The mentally ill, behind bars

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by jnpy!$4g3cwk, Apr 6, 2014.

  1. jnpy!$4g3cwk macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #1
    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/07/opinion/the-mentally-ill-behind-bars.html?ref=opinion

    Interesting if true: .4 x 3 = 1.2 .6 x 1 = .6 1.2/.6 = 2. So, NYC is spending twice as much on the mentally ill, in jail, as on the non-mentally-ill. The NYC jails are actually a mental health system, but, perhaps, not a very good one.
     
  2. TechGod macrumors 68040

    TechGod

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2014
    Location:
    New Zealand
    #2
    This is rather disturbing. People that need help are simply not getting it.
     
  3. LIVEFRMNYC macrumors 604

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    #3
    Jail/Prison is somewhat like the military. Just say or do the right things, and you'll get the prescribed drugs that you want. So there is probably a flawed statistic of the truly mentally ill.
     
  4. jnpy!$4g3cwk thread starter macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #4
    Mentally ill people have trouble with "just say or do the right things". Maybe I should have quoted a little more from the article:

    Doesn't sound rational eating a packet of soap, does it? And, by the way, a real mental hospital doesn't use toxic soap, either, although I don't know how he got the soap. It is the same situation in all the big cities-- the jails have become bad mental hospitals:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/09/opinion/sunday/inside-a-mental-hospital-called-jail.html?_r=0
     
  5. Southern Dad macrumors 65816

    Southern Dad

    Joined:
    May 23, 2010
    Location:
    Georgia
    #5
    I guess it could be argued that most sane people wouldn't commit some of these crimes.
     
  6. MacNut macrumors Core

    MacNut

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Location:
    CT
    #6
    Or the sane ones know how to get away with it.
     
  7. TechGod macrumors 68040

    TechGod

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2014
    Location:
    New Zealand
    #7
    You can't plan for everything.
     
  8. MorphingDragon macrumors 603

    MorphingDragon

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2009
    Location:
    The World Inbetween
    #8
    You don't need to plan for everything.
     
  9. TechGod macrumors 68040

    TechGod

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2014
    Location:
    New Zealand
    #9
    In crimes, planning is everything.
     
  10. ElectronGuru macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2013
    Location:
    Oregon, USA
    #10
    I'm wondering what changed. They've been without real care for some time, but the % spike is rather recent. Perhaps something changed to increase arrests or non ill numbers went down at the same time. Either way, the system of last resort is overflowing and this is not way to handle things, financially or humanely.
     
  11. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2003
    #11
    Report: Jails House 10 Times More Mentally Ill Than State Hospitals


     
  12. 0007776 Suspended

    0007776

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Location:
    Somewhere
    #12
    Didn't we use to have mental hospitals that these people could be sent to for help before they ended up in prison? Why not bring those back?
     
  13. jnpy!$4g3cwk thread starter macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #13
    Yes, we did. And, the cost per bed was quite a bit lower than prison -- yes, even then people made these calculations. You can read about the history in the books of E. Fuller Torrey. The mentally-ill-in-jail angle is in this book:

    http://www.peteearley.com/books/crazy/
     
  14. pdjudd macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2007
    Location:
    Plymouth, MN
    #14
    We did, but cuts to social problems and the privatization of prisons has basically cut the availability of these systems away from most people that need it and brought the focus on being tough on crime.

    Society has apparently decided that it’s more convenient to lock people up and jail rather than treat the underlying conditions. Something that is very hard to do simply because you have to deal with patients suffering from chronic conditions and require lifelong treatments.
     
  15. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2009
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    #15
    How does this relate to the new classification of mental illness outside of jail? Seems like everyone is taking meds for something these days and its not at all hard to get yourself classified as depressed or having an anxiety disorder to get some meds.
     
  16. jnpy!$4g3cwk thread starter macrumors 65816

    jnpy!$4g3cwk

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2010
    #16
    Good question. It might affect the estimate of the percentage of of mentally ill in jail today, but, as you can see from the references, the numbers of mentally ill in jail started jumping up immediately after de-institutionalization, long before any recent changes to classifications. And, the problem in some big-city jails got terrible quite a while ago-- I posted at least one news story from the 90's.

    Some big city jails have an unusually bad problem because of a practice that has gone on for a long time (I also posted a reference on this previously) of some locales putting mentally ill criminals on the bus for a big city in another state. Mentally ill patients and inmates are easily manipulated: "Hey, you want to stay in jail here, or, go visit [San Francisco, Los Angeles, Chicago, New York, Miami?]?

    It is very easy to do, and, very hard to punish the perpetrators:

    http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2014/feb/13/federal-judge-dismisses-lawsuit-nevada-patient-dum/
     

Share This Page