Trump going it alone

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by jpietrzak8, Jan 30, 2017.

  1. jpietrzak8 macrumors 65816

    jpietrzak8

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    #1
    Well, more evidence that Trump not only believes he doesn't need to work with any other branches of government, but is explicitly trying to avoid involving anyone else (GOP or otherwise) in formulating his policies. Politico has a new article out, "Hill staffers secretly worked on Trump's immigration order":

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/trump-immigration-congress-order-234392

    From the article,

    and

    In short, Trump had House Judiciary Committee aides work on his document, but demanded that they not inform their own bosses of what they were doing. Which is, honestly, a pretty worrisome precedent. Will Trump learn that this is not proper behavior? Or will he double-down, and and continue to bypass Congressional leadership in future actions?
     
  2. yaxomoxay macrumors 68000

    yaxomoxay

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    #2
    Why would the aides accept it?
     
  3. R.Perez macrumors 6502

    R.Perez

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  4. RedOrchestra Suspended

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    #4

    So, your role is to troll around and set the bait on all new threads ... cool.
     
  5. webbuzz macrumors 65816

    webbuzz

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    #6
    He can probably squeeze that in on his avatar.
     
  6. yaxomoxay macrumors 68000

    yaxomoxay

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  7. RedOrchestra Suspended

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    #8
    You look like you could use a poster to better promote your ideals

    IMG_0920.JPG
     
  8. R.Perez macrumors 6502

    R.Perez

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    #9

    How many red flags does it take?
    --- Post Merged, Jan 30, 2017 ---
    IMG_1919.JPG
     
  9. yaxomoxay macrumors 68000

    yaxomoxay

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    #10
    87.
     
  10. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #11
  11. samcraig macrumors P6

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    #12
    Masked Hillary deflection noted ;)
     
  12. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #13
    Worked for.her And we know it's legal because no reasonable prosecuter.......
    --- Post Merged, Jan 30, 2017 ---
    Is the EO not "paper trail" ???? That site you linked wants me to subscribe
     
  13. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #14
    The OP brings up an excellent point. Why isn't trump working with a congress controlled in both houses by Republicans? Why is he instead issuing a record number of poorly thought out executive orders, some of which clearly exceed his authority? And why have so few conservative PRSI members disagreed with these excesses?

    Again, trump is obviously an insane and out-of-control person.

    Why are so many members still supporting his actions?
     
  14. yaxomoxay macrumors 68000

    yaxomoxay

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    #15
    Foreign Policy is actually a pretty decent magazine, however Foreign Affairs is much better.
    --- Post Merged, Jan 30, 2017 ---
    Politically he can't. He is a populist (even if you interpret it in a non derogatory way), therefore he needs to be as speedy and as strong as possible. He can't wait. I expect him to chill out in a couple of months.
     
  15. samcraig macrumors P6

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    #16
    you should be able to get past the overlay. I was able to.
     
  16. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #17
    Empty words from a guy who stayed silent while obsna did as he pleased, if only you held yourself to the standards you wish to hold others too:rolleyes:
    --- Post Merged, Jan 30, 2017 ---
    Is it a wall?? I can get over those rather easy :D

    Still don't see what is there to hide when cheeto hitler is giving out EOs like they are candy
     
  17. LizKat macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #18
  18. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #19
    Politically he can't work with a Republican controlled congress?

    That doesn't make any sense at all.
     
  19. yaxomoxay macrumors 68000

    yaxomoxay

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    #20
    Not now in the way you are asking to. His base would destroy him. He needs to show that he's different, and he needs to show that Ryan & co. are begging him for a deal. I bet that the SCOTUS nomination will be the first step to the winding down.
     
  20. LizKat macrumors 68040

    LizKat

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    #21
    Plenty of what Obama did, he would have taken flak from the GOP for not doing, if he hadn't done it. Stuff he did do, he often took flak from his own side for doing after the GOP got done telling him he didn't do enough. And, the other way around. And then there were the allies. And the adversaries. And the kibitzers. Its a wonder he didn't go home and kick the dogs at day end.

    That in a nutshell is what the presidency is often about. Making unpopular decisions. Sometimes his party flays him and sometimes it's the other side of the aisle. We watch this with every president but we usually only complain when it's not the guy we voted for seeming to get a pass.

    None of them gets a pass. That's what the press is for. They write it all down, we read what we want to read (Is my guy getting good press? No? Fake News!) and draw our own conclusions. It's par for the course and has been my whole lifetime of political awareness. Yes, it's coarser today and there's no more gentlemen's agreement to keep pols' lovers a secret from the public.

    On the other hand, there's Trump. Or Bannon, whichever one you think is running the place. This guy, or team, is in office for ten days and chaos reigns in the White House. Bannon's on record for loving chaos. Trump they say has enjoyed it as well in his exec offices at work. Keep everyone guessing and striving and fighting.

    No one in the press knows how to handle these guys because it's hard to figure out who's on first or what they are doing, which appears to be the whole point if you ask me. I am not sure how long they can get away with it, or how long they need to get away with it in order for something else that they both want or need to happen, quietly gets done.

    The thing is,,,, Americans don't really go for chaos at the apex of their government. It's a little like telling us "don't worry it's always a tossup who's really running the place, you know, people leave, others show up, stuff happens, don't worry, there's no written record, nothing happened anyway, so obviously everything's copacetic, don't let that door hit you in the butt."

    Yeah. So I'm no journalist. So when people tell me stuff like that I just count the silver twice and lock the downstairs windows. But when the press sees stuff like that going down you can bank they're going to dig around and find out what the hell is really going on. I don't know how long it will take but I'm stocking up on popcorn.

    See in my mind when the Secretary of Homeland Security is being briefed on an immigration rules change WHILE THE NEW RULE IS BEING PHOTO OP SIGNED BY THE PREZ, something is rotten in the White House. He had no input to that EO, the homeland security chief. Nada.

    This BananaBannon-Trump government is irregular heading towards illegal. They need to be taken in hand. I don't know why the GOP is standing around watching this show, as fun as it might be to see it finally hit the shoals of the Constitution and implode on the steps of the Supreme Court. We don't know what all is going on, obviously. What we do see going on looks like sideshows to me. The traditional arm of the GOP needs to wake up and start filing amicus briefs with the ACLU before the party is completely discredited.
     
  21. jpietrzak8 thread starter macrumors 65816

    jpietrzak8

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    #22
    I would agree that, at least in recent history, all American presidents have been pushed to get as much done as humanly possible in their first few months in office, as their political capital tends to evaporate fairly quickly after that.

    But I don't see being a populist as having any effect on that. The keys to a successful populist reign is in keeping your supporters happy (generally by feeding them red meat frequently), and using that base as a bludgeon to force your policies through the government. As such, the successful populist will slowly pick up steam as their reign progresses, not chill out. In fact, they generally have to find more and greater red meat continuously, to keep their followers happy.

    I don't see how Trump's current behavior really helps his populist support. He's got the showmanship down pat (with photo-ops of him signing big, leather-bound folios), but the pacing is all wrong. He should be doing one big EO a week, not one a day; he steps all over his own message this way. And the chaos he is generating is also getting in his own way.

    Perhaps Trump has some other idea in mind for how he intends to reign. But my guess is that he's just not experienced enough with political office. He's got quite a learning curve that he still needs to climb to have a successful term as president...
     
  22. citizenzen macrumors 65816

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    #23
    If he were the leader he pretends to be, he could influence congress to move in the direction his base desires, thus making him even more beloved to you ... er ... I mean ... his base.
     
  23. yaxomoxay macrumors 68000

    yaxomoxay

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    #24
    You might be absolutely right, a lot will depends on his longer term goals and what he really wants to accomplish. If this is all he got, then he's up for a rude awakening by his own base.
    I think that Trump's main problem is that of legitimacy, more so than any other president in recent history. Of course we always had a "not my president" group, but the climate of the elections and the rise of social media make this a much more difficult game. If you think about it, from now on every country will have what the Arab spring was, just with different proportions. This problem is unprecedented, and I think that's one of the main reasons Trump is focusing on BS stuff like the inauguration attendance (honestly, who cares?!?). I think that he's seriously afraid of losing his base, and with it the main pillar of his legitimacy. I also admired how the White House Press Office made Spicer and not Trump the story. A good 25% of the discussions are about... the spokesperson! It is obviously a deflection that can't hold for long, but it helps in connecting the dots.
    I am very curious to see what will happen with the SCOTUS nominee, I think that it will be the first real test of th Presidency.
     
  24. Mac'nCheese macrumors 68030

    Mac'nCheese

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    #25
    Love how people compare trump doing this to Obama. As if Obama had a choice. He had a congress that refused to work with him. But trump has total control of the congress and says he is the great uniter who will bring this country together. Can't even work with his own party.
     

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