Trump's Loose Lips...Tells Duterte About US Nuclear Subs In Area

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by Huntn, May 24, 2017.

  1. Huntn macrumors G5

    Huntn

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  2. yg17 macrumors G5

    yg17

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    #2
    I think we now know for sure we aren't hiding aliens at Area 51, because if we were, Trump would've blabbed about it to someone.
     
  3. samcraig macrumors P6

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    #3
    Well he would have said he sent them back to their home planet. "I got rid of all the Aliens in the US"
     
  4. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

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    #4
    lmao, did he point to the water too?
    --- Post Merged, May 24, 2017 ---
    [​IMG]
     
  5. zin macrumors 6502

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    #5
    This was public knowledge four days before Trump (allegedly) said this. The ships' journeys to the region were reported by CNN [1, 2]. The New York Times continues to lose credibility in latching onto anything and everything anti-Trump. The fake news outlets are now contradicting one another.

    The only new thing we have learned from this is that a confidential telephone call between the two countries was leaked without authorisation in order to, once again, cause political damage to Trump.
     
  6. steve knight macrumors 68020

    steve knight

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    #6
    that may have caused him problems pointing the right way.
     
  7. oneMadRssn macrumors 68040

    oneMadRssn

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    #7
    Neither of those sources show that it was public knowledge. The first is about a ship, not a submarine. The second is about one submarine, and indeed contradicts your point as it says that after the sub's short stop a month ago, it was unknown where it would go next.

    But please, go on vehemently defending this imbecile of a president. He'll need your support when he will, inevitably, do something foolish again tomorrow.

    As I've said before, Trump's own leadership style is why his ship is leaking so bad. His demand for unearned absolute loyalty combined with heavy-handed punishment for any dissent, no matter how reasonable, is what causes this.

    Honestly, not even trying to be anti-Trump here, I don't understand it. As president, I would want people on my team who have views opposite mine to bounce ideas of off and to test my the strength of my own ideas on. I would also welcome anyone to challenge my ideas - it would only make them better in the long run.[/QUOTE]
     
  8. rjohnstone macrumors 68040

    rjohnstone

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    #8
    Problem is, it wasn't a secret. It is public knowledge that we sent nuclear subs to SK waters.
    They have been talking about sending them there since February.
    So the media again is making up a controversy where none exists.
     
  9. zin macrumors 6502

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    #9
    [/QUOTE]

    Um, it was on CNN. Is that not proof that the submarine's presence in the region was public knowledge? :confused:

    The first article, you are right. The second article clearly states that the submarine was in the region just four days before Trump held the call. And of course, nobody in the public would have even known there were ships there to start with (beyond the CNN article) had the leakers not gone to The New York Times.
    --- Post Merged, May 24, 2017 ---
    You're essentially saying that because you don't like your boss, you have the right to take the law into your own hands and leak confidential, sometimes highly classified, information in order to damage him.

    Furthermore, your statement just holds no weighting. Look across the Trump Administration. It is not filled with 'yes' men (and women). There are people in that administration with wildly different points of view across many issues. There are even, unfortunately, a few neocons still holding on. The imaginary world where Trump is stamping out dissent with an iron fist just doesn't exist.
     
  10. oneMadRssn macrumors 68040

    oneMadRssn

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    #10
    I did not, anywhere, say that they have the right to do it. I'm saying it will happen naturally. Culture, unlike money, flows from the top down. Trump sets the culture in his office, and the culture so far has been such that the only outlet white house staff have to air their grievances is with the media. The responsibility is at the top for that.

    Give me examples of people with different points of view across many issues. As far as I can see, so far he fires anyone that challenges him or his policies. All leaks, which you acknowledge, also point to a very stressful internal culture where people who defend Trump get his favor and people who criticize anything he does get sent to the dog house.
     
  11. jpietrzak8 macrumors 65816

    jpietrzak8

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    #11
    Er, say what? Trump, in an April 12 interview:

    “We are sending an armada, very powerful. We have submarines, very powerful, far more powerful than the aircraft carrier,” Trump told the FOX Business Network’s Maria Bartiromo.​

    http://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/2017/04/12/trump-on-north-korea-threats-are-sending-armada.html
     
  12. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #12
    LOL. It doesn't matter to these people.
     
  13. zin macrumors 6502

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    #13
    Trump's views on drugs are far different to his AG. Trump supports medical marijuana and supports state votes on recreational marijuana. Jeff Sessions, to be frank, doesn't. As far I can tell, he hasn't fired his AG.

    His advisors/subordinates are a mixture of non-interventionist (Bannon, Gorka, etc.) and interventionist (McMaster, Haley, etc.).

    The hacks (Pence, Priebus) all supported TPP when it was up for consideration in Congress. Pence has previously supported NAFTA. Yet Trump chose him as VP.

    You're just not paying attention. There are plenty of differing views there.
     
  14. Morpheo macrumors 65816

    Morpheo

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    #14
    LOL, I remember that quote... He really talks like an idiot. And he's truly clueless - claiming this "armada" of submarines is "far more powerful" than a carrier strike group...how can anyone can take this clown seriously is beyond me.
     
  15. oneMadRssn macrumors 68040

    oneMadRssn

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    #15
    You sure about that? Or was it another one of his campaign lies?

    https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-pres...t-president-donald-j-trump-signing-hr-244-law
    "Division B, section 537 provides that the Department of Justice may not use any funds to prevent implementation of medical marijuana laws by various States and territories. I will treat this provision consistently with my constitutional responsibility to take care that the laws be faithfully executed."

    Translation: I won't hesitate to go after medical marijuana dispensaries in states where it is legal.

    I think you misunderstood my point. The question isn't whether they have ideological differences, the question is whether Trump invites them to critique his own views. Is there any evidence they have ever said "no, I believe you're wrong" to Trump, or anything similar?

    Of course not everyone in the white house is a clone of Trump, despite his best efforts. But so far, I have not heard of any advisers or subordinates challenging him on anything. Plenty of stories saying how attempting to do so leads to detriment.

    Make no mistake, I am paying attention.
     
  16. jpietrzak8 macrumors 65816

    jpietrzak8

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    #16
    Oh, no, Trump's not wrong about that. Some of the older ballistic missile submarines in the fleet have been converted into cruise missile carriers, and they can carry a lot of cruise missiles:

    The U.S. has 18 Ohio-class submarines, of which 14 are Trident II SSBNs (Ship, Submersible, Ballistic, Nuclear), each capable of carrying 24 SLBMs. The first four which were all equipped with the older Trident I missiles have been converted to SSGN's each capable of carrying 154 Tomahawk guided missiles and have been further equipped to support Special Operations (SEALS). If the maximum of 154 Tomahawk missiles were loaded, one Ohio-class SSGN would carry an entire Battle Group's equivalent of cruise missiles.​

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarines_in_the_United_States_Navy#Composition_of_the_current_force

    The converted subs (SSGNs) can also deploy SEALS, as well as UAVs and UUVs. And, of course, they do still carry some nuclear warheads as well.
     
  17. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #17


    I love when people use Wikipedia as a source.

    Your quote has some misinformation.
     
  18. jpietrzak8, May 24, 2017
    Last edited: May 24, 2017

    jpietrzak8 macrumors 65816

    jpietrzak8

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    #18
    Hmm. Care to point out the misinformation?

    Some more sources. How about www.navy.mil (the official website of the United States Navy)?

    Combined, the four SSGNs represent more than half of the Submarine Force's vertical launch payload capacity with each SSGN capable of carrying up to 154 Tomahawk land-attack cruise missiles. The missiles are loaded in seven-shot Multiple-All-Up-Round Canisters (MACs) in up to 22 missile tubes. These missile tubes can also accommodate additional stowage canisters for SOF equipment, food, and other consumables to extend the submarines' ability to remain forward deployed in support of combatant commanders' tasking. The missile tubes are also able to accommodate future payloads such as new types of missiles, unmanned aerial vehicles, and unmanned undersea vehicles.

    The SSGNs have the capacity to host up to 66 SOF personnel at a time. Additional berthing was installed in the missile compartment to accommodate the added personnel, and other measures have been taken to extend the amount of time that the SOF forces can spend deployed aboard the SSGNs. The two forward most missile tubes were permanently converted to lock-out chambers that allow clandestine insertion and retrieval of SOF personnel. Each lock-out chamber can also accommodate a Dry Deck Shelter (DDS), enhancing the SSGNs' SOF capabilities​

    http://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact_display.asp?cid=4100&tid=300&ct=4
     
  19. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #19
    Nope, I do not. I'm not Hillary Clinton, I don't mishandle classified data.

    Pointing out what is incorrect could reveal things I shouldn't discuss. Furthermore, I'm shocked by how much data the NAVY puts on its site. Personally I think a lot of that data should be classified.
     
  20. hulugu macrumors 68000

    hulugu

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    #20
    This simply isn't true. The NY Times did not conflict with CNN's report, and did not focus on Trump's statement.

    Read the NY Times article, it merely mentions the submarine bit before focusing on the rest of Trump's conversation with Duterte.

    Additionally, the USS Carl Vinson is an aircraft carrier, while the USS Michigan is 1 nuclear submarine. Trump said that there were two near North Korea.

    Is this a "leak" akin to Trump's babbling to the Russians? Maybe. Was it widely known that there are 2 nuclear submarines near North Korea? And, did anyone know that they were still there nearly a month after appearing as a "show of force?"

    It's not a substantial leak as those who watch submarines for a living usually know where these boats generally are, but nonetheless, the fact that Trump said this at random is a little worrisome.

    You guys can't count. While the Daily Caller's URL says subs, it's clear from the article that only one—the USS Michigan—was deployed publicly as part of an annual training exercise with South Korea.

    It wasn't a secret, but just Trump boasting again. This time to Duterte.

    Trump said:

    Again, it's widely known that the USS Michigan was near South Korea, but Trump indicated to Duterte that we had 2 submarines there.

    Not 1 submarine. 2 submarines.

    It's a minor mistake on Trump's part. What's far more worrying is the fact that he praised Duterte, a man who has launched an illegal war against drug dealers in his country, and has boasted of illegal, extra-judicial killings himself.

    Duterte's a fascist and Trump praised him.
     
  21. samcraig macrumors P6

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    #21
    Regardless - Trump ranted and raved that he wouldn't be telling our enemies any details of what we were doing and he seems to be pretty lax this far.
     
  22. jpietrzak8 macrumors 65816

    jpietrzak8

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    #22
    Oh my, aren't we self-important. ;) I can see that you are a man with access to highly sensitive military data, who just loves to spend his free time bragging about just how much he knows on random internet chat boards.
    --- Post Merged, May 24, 2017 ---
    I should point out that in that Fox interview, Trump noted that there was one aircraft carrier in the Armada, but he used the plural term "submarines" in his statement. So, he at least implied that there was more than just the USS Michigan in the Armada...
     
  23. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #23
    Bragging? Really? I work in the industry. Not a big deal.
     
  24. jpietrzak8 macrumors 65816

    jpietrzak8

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    #24
    But you enjoy playing "20 questions" with us. ;) You're not willing to tell us sensitive information, but you are willing to tell us when we get sensitive information wrong, is that it? I guess we just have to keep throwing stuff against the wall and see what sticks, and that'll be how you tell us what sensitive information is true and what is misinformation, right?
     
  25. ibookg409 Suspended

    ibookg409

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    #25
    Sigh. I think I need another 2 week vacation.
     

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