The Obama Generation

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by OscarTheGrouch, May 8, 2008.

  1. OscarTheGrouch macrumors 6502

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    #1
    Some folks on another message board I am on have launched a website with the above name. It's goal is to give people a forum to come and post why Barack Obama has made them care, and to also comment on others entries. I would like to invite.. no encourage everyone here who is interested to please come pay us a visit and let us know your feelings and thoughts. We also have a facebook and myspace group.


    Mods, if this is considered spam, then please remove, no ill intent is meant here.

    Our Moment is Now
    www.theobamageneration.com
     
  2. MonksMac macrumors 6502a

    MonksMac

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    #2
    There was a story with a similar theme on NPR this afternoon about how most of the younger generation have actively chosen Obama as their candidate of choice.
     
  3. OscarTheGrouch thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #3
    This is the first election I have cared about in years. I voted GWB in 2k. I did not make that mistake twice. Obama to me signifies change that this country so desperately needs. I'm not thinking he has all the answers, but I respected the fact that he will admit when he makes a mistake. I'm not expecting overnight change, but something has to be done.
     
  4. GfPQqmcRKUvP macrumors 68040

    GfPQqmcRKUvP

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    #4
    And that change is?
     
  5. bigandy macrumors G3

    bigandy

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    #5
    Wow, people admit that kind of thing? :eek:

    ;)
     
  6. Cleverboy macrumors 65816

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    #6
    Succinctly put? Here are the aspects of change Obama represents for the country...

    • Reversing the trend in accountability and transparency in government
    • Attention and effort toward reform given to the impact of influence peddling, lobbyists, and ear-marks
    • Paradigm-shift in the perception of the historical roles minorities and the middle-class can hope to play in the stewardship of our nation (Chris Rock's joke regarding a black man never being vice-president will immediately become dated).
    • Distinct change in the perspective of the office of the President, from priviledged, corporate lawyers, long-standing political figures to a leader who has been a community organizer, civil rights lawyer, and teacher of constitutional law.
    • Active focus on the improvement of our country's efficiency through technology, whether for medical purposes or civic engagement (Obama plans to institute CTO as a cabinet level position).
    • A real focus on improving the level and universality of healthcare in our country.
    My feelings anyway.

    ~ CB
     
  7. miloblithe macrumors 68020

    miloblithe

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    #7
    I'd like to point out though that my septogenarian boss is frequently on the phone talking about how great Obama is, as are some of my 60-something coworkers, 60-something parents...
     
  8. gifford macrumors 6502

    gifford

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    #8
    Other than being gifted with words and black, i dont see what this guy has to offer.
    He talks the talk, but can he walk?

    At best, a lucky dip.

    Good luck America.
     
  9. jecapaga macrumors 601

    jecapaga

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    #9
    wow. really? you feel like the country is in a good place? scary. the change I'd like to see is more than any candidate or President can logically accomplish but you seriously think things are better than 8 years ago? What color is the sky in your world.
     
  10. Cleverboy macrumors 65816

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    #10
    It's perfectly okay not to pay attention. --And follow links... and stuff. Just don't pretend you're asking real questions or dealing with real answers. Complaining has become a national pastime. People forget what to do when the answers sit right in front of them, repeatedly present their solutions, and openly discuss their track record. Reminds me of the dwarves in Prince Caspian.

    OBAMA: BLUEPRINT FOR CHANGE
    http://www.barackobama.com/pdf/ObamaBlueprintForChange.pdf

    Nice bit of reading there.

    ~ CB
     
  11. GfPQqmcRKUvP macrumors 68040

    GfPQqmcRKUvP

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    #11
    Where did I ever say anything close to what you are alleging in your post?


    EDIT: And that BluePrint for Change is probably the most biased piece of literature I've ever read. Not saying it shouldn't be, as it is marketing material for his campaign, but it is almost ridiculous. Allowing foreign generic drugs into the US to lower prices? Is he advocating giving up the U.S. patent system for drug companies?
     
  12. solvs macrumors 603

    solvs

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    #12
    I'd say that was pretty realistic. Not expecting immediate miracles either. Just don't like where we're going now and where McCain now wants to take us. He used to stand for some things that were different, but now it's the same old same old. I don't think we should have to have that for another 4-8 years. Obama's not perfect, but if you're paying attention and really care about what he actually stands for rather than parroting that all you hear is a lot of nothing (blame the media for that, you don't hear much about anything of substance from them) some of what he plans to do isn't bad.

    I keep hearing that it's all just talk, but isn't it all just talk from all of them at this point?
     
  13. OscarTheGrouch thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #13
    A Mistake I did not make twice.
     
  14. rhett7660 macrumors G4

    rhett7660

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    #14
    This is just one of the things that bother me. Higher taxes? If you don't think it will then where do you think the money for such ideas is going to come from?

    Alot of what I just read, and yes I did read it, is what we want to hear. Sounds like a politician. Has some good ideas and some bad IMHO, but I don't think he is saying anything that hasn't been said in one form or another by any president in the last 50 years or so.
     
  15. Cleverboy macrumors 65816

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    #15
    Even saying this is "bias" is on its face idiotic. The document is outlining the type of change Obama is trying to put forward. This is the EXACT QUESTION YOU ASKED. Remember when you asked the question?
    So, I post Obama's response to that question, in detail... and you immediately criticise it as biased. It's at this point that I'll need to logically write your criticisms off as "biased" themselves, and not indicative of a genuine question over what change Obama is representing.

    --Say you don't like the change, but there was a brain-dead "boogey-man" argument floated by fear-mongers early on, going, "Oh, my...! He keeps saying CHANGE... what might he mean by that???" Come back when you're prepared to have an honest discussion.

    Due to your flawed comments to start, you'd need to not only bring up a criticism by respond to the arguments people generally launch in its defense. That would show me that you're not just wasting people's time. People already buy generics. Companies already have methods of maintaining their edge on drugs. It's called "lifecycle management". Read into it.

    ~ CB
     
  16. Mackan macrumors 65816

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    #16
    Might be a little off topic, but regarding taxes.... We have very high taxes in Sweden, where I am from. It enables the government to give free (more or less) healthcare to everyone, for example. So we hold the country together rather well, avoiding the creation of a distinctive class society.

    Point is, I don't mind a system with high taxes as long as the money goes to things that benefit everyone, and the country as a whole. This includes ensuring good quality schools and many other things.

    I know this model will never be compatible with american thinking, but at least I sense more "sense" in Obama.
     
  17. Cleverboy macrumors 65816

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    #17
    Your comments are kind of vapid. Yes, politicians sound like politicans because they make promises. Shocker. I remember when the Coburn-Obama Transparency Act passed. I was surprised that such an effort had been made to open up the government and air things out to the light of day. One of the things Obama has been consistant on, is that GREATER transparency (as a principle) helps the electorate engage with the elected, hold them responsible, and promotes civic engagement... a vital aspect of a healthy democracy.

    When citizens aren't engaged... when politicians imply that they'll handle all the heavy-lifting, and promote top-down instead of "bottom-up" politics... we get a disaffected public, rampant corruption, and tyrany of special interests that do not represent the best interests of the country in the long-term (evident by the housing crisis, etc). This is NOT the same policies being held by other politicians currently running their campaigns. It's closest to McCain, but much more closer to Edwards... which is why he was so appreciated.

    Last 50 years? Maybe you don't get out much, but we've just had 8 YEARS of the most secretive, dysfunctional, and tyrannical government America has had for a long time. The Patriot Act, Suspension of Habeus Corpus, Valerie Plame, Warrantless Wiretaps, Tax Cuts for the Wealthy, Black Water and Our Contractor Military, Haliburton and the Bloat of No-Bid Contracts, Gitmo, Katrina and the Incompetance of FEMA, Perilously Lax Energy Policy, Disregard for the Environment... The War in Iraq.

    So, the CHANGE we are seeking... is from the current administration, and Obama's policies best represent the direction that makes the most rational sense, suggest lasting impact on governmental accountability... AND... speaks to HOW to accomplish that vision of a better, more prosperous America by engaging in a constructive dialog that reaches across the aisle and encourages non-partisan prioritization of solutions for the greater good of the nation.

    Every time Hillary says that you put a car in "D" to move forward and "R" to reverse, I bristle. When she says "lobbyists" are just representing normal people, I gag. As McCain inevitably slides down the same slope of compromises, its truly disturbing to think that voters aren't smart enough to recognize a "good shot" like Obama when they see it.

    Everything about Obama's history as a civil rights lawyer, senior lecturer on constitutional law, and community organizer points to his concern over the public welfare, deep understanding of our government, and ability to mobilize a population for a higher purpose. That's HUGELY important to have in a leader, isn't it?

    ISN'T IT?

    The money he has now is in large part due to grammy award winning books he himself wrote on his life experiences and thoughts on government. There's irony there.

    ~ CB
     
  18. rhett7660 macrumors G4

    rhett7660

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    #18
    No I actually get out alot. What I read is the same political spew that has been thrown out over the years. I am sorry I didn't mention the current administration nor did I say I agree with it. I mearly commented on the same ole song and dance that is being said by a someone who is running for office. Of course what he is saying is going to sound better then what we are currently having to deal with. Good lord.

    Why are my comments "vapid". Because I read something and it sounds like the same thing I have heard before from someone who is running for public office? Exactly shocker. :rolleyes:
     
  19. Cleverboy macrumors 65816

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    #19
    Mm. For a lot of people, their positive reception of his message is very MUCH a response to what we've had to deal with. For others looking at the nomination process, like myself, and theoretically YOURself... we're actually paying attention to the details and voting accordingly. Those two reactions aren't even mutually exclusive. The reason WHY I'm reaction to your cynicism, is because your words do not read like a merit-worthy critique, but a sedative, meant to tear down the meaning and relevance of accountability.

    Like Clinton has posited... the election is like a job interview. Each candidate is airing their resume, demonstrating their skills, showing their portfolio of accomplishments and putting forth their proposals for how they would approach the job.

    You're waving your hand hazily over everything and saying none of it really matters. If you were hiring for your own project, I wouldn't care about the disinterest you have in the hiring process... unfortunately/fortunately, we're connected at the hip. So, if I see things that I think make one hiring candidate better... and makes me excited to see what type of administration they would steward, I'm going to get a little annoyed by anyone not even interested in acting like the hiring criteria I'm appreciating matters. Criticize it logically. Systematically. Bring up solid arguments. Test the premises. Just don't say it doesn't matter simply out of desensitization to the political process. Why even vote?

    Vapid. "Lacking liveliness, animation, or interest; dull." The reason I think your comments sound "lifeless" is likely because you're talking about something you don't really feel inspired or passionate about, and in fact, judging from your comments, represents something you've built up a pervasive cynicism about. You are disengaged and convinced that nothing makes a difference. Your words mark you as the epitome of how a government breaks down and ultimate fails its purpose.

    Your perspective isn't really an insult to ME or to the candidate I prefer. Your perspective is an indictment of the possibility of democracy, and if shared by the majority of our population... would to me, mark the irrevocable damnation of the American experiment. It might sound overly dramatic, but honestly speaking... we are on the precipice of MAJOR, very REAL screwage right now if we can't pull together and improve our country. The slide didn't even start with the current administration, it was just hastened by it.

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/calmar/2235223387/

    Here in Massachusetts, we're dealing with a legacy of leaders who believed so much in the politics of creating "smaller government" that we're paying through the nose for an endless march of expensive consultants due to the erosion of government employed professionals. McCain is promising the SAME false argument of "smaller government" and juggling the books to make it look like we're saving money, when we're bleeding even worse than before. It's TRAGIC. Gas taxes and tax cuts for the wealthy. Meanwhile, the country eats it young and rots from the inside out.

    ~ CB
     
  20. jecapaga macrumors 601

    jecapaga

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  21. OscarTheGrouch thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #21
    I like the word vapid. I have nothing else to add right now
    [​IMG]
     
  22. rhett7660 macrumors G4

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    #22
    I can agree with that....


    So let me get this straight. The person in questions says something that has been said in the past and have seen it said time and time again. Maybe not word for word. Yet, since this one person says, giving the time we are talking about, I am supposed to throw away/put aside what I have learned and seen and call this "gospel"?

    Never said that..... Did not say that at all.

    Why wouldn't I vote?

    When did I say I wasn't interested in hiring criteria? Please find me a quote?

    So you are gettinng all this because I wasn't impressed with what he was saying? Because I have heard it before?
     
  23. leekohler macrumors G5

    leekohler

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    #23
    No- you're supposed to do research and find out what a candidate is all about. If you're only going to listen to media soundbites, then of course it all sounds the same. Now- go do some reading. If you have the energy to post, you have the energy to educate yourself.

    http://obama.senate.gov/
     
  24. Cleverboy macrumors 65816

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    #24
    There's a problem here. I'm interpreting what you've said and characterizing it. The characterization is the conclusion I've drawn, and you disagree with that conclusion. Here is your original quote.
    Here are my annotations, and I could be wrong, but here goes...
    Collectively, your words then read to me as:
    So, some number of pages of reading, and you have nothing specific to critique and a handful of vague assumptions. If you were interested in hiring criteria, you'd point out what you need more information on, and note what you've already seen, and ask if someone knows where you can find this missing information if its been made available (or criticize a candidate for ducking a question). It doesn't sound like that's your concern though. This comes across to me as: "You're waving your hand hazily over everything and saying none of it really matters."

    ~ CB
     
  25. rhett7660 macrumors G4

    rhett7660

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    #25
    I am sorry.. but this all started with my comments on this document:

    http://www.barackobama.com/pdf/ObamaBlueprintForChange.pdf

    This document alone........... nothing else. My comments were on this..

    Please, I have done my fair share of research... I have educated myself thank you very much. I was commented on the above....... Does this make sense. To me the above sounds like the same ole crap that has been coming out of polititions mouths for awhile.

    I am sorry, but isn't the document I was referencing to put out by his campaign? If it isn't then by all means I stand corrected. But if it is, then I will once again make the comment this sounds like the same ole stuff that has been said before.


    Bingo.. Now tell me where I have said that I don't like him? I was mearly commenting on this document does this make sense?? Really does it?

    I have yet to say I don't like him, I don't like his speaches, etc.... I was mearly making a comment on this document.. and it's possible impact on raising taxes. That is it. I will not disagree with my take on politics but for crying out loud.... this was all over a document his group put out that sounds like the same ole song and dance to me. That is it no more no less.

    I guess you missed the IMHO mark? One cannot have an opinion? Or do I need to put down a freaking quote for every opinion one has? Having life experiences are not good enough? I am asking, because that seems to be the thinking around here.
     

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