The junkie old folks home.

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Happybunny, Apr 11, 2012.

  1. Happybunny macrumors 68000

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    #1
  2. eawmp1 macrumors 601

    eawmp1

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    #2
    Echos of the land of the lotus eaters.

    This is the most responsible solution to a significant medical problem.
     
  3. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #3
    We should all just get high for the next 20 years and live on welfare, utopia on earth.
     
  4. MorphingDragon macrumors 603

    MorphingDragon

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    #4
    The Right just need to chill out for a minute, and smoke weed for an hour. :rolleyes:

    That would be Utopia on earth.
     
  5. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    It's ironic that we'll fill the elderly up with drugs of all types for all kinds of purposes.

    But somehow it's an outrage when the purpose is for pleasure.
     
  6. Sydde macrumors 68020

    Sydde

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    #6
    The part that jumped out at me was

    The kind of therapy that's usually administered in addiction medicine doesn't take place in Woodstock. The goals there are different, says Hollenborg: to stabilize the health of residents and provide their days with structure. This, he explains, significantly reduces drug use shortly after admission, which has been one of the valuable experiences in this experiment.​


    Placing users in a stable environment without constraints on their using causes them to use less. Make one think, perhaps we should re-examine how we handle the drug problem.
     
  7. rhett7660 macrumors G4

    rhett7660

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    #7
    It is funny you picked that out to. That is the one thing that stood out to me too. Maybe they are on to something with this form of treatment.
     
  8. /user/me macrumors 6502

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    Medically useful drugs are far less dangerous and harmful than street drugs.
     
  9. Dweez macrumors 65816

    Dweez

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    #9
    Such a true statement. I've fought this battle regarding my elderly father.
     
  10. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #10
    When someone is rolling on the taxpayer dollar I could see their outrage, I don't really give two ***** if someone wants to do drugs with their own money.

    Personal choices should have personal consequences, I don't want to fund your drug addiction because you find it pleasureful. I find driving a Lambo pleasureful, that doesn't mean the tax payers should buy me one.
     
  11. /user/me macrumors 6502

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    On the other hand, let's keep that logic and get free lambos for all!!!!!!!! LOVE IT :)
     
  12. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #12
    But you're happy to fund my Lipitor prescription because I chose to eat Big Macs because they gave me pleasure?

    So you're willing to support pleasure indirectly ... just not directly.

    Why?
     
  13. /user/me macrumors 6502

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    How is he funding your lipitor prescription? Do you have the same insurance company?
     
  14. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #14
    Big Macs are food. Heroin is a drug. I am willing to pay for your lipitor because it keeps you alive due to poor life choices, you likely aren't going to be shoving big Macs down your throat much longer if you are on meds.

    On the other hand I am not willing to buy you big Macs to feed your addiction. Go eat a salad and get on the elliptical like I do every weekday morning.

    ----------

    Even if he was, I pay taxes in Canada so I just extended his argument for the sake of it.
     
  15. Sydde macrumors 68020

    Sydde

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    #15
    Many old people like citizenzen ;) have insurance with this big, publicly-funded insurance plan called "Medicare" that everyone pays into. Of course, ZA lives in Canada for now, so his taxes fund every Canadian's health insurance.
     
  16. eawmp1 macrumors 601

    eawmp1

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    #16
    Addiction is a disease.
    Your driving a Lambo is just self-indulgent.
     
  17. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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  18. Sydde macrumors 68020

    Sydde

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    #18
    That is debatable.
     
  19. /user/me macrumors 6502

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    I do hope you realize that it doesn't say whether he lives in Canada, so your statement regarding UHC is irrelevant at best, trolling at worst. Yes Canada has UHC. You do also know that your taxes only go to your country right? This further weakens your position. Especially if he's not from Canada...
     
  20. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #20
    The argument was what we have against pleasurable drugs vs. Others. I responded with the fact that we are paying for the pleasure.

    Also find me a doctor who says we should cure drug addiction by allowing the addicted to take government money and buy as much of the drug as they can afford. That's a great plan to help people, keep them so ****ing high they have no chance for recovery and will kill off.
     
  21. mcrain macrumors 68000

    mcrain

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    #21
    You are also paying for those receiving the pleasure to be doing so in a safe environment, with available medical care, under supervision, and, oh, by the way, not robbing your house to pay for it.
     
  22. Peterkro macrumors 68020

    Peterkro

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    #22
    I'm surprised nobodies mentioned this from the article:

    It was the alcohol, not the hard drugs, that took René to the brink of death. A year ago, the doctors gave him three months to live. Liquor had destroyed his liver and his brain. Everything he said was gibberish, and his hands shook. He stayed alive as long as he did, says Hollenborg, because of the "heroin program." He was given heroin for free in return for the promise to stop drinking. He became more approachable and his speech improved, but then he started drinking again.

    Wet brain,one of more serious effects of (legal) alcohol.
     
  23. /user/me macrumors 6502

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    And your proof that he's on Medicare and not private insurance is where?
     
  24. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #24
    Do you have an issue if a person is prescribed an opiate to help them pass away more comfortably?
     
  25. VulchR macrumors 68020

    VulchR

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    #25
    The problem is not reducing drug use short term (many treatments do that), but make the reduction long term and stable in a wide variety of environments.

    As for the debate about addiction as a disease, all I can say is that addictive drugs cause massive changes in the brain, which are thought to change the flow of information through circuits that process rewards and determine foraging behaviour, and that these changes can last for months after the user stops taking drugs. Indeed in some animal models, the changes accelerate during abstinence. Thus, even if drug addiction isn't a 'disease', it is form of behavioural dysregulation that has long-term impacts on brain structure and function. It seems reasonably clear that addiction is not a simple matter of low will-power....
     

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