Trump compares US southern border to DMZ

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Rogifan, Mar 29, 2018.

  1. Rogifan macrumors Core

    Rogifan

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    #1
    So I guess he’s suggesting we have troops permanently stationed at the southern border? This guy is a complete moron. Scary that he’s POTUS.

     
  2. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    #2
    Trump still doesn't—and never will—understand that the U.S.-Mexico border is a commercial and social interface where dozens of towns and some cities bump right up against the border line, and that up until the last 30 years, the border was mostly a four-strand barbed-wire fence marked by concrete and marble monuments.
     
  3. Lloydbm41 Suspended

    Lloydbm41

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    #3
    Trump still doesn't - and never will - understand the constitution, how our government works, English grammar, foreign policy, NATO, and so on. I'd do a list, but there isn't enough time or space in this forum to post up just how much of a moron Trump really is.
     
  4. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #4
    Secure fence act of 2006, ask Hillary Schumer and Obama.
     
  5. hulugu, Mar 29, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2018

    hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    #5
    The Secure Fence Act resulted in 613 miles of fencing along the U.S.-Mexico border, mostly steel "bollard" fencing though in a few areas the Act resulted in "double-layer" fencing, all at a cost of upward of $50 billion. Additionally, a review by the CRS noted that in many ways, the fencing just shifted traffic in the "ballon effect" resulting in marginal benefit for the cost.

    The Act also led to the expensive boondoggle known as SBINet, which burned through more than $1 billion before it was scrapped under the Obama administration.

    Of course, we were talking about a DMZ versus the current border, and as someone who has seen the DMZ in Korea and borders in Israel, Morocco, and the United States, I can tell you that they are vastly different.

    And, I would note that Clinton, Schumer, and Obama were wrong to vote for the act. Unlike the strict partisans who will bend over backwards for their team, I don't have a problem noting that the Clintons screwed up the immigration system with their disastrous 1996 law, and that Obama was too eager to look tough on immigration which allowed ICE to ramp up the deportation machine that Trump is using.

    I disagree with my party, but I disagree more with the racist dingbats that occupy the GOP, including King and Goodlatte, and notable putzes like Mittens.
     
  6. ViperDesign macrumors 6502a

    ViperDesign

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    #6
    The fence/wall isn't going to stop drugs, it isn't going to stop illegal immigration. Want to stop illegal immigration, don't allow planes to fly in here from foreign countries and don't allow cars to come in as well.
     
  7. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    #7
    It's worth noting that according to U.S. CBP in FY2018 17,575 unaccompanied minors and 31,112 people in family units were apprehended, nearly all of them by turning themselves in to U.S. officials as part of the asylum process. Most of these people are from three Central American countries, and if we had a rational system, these people would be in State Dept. care.

    Also, in 2016, CBP apprehended 415,816 people, including 408,870 people along the SW border. This is dramatically lower than the 1,189,075 arrested by the agency in 2005. In 2012, CBP apprehended 365,000 people, the lowest number ever and now we're heading to apprehension numbers akin to the late-70s.

    Spending billions won't solve the first problem—they're just going to shift to ports guys—and it's worth considering how apprehensions have dropped, but the price of drugs like cocaine, heroin, meth and marijuana remain steady.

    Border infrastructure like walls doesn't really work.
     
  8. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

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    #8
    Agreed, let's fine businesses $50k per illegal hired.
     
  9. Eraserhead macrumors G4

    Eraserhead

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    #9
    Depends on the odds of getting caught. That might not be enough.

    But on the other hand you might well also destroy a business that inadvertently didn’t check ID carefully enough.
     
  10. VulchR macrumors 68020

    VulchR

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    #10
    You forgot boats. Remember the various waves (Vietnam, Cuba, North Africa, ME,...) of people migrating illegally called 'boat people'? If the wall is effective, we'll see groups of people from sinking ramshackle boats drowning in the Gulf of Mexico and in the Pacific Ocean, just like Europe has seen in the Med. :(
     
  11. blackfox macrumors 65816

    blackfox

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    #11
    so Trump doesn't understand (a) the Mexican Border, and (b) what a DMZ is. Sounds about right..
     
  12. TonyC28 macrumors 65816

    TonyC28

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    #12
    So what is the solution for the US southern border?
    --- Post Merged, Mar 30, 2018 ---
    Instead of a wall, what if the United States built a massive immigration facility on the US/Mexico border. And anyone from Mexico can arrive at this facility and within four hours (just throwing out a number) they can become a provisional citizen of the United States. It would be a fast track for immigration. At this facility they could be issued an I.D and some form of tax I.D or social security number. At least that way we could/would know the people coming into the country. We can all debate the solutions, but couldn't we all agree that people walking into the United States unchecked is a potential problem?
     
  13. VulchR macrumors 68020

    VulchR

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    Not sure TBH. I do not oppose greater security along the land border, but I do not think that will be best achieved by a physical wall. I think perhaps drone patrols, electronic surveillance, etc. might be a better way to go. Moreover, I think we need to work with Mexico and other relevant countries in Central America to find a better way of minimising human trafficking. That might entail more easily available work visas in the US, but in any case the US seems like a far less desirable destination that it once was.
     
  14. darksithpro macrumors 6502a

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    #14

    If this is true, then why do the Isrealis build walls and fences around Palestinians?
     
  15. LizKat macrumors 601

    LizKat

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    #15
    The relationship between the two pairs of entities is not at all comparable.

    Anyway to my mind we shoudn't be trying to stop immigration anyway. We should be exporing how to do more supply chain swaps like we already have in vegetable, fruit and meat production segments, to take advantage of labor available on the Mexican side, and pay that labor more fairly. We need also to import labor for jobs that are even now hard to fill and will be come harder to fill as the rest of the boomers age out (yard work, cooks and drivers, specialized ag harvest where machines can't get it right yet, personal shoppers, home health care aides, geriatric care nursing etc),and we need better education for better jobs for everyone in future.

    Making an existing wall more robust isn't addressing any of those issues either, never mind that it doesn't do anything about the demand side of the illicit drugs equation in the USA.
     
  16. Lloydbm41 Suspended

    Lloydbm41

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    #16
    Well, machine guns, drones with rockets, artillery and Army posted along the wall in Isreal makes a big difference to ours. The other difference is, their wall is much smaller, easier to maintain and cheaper.

    Compare apples to apples, not apples to oranges.
     
  17. Solomani macrumors 68040

    Solomani

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    #17
    But he managed to outsmart and exploit his voters, so clearly he's still smarter than some people!
     
  18. ViperDesign macrumors 6502a

    ViperDesign

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    #18
    It's called,con-man
     
  19. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    #19
    Really, we don't need a facility, CBP already handles visas. Really, the important point would be to allow people to come into the country through legal means, and then apply to stay through U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services.

    If Mexican citizens weren't part of the quota system, along with Central Americans, more would apply. Especially if they thought that doing so was relatively cheap, easy, and not going to get them deported.

    But, I think the thinking.

    ICE should focus on Customs Enforcement.
     
  20. darksithpro macrumors 6502a

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    Yes it is. Absolutely it is. I'll tell you why... The Israeli-Palestinian conflict has been going on for quite some time. The anti-Trumpsters argue a wall is a waste of money and will not prevent illegal border crossings and contraband smuggling, however the wall will make it much more difficult and time consuming, which is why the Israelis built the walls. Nothing is full proof, but a wall is an extra layer of security/protection. Granted it will not protect against a dedicated adversary, but just like car alarms, if someone wants your car bad enough and they have the skills and resources, they're going to get it. So why have car alarms, because they protect against the common thief that doesn't have the resources, or the know how to steal it. Layered security is the key here.
    --- Post Merged, Mar 31, 2018 ---

    We could do the same, minus the rockets and the artillery.
     
  21. blackfox macrumors 65816

    blackfox

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    #21
    Remind me how bad the Mexican border is exactly? This is talking about a solution in search of a problem. It's well-documented that most illegal immigrants here use a plane to get here, and contraband transit is so well-funded that anything less than a forcefield can be overcome. Yet, feel free to waste Billions of dollars that could go to schools or infrastructure or almost anything that would actually be useful.
     
  22. DearthnVader macrumors 6502a

    DearthnVader

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    #22
    At what point does a wall to keep people out, become a wall to keep us in?
     
  23. Solomani macrumors 68040

    Solomani

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  24. SoyCapitanSoyCapitan macrumors 601

    SoyCapitanSoyCapitan

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    #24
    Troops should be permanently stationed around his desk to turn his brain into a DMZ.
     
  25. Bug-Creator macrumors 6502

    Bug-Creator

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    #25
    The only way such a wall would actually is if your prepared to kill anybody trying to cross AND have the ability to do so.

    East Germany tried (albeit for people trying to leave) and got bankrupted along the way.
    Israel would face the same consequence the day US aid would stop.

    But there is plus side in all of this, every ct the US military spends guarding that wall is a ct they cant spend f###ing up the rest of the world.
     

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