Trumpcare, aka "As the Obamacare Turns"

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by PracticalMac, Jan 4, 2017.

  1. PracticalMac, Jan 4, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2017

    PracticalMac macrumors 68030


    Jan 22, 2009
    Houston, TX
    After the failed attempt to move the OCE under more direct Republican control, on day 2 House Republicans talk about repealing ACA, aka Obamacare.

    Except, like the past 6 years, they don't seem to have a plan.
    (not surprising since they never offered a viable alternative to ACA in that time either).

    Since they don't have the votes for outright appeal (Dem Filibuster), they plan to simply de-fund ACA, let the system go bankrupt and collapse (and whatever else connected to it). Their plan now is kill ASA ASAP, figure out a replacement later.
    Also this research pointing out that with caveats ACA is looked on favorably.

    Trump is no dummy and he tweeted warnings to his rowdy kids to be careful, that there are parts of ACA he wants, and that he will end up being in position to have is name on the new ACA2, aka Trumpcare.

    I have a feeling this will be far more messy than the creation of the ACA back in 2009-10, thus be more like a Soap Opera than good governance.

    What you think will happen first,
    Repeal of ACA (de-funding or outright repeal) with no transition?
    Replacement created with phase in?
    or (as lowendlinux pointed out)
    ACA has minor changes and continues on.
  2. lowendlinux Contributor


    Sep 24, 2014
    North Country (way upstate NY)
    Neither it'll be tweaked and hang on for about another decade.
  3. PracticalMac thread starter macrumors 68030


    Jan 22, 2009
    Houston, TX
  4. rjohnstone macrumors 68040


    Dec 28, 2007
    PHX, AZ.
    ^^ This.
    They will never fully undo it as there are some good parts worth keeping (preexisting condition, no lifetime caps, etc.)
    The feds need to remove the mandate (forcing someone to buy a product or pay a penalty is ridiculous).
    They also need to allow consumers to shop across state lines for a better deal.
    Imagine how competitive the market would be if every state level insurer had to compete with ALL insurance providers, not just the ones in their state? That is where a true free market can work to reduce costs.
    Hell imagine the savings for say a company like Aetna that didn't have to manage different forms and processes for each state they operate in.
  5. MadeTheSwitch macrumors 6502a


    Apr 20, 2009
    Not that competitive. Why? Because you also need network providers in each state. Unless you want a situation where you live in let's say Kansas and buy an HMO plan from NY where your primary care physician is in NY state!

    There's lots of articles with other reasons too:
  6. Chew Toy McCoy macrumors regular

    Chew Toy McCoy

    May 13, 2016
    They don’t have a plan because somebody finally bought them a calculator and no matter how many numbers they mash in they can’t seem to figure out how to keep their contributors filthy rich while charging Americans less money. At least Obama did them a favor in that their contributors never have to suffer losses while they are busy never figuring out the math.
  7. rjohnstone macrumors 68040


    Dec 28, 2007
    PHX, AZ.
    I know it would require a rework of how provider networks operate and state laws being updated.
    All those articles are basing their findings on nothing changing at the state regulatory level.
    The fact that each state regulates healthcare insurance is outdated. This should be covered under federal law as Congress is the one typically regulating interstate trade.
  8. Zombie Acorn macrumors 65816

    Zombie Acorn

    Feb 2, 2009
    Toronto, Ontario
    Anyone heard the democrats new catch phrase they are forcing everyone to use? "Make America sick again" lolol
  9. citizenzen macrumors 65816

    Mar 22, 2010
    Did they force you too?

    Well played, Democrats.
  10. aaronvan Suspended


    Dec 21, 2011
    República Cascadia
    I buy homeowners insurance across state lines, I buy auto insurance across state lines, and I buy life insurance across state lines.

    Why can't I buy health insurance across state lines?
  11. chown33, Jan 5, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2017

    chown33 macrumors 604

    Aug 9, 2009
    Sailing beyond the sunset
    The different kinds of insurance work differently.

    Homeowners and auto insurance work by having an insurance adjuster (insurance company representative) negotiate with local contractors (service providers) to perform the work. Each repair is basically a separately negotiated contract regarding extent, terms, cost, schedule, etc. There may be "standardized pricing" between repair contracts, but providers might or might not be bound by blanket terms that cover all work. For example, a provider might decide not to do a specific job at a proposed price and set of terms.

    Life insurance doesn't have any "service providers". It's basically a payout at death (or disability) under the terms of the insurance contract.

    Health insurance doesn't have insurance adjusters or separate contracts. Instead, the insurance company establishes a bunch of contractual terms regarding cost for a whole bunch of different services, and defines that as "terms for a provider network". Providers decide whether to join a network (accept a blanket set of terms) or not. Providers don't negotiate separate terms for each "repair contract" (i.e. a covered person uses an in-network service provider).

    This is a greatly simplified summary.
  12. Jess13 Suspended


    Nov 3, 2013
    President Donald Trump: “We’re going to repeal it and replace it with something good.”

    Senator Rand Paul (R-KY): “You’d better.”

    Rand Paul warns Republicans not to repeal-and-delay Obamacare

    Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul is warning Republicans not to repeal Obamacare without voting in a replacement for the health care law on the same day.

    “I think it's imperative that Republicans do a replacement simultaneous to repeal,” Paul said Wednesday on MSNBC’s “Morning Joe,” cautioning that disaster in the form of insurance company bankruptcies and a “massive” bailout could follow a move to repeal the law without a new one in its place. “If they don't, Obamacare continues to unravel.”​
  13. Jess13 Suspended


    Nov 3, 2013
    You’d like this one.

  14. MacNut macrumors Core


    Jan 4, 2002
    Where did you find that meme. I want to annoy a few people on Facebook. :D
    --- Post Merged, Jan 5, 2017 ---
    Why don't we just get rid of insurance companies and actually help people.
  15. jkcerda macrumors 6502a


    Jun 10, 2013
    Criminal Mexi Midget
    about 300 million introducing O-care, just about everyone in the U.S could have had near 1 million in "credit" towards insurance instead of being taxed like we were.
  16. Jess13 Suspended


    Nov 3, 2013
    It went by my Twitter timeline, I don’t remember who tweeted it. Here is another good one, for those pro-Trump.

  17. PracticalMac thread starter macrumors 68030


    Jan 22, 2009
    Houston, TX
    There is a sound reason for everyone to have health insurance.
    • Accidents (happen even without doing risky behavior.)
    • Contagious disease (bad case of flu, cold, or things like Zika)
    • Rare illnesses afflicting young people, like cancer.

    Even a plan by Tom Price (R) imposes non-monetary penalties for not continual carrying coverage.

    Social Security is a forced savings for retirement because people are otherwise unable or unwilling to save for themselves.
    Why not a national health care plan to do same?

    The only question (which can be minimized) is are the benefits clearly better than the expense?

    PS, love what Tom Price said:
    Feels like Murica will get a repeat.
  18. DrewDaHilp1 macrumors 6502a


    Mar 29, 2009
    All Your Memes Are Belong to US
    Then how would Michelles old college buddy charge a billion dollars on a website?
  19. tshrimp, Jan 9, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2017

    tshrimp macrumors 6502


    Mar 30, 2012
    I stopped reading at the underline above. This is the most repeated/inaccurate posting by the left when it comes to healthcare. They do have a plan, and have had for many years. Do you not recall the between state competition to help lower cost that has be presented and discussed many many times by the right? A quick google search will display all you need to see the Republican plans, and this includes the one that is being looked at already this year.

    Edit: Even if you were correct, no plan is better than the ACA. Forcing all the poor people to pay for something they cannot even afford to use. Just heartless.

    Also, the Republicans now have a mess they must fix on top of it.
  20. Huntn macrumors P6


    May 5, 2008
    The Misty Mountains
    Without repealing the ACA, it sounds fundamentally immoral to be allowed to defund a standing law/program. As a standard, if it exists as a law, it should be funded. This tactic serves to undermine the democratic process, but goes hand in hand with the Bankrupt end justifies the means mentality that exists on the Right.
  21. 5684697, Jan 9, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2017
  22. PracticalMac thread starter macrumors 68030


    Jan 22, 2009
    Houston, TX
    Don't make me laugh.

    Actually, you did make me laugh in a very sarcastic LOL or lul way.

    If they truly did have a replacement it would already have passed the House and Senate, waiting for Inauguration day. After all they had 6 years to perfect one.

    Why wait?
  23. 5684697, Jan 9, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2017
  24. samcraig macrumors P6

    Jun 22, 2009
    So far it looks like they want to turn "ObamaCare" into VoucherCare

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