are frequently even more staunchly anti-immigration than Americans, and yet Europe needs it's immigrants a lot more than the US does because, well, your population growth rates are projected to be negative from here on out. If you think that empty schools, shops, and offices are really better than that funny looking brown person, then by all means continue this vitriolic rant.

    Well, no, that's not what an empire is. An empire has centralized management and absolute authority over every single jurisdiction within it's borders.

    The US has dual sovereignty; there are some powers the Federal government has that the states don't, and there are some powers the states have that the Federal government doesn't. There are also many concurrent powers in both.

    Then there's also the name "empire" itself. It implies a single sovereign that IS the government, not a republic that has it's political power diffused.


    On point to this thread, I'm always skeptical of anyone who claims that they can so accurately tell the future, especially when their grasp of world economics is so pathetic.

    Yes, we all know that China (in fact all the BRIC countries) are growing fast, but so what? All that means is that there will be more markets, more consumers, and more opportunity in the future as barriers to trade keep coming down. Eventually this will mean that wars as we know them will cease because every country will be relilant on every other country for it's economic success. You just don't blow up the guy that sells you your coffee or who buys your widgets; it would be bad for business. At that point the notion of "empire" is meaningless because trade will not be dependent on a large army to guarantee transactions.

    Then of course there's population projections to take into account. China is aging, and fast. In 30 years they will have a lot more older people and much fewer younger ones not only because each couple only has 1 child, but also because there are much fewer girls than boys. If anyone thinks that China is going to get out of that problem without any bumps and bruises, then they are sorely mistaken.

    In the end, what anyone should care about is quality of life. Unlike in empires of the past, not being #1 doesn't get you raped and decimated these days. A decline of America's share of the world pie will most likely lead to improved economic conditions for all of us, including the US.
     
  23. WillEH macrumors 6502a

    WillEH

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    #23
    Sorry, how does me not liking illegal immigrants make me racist? who says they have to be black? They can be any colour, from any part of the world..
     
  24. dukebound85 macrumors P6

    dukebound85

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    #24
    You realize he is talking about illegal immigrants...not immigrants don't you?

    I didn't see any mention of race either.
     
  25. CalBoy macrumors 604

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    #25
    You began your rant by saying that you were treated as a 2nd class citizen in your own country (which I honestly don't understand; are you being denied something that immigrants are getting???), and then followed up torbjoern's comment of "it's not your country anymore" by saying "illegal immigrants are so fantastic."

    This heavily implies an underhanded racism and xenophobia because just about the only immigrants that could be illegal in any significant numbers in the UK are going to be non-white.

    There's also an implication that your country is being taken over by some alien force, and I doubt you mean French, Norse, or German travelers when you make such veiled statements.
     

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